[JohnnyFlame]

No don't shop in Hong Kong. Way more expensive. In Beijing stay away from Wang Fu Jing as it's really upscale unless you really know where to hunt. Silk Alley and Lido are good for clothes but the best place to go is the Pearl Market(Hong Chau). It's right across from the Temple of Heaven which is a great place to go(a nice combo trip with a little sightseeing and shopping). Great place for shoes, camera's etc., shirts, pants and all kinds of stuff. It's a hole unless they have upgraded it since I left but just ignore that. I dont' remember exactly but around 20 kuai taxi ride from Silk Alley to the Pearl Market. Right behind it is a toy store(well first floor is) and it is an awesome place to buy games. I would go there and just buy every single gamecube and ds game they had because they were so cheap(you need a mod chip for whatever system you own as these are NOT original games).

Lido is up near the airport and if you end up staying at one of the hotels up there like the Sino Swiss it's a short cab ride from there. Otherwise if you stay downtown it's a long way to go. Tianyi market is also close to downtown and has a lot of electronics. Lido and Silk Alley are way different than they used to be--nice building and clean etc. I much preferred when they were street markets.

They will, of course, assume correctly that you are a tourist. Take whatever price they start with and offer less than a quarter of it. So if they say a T-shirt is 100 kuai then it's 20. I could regularily get them for 10 but I can speak Chinese and I was a regular and I like to bargain hard. Don't make the mistake of thinking what it costs at home-converting- and thinking hey this is a bargain.

Best way to shop there is go up to a stall. Get a price. Haggle a little. Move on. You will see the exact same item again no doubt. Offer a lower price than you haggled for the first time. Move on. By the time you reach your third one you will have a better idea of the price. Now then get ready to do battle. I have had them screaming at me as I left and my second oldest daughter was even better at just holding her ground.

Just be nice and polite but firm. Go way low with your offer and creep up. If they don't make bigtime drops in their price just walk away. You will eventually get close enough where they will follow you or grab your arm or start with buy two and I'll give you a better price. etc. Now you are in the ballgame. Say no problem I will buy two heck even three but I want a bargain price then. Calculate and actually drop your price.

There are indeed some very good bargains as long as you go to the right places and are willing to bargain.

PS : I've picked up Rolex's for as little as 25 kuai which at the time was like 5 bucks. It's hard to do on just a quick trip but if you get off the beaten track the prices go down further.

PSS: If you go to Simitai you are looking at an all day affair. You can get a car to take you up there or a little cheaper is a private minivan. I have done it for around 550 for a minivan. Add a 100 to 150 for a car. There are actually a lot of great places to see north of Beijing in Miyun. Lots of hiking spots and places to visit the wall etc.