[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Shazam

Historically, the US banking system has always been riskier than Canada's by a fair amount. They don't have an oligopoly, thus there is much greater competition for people's dollars.

Again, historically, US investors have been okay with this. Consider the massive rise in bank share prices since 2008.

Yes, true, but I think the internet has really speeded this up. Everything out there, all the news feed on Google Finance et al, are all speculation articles. The stock market is a VLT these days (and I say this as an investor myself).

I think Americans are "ok with it" because they don't know any better. Fundamentally, a stock is an opportunity for the general public to own a portion of a company. i-Banks don't see it that way, they see it as reading the graphs and riding the waves and profit profit profit. But when the market crashes, turn to the bailouts then keep on chugging. I don't think thats right.

Originally Posted by Shazam

Note that this isn't the first time the gov't massively bailed out financial institutions. I suppose if we go by the logic that these bailouts precede bubbles we can go all the way back to the S&L bailouts in 1989 and then say that everything since then should vapourize any time now (I actually do hear this from time to time from old people).

Yeah, I know. I still disagree with it though.

Originally Posted by Shazam

I don't know what that means. I find it rather remarkable that Azure and even yourself find it odd that people would go towards the job that pays highest.

The real problem is that there aren't enough engineers around. We can also say that demand for high-skill people is rising. There's been more studies than I can count since the 90s that have stated that enrollment in fields such as CS and Engineering has been declining steadily.

No I don't find it odd, I understand it. I just don't like it. As I said, the biggest industry in the USA is financial - an industry that does not produce value. I remember coming out of Engineering school, a lot of us were recruited for i-Banks, and when you see the the money they throw around, its hard to pass. Some of my friends have, some of them haven't. Granted, Google/Microsoft/Facebook offers a pretty decent starting wage, but I know that a lot of Engineers are targeted by i-Banks.

As for enrollment in CS/Engg... I don't know, I haven't been following that issue at all. I know there are a lot of them here, but I work in the Silicon Valley as well.

Originally Posted by Locke

Haha! Me too! But, and I hate to throw out the catchy but tired and worn cliche, but this makes us no better than the people that got us here. We want to live this way, and so long as the change doesnt happen while we're around its all ok. The buck has to stop somewhere.

I think what Phanuthier is saying is that he believes in 'maximizing profits' for shareholders, but not by any means necessary. It is a fundamental principle in our society but it can, and has, been taken too far.

Thanked, for both paragraphs.

Hmm, well, that gets really sticky.

Lots of cocoa for instance is picked by child labour.

If he found out tomorrow that Lululemon sold clothing made by children, would he sell his stock for what he bought it for?

I find most people are just as moral as they find convenient. Usually that involves pointing fingers at other people.

Very true, I wouldn't say I'm entirely self-righteous. If you asked me would I sacrifice significant money if it meant a better life for a Bangladesh community, or if it meant stricter oversight to i-Banks to save people's life savings, I would oblige I like to have money, but I make more than I need and I'd gladly give it up to stricter laws to people's finances from themselves.