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Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder
We should be careful not to browbeat conventional wisdom into people's heads and attribute general psychological attributes to those people. I believe in some conspiracies and not others. The are degrees of conspiracies.
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Oh I believe that there were conspiracies out there, but I believe that they never got out of the planning stages. But what conspiracy theorists don't realize is that if you go into governmental archives that are open there are plans for everything no matter how outlandish, because governments plan for every single contingency. Then those plans get in front of someone sane and their sh%t canned because they're entirely ######ed and outlandish, or just plain insane.
[QUOTE=Weiser Wonder;3267084]1. True conspiracies. There was a conspiracy of some in the Bush administration and CIA to trump up evidence to invade Iraq. That's very well-documented.[/wuoyr]
Absolutely, the whole WMD thing in front of the UN for example to create evidence was insane, and should have illustrated to Conspiracy theorists that governments are completely incapable of executing mass top secret conspiracies. I mean I will honestly say that up until that point, pre Iraq I was convinced that.
1) There had to be small stockpiles of gases or biological agents or even a baby nuclear program because they had used them before, and the Iraqi's were working awfully hard to hid something from the UN inspectors.
2) That most of the Iraqi government knew that they had no WMD but didn't want to tell Saddam that, so they put on a major drama to hide the truth from their leader because of his known temper. That is a livable conspiracy theory.
I lost belief in the WMD when I saw poor General Powell parading portable labs disguised as ice cream trucks.
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Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder
2. Some truth or unclear. Then you have the JFK conspiracy where things look very fishy but it's hard to tell one way or the other what actually happened.
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I've never bought into anything that the whole JFK thing was what it was surrounded by incredible coincidences. I don't think it was a murder plot by shadowy members of the government aided by the mob. The reason why I say that is the government couldn't even effectively kill off the bay of pigs invasion and that was in conjunction with the CIA, FBI senior branches of the government and the military, the best and errr brightest.
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Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder
3. Not true but have some reason behind them. Then there's the 9/11 type conspiracies where the motives are there but the logistics don't work.
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The logistics or the logic? The logistics clearly don't work, the plot would have to be too massive and complex to cover up, and the logic of manufacturing something that over the top would have little more effect in creating a justification for war then a couple of small but effective bombs planted in different targets.
If I was in the U.S government and wanted to manufacture a terrorist event, I could do it with far less people, kill far more people and create far more war rage by bombing a couple of NFL games. Or killing some kids with an explosion at Disney land.
In effect I could get the same war results by killing 100 people instead of 3000.
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Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder
4. Bat#### crazy, pasta strainer on head conspiracies. Finally, you have the bat#### conspiracies where neither the motives nor the logistics make any sense. Illuminati, moon landing, politicians are actually lizards etc.
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You missed the Bilderberg group or whatever its called, and you failed to attach Bush to Clinton by their supposed induction into the Skulls.
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Originally Posted by Weiser Wonder
I'd say you can factor in psychological reasoning to the last two, but that reasonable people can believe in the second and should believe in the first.
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People like conspiracies because they're far more fun then the real life theory that amazing sh%t happens in the simplest manner. Its more fun to believe that there is super villian level evil in the shadows manipulating events so that when things go bad its the big evil against the individual good.
I remember one of the coolest show evil that I've ever seen was in Angel where the apocalypse was happening and it was being pushed along by a group called the circle of the black thorn, who were the elite of the mortal and supernatural. They hid in the background and basically encouraged man's inhumanity to man.
Totally ludicris, but as fun as any conspiracy theory.