Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan02
no kidding, the unions have negotiated themselves such fat contracts the're going to take down the companies and be left with no jobs at all.
Looking at a article from last year
Compensation of basically over 70$ a hour for what most of the jobs, is flat out ridiculous and thats why none of the American auto makers are competitive and profitable and why I feel all 3 will eventually fail no matter how many bailouts the government tosses their way. Until they get their labour costs under control(read halfish) the outlook is very bleak for them.
Alot of employees are making 3 or 4 times what they would for the same job outside the big auto maters. Simply not sustainable.
They need to let these companies fail and hope that new ones emerge without the oppressive burden of the contracts that the UAW has negotiated.
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I agree to a point but:
1) Many of the jobs they do on the autolines are not necessarily easy either, certainly not easier (nor necessarily harder) than a lot of the rig/drilling/pipeline work around Alberta that pays just as much (if not more).
2) No one is sweeping floors for $35/hr ($70/hr in your example) - that is anti-union propaganda and you sound silly just repeating it. Unions might be a bad thing, fair enough, but keep to facts. If you are going to state their wage as costs-all-in then do it for ALL employees not just union big3 guys and if you are going to assume that floor sweepers get the average big3 wage then you also need to assume that the guy cleaning up a new well site is also getting the average wage (which ironically they are more likely to be doing IMO).
4) Much of that $70 is the impact of a collapsing American healthcare system, and the automakers themselves have said as much. If the health system had been reformed 10 years ago like it should have been (and almost was) the big3 would have saved billions and billions and been able to put it right back into their companies without such a bailout.
5) Another big chunk of money was lost by the manufacturers themselves when they went and spent all of the workers own pensions. If they hadn't blown all that money building crappy cars they wouldn't now be struggling to repay it. Don't go blaming the employees for wanting to retire one day, I am sure they are not begruding you that right yourself.
6) Unions have already given back tons over the years. A HUGE reason they refuse more cuts is that they (rightfully IMO) believe that managements only idea for saving the big3 companies is to cut line workers pay. Autoworkers believe (rightfully IMO) that if management could build good cars that people wanted wages would not have to be cut -- but that would be too simple I guess?
****7) At the end of the day though it is easy to blame the people at the bottom for failure at the top isn't it?
If the people running the big3 had not been such horrible business people the last 25 year, taking their market dominance and customer loyalty for granted, no one would be in this situation.
The problem is not with wages, the problem is with the product and the management that dictates what that product should be.
Toyota, Nissan and Honda employees in North America make about the same money as big3 employees, albeit it with profit sharing instead of union mandated wages, but how have those Asian manufacturers managed to grow and grow and not shut down plants if they are not seeing huge savings on wages?
Oh yeah, because they are managed by world class leaders who are driven to meet their customers needs.
I am not a fan of unions at all but I hate crappy management getting blamed on employees even more....
Claeren.