Comments/Feedback On My Proposed New PC

[Nehkara]

I am thinking about building a new computer and I just wanted some input. This is what I am looking at ending up with:

Antec Nine Hundred Gamer Case
Mushkin 550W Modular Power Supply*
320 GB Seagate HD (SATA)*
320 GB Seagate HD (IDE)*
AMD Phenom 9600 Quad-Core Processor
MSI - K9A2 Motherboard with Quad PCI-E CrossfireX
4 GB Corsair XMS2-5400 RAM
Samsung SpeedPlus 20X DVD-Writer w/ Lightscribe (SATA)
SAPPHIRE - Radeon HD 3870 512 MB GDDR4 Video Card
Windows Vista Premium 64-bit*
Samsung Syncmaster 206BW 20" Widescreen LCD (2 ms, 3000:1)

Total cost of upgrade: $1182.60

* = Already have these parts in my current PC.

Let me know what you think.

[photon]

Any reason you're going with a Phenom? The Intel ones are far superior, and in a few months the penryn desktop processors should be out so the price on the Q6600 should drop again.

If it's for gaming and such without media encoding, you could save some $$ by going for a faster Core 2 Duo dual core as well.

I would also recommend the 8800GT over the 3870, slightly more expensive the performance gain is there.. either is good though, the 3870 performs great for the $$, both would probably be fine for most games on 1680x1050 resolution.

[Hack&Lube]

Agreed, despite the fact that I am an AMD/ATI fan and I want them to succeed and stay in business against Nvidia and most importantly Intel...I'd have to say that a Core2Duo Q6600 and an 8800GT is recommended.

BTW, AMD/ATI's new 3870X2 is coming out next week.

[psicodude]

Be careful running the IDE and SATA at the same time, unless the IDE is just for backup purposes. If your system has to read from both at the same time (say Vista is installed on the SATA and a game on the IDE) you will take a major performance hit.

Also, double check that 550W is enough power. The quad core mixed with 2 HDD's and the video card will draw a ton of juice. My guess is that you will be ok though.

[Flaming Choy]

gonna have the agree with everyone else that current intel > amd (as much as it pains me to say that)

[Buff]

I recently went with the Q6600 and a 8800GT. I can't yet tell you how it runs because it doesn't arrive until tomorrow and I won't have time to set it up until Friday. I have a thread which currently resides on the 2nd page and it shows you the specs of what I've gone with. I've stuck with 2GB of ram as I'm not going with a 64-bit processor.

I would also like to echo psicodude's comments on your HDD setup. If money is an issue and you don't notice performance problems then you are ok, but why not just go with two SATA HDDs? (I realize that you have both HDDs already, I'm merely suggesting dropping the IDE for SATA).

[Vulcan]

The new Intel Core 2 Dual e8400 @ 3.0 GHZ is now out. Seems you can over clock it to 4.0+ GHZ.
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=27784&vpn=BX80570E8400&manufacture=Intel

[photon]

If you do go with a new different HDD, the new Western Digital 750GB AAKS series is very fast, almost as fast as a Raptor in some cases, and in some real world benchmarks even faster! I got one and it's very nice. Only a 3 year warranty tho :(

I only say that because HDD speeds have really increased the past few years so it might be worth upgrading that as well to maximize the speed from your system.

[LockedOut]

I've had a computer with a different HD on IDE and SATA at the same time and have never noticed any performance hit. I've noticed more of a performance hit having 2 HD's on the same IDE channel.

[Nehkara]

I understand the sentiment about Intel/Nvidia however, I am remaining loyal. AMD/ATI will never get back to where we all want them to be unless someone buys their products and honestly I have never had anything but good things to say about them.

I also wanted to try out the idea of a unified platform (Chipset/Graphics/Processor all made specifically to complement each other).

Thanks for the comments though, I'll still consider it and do some more research.

I currently run these same two hard drives under Vista and it works just fine. I use the IDE for storage, SATA for programs/OS.

[Hack&Lube]

Yes I'm not sure what the IDE/SATA thing is about as I used to run that quite well without any problems. I would have Windows on a 34GB Raptor and everything else on a big IDE.

Kudos for sticking with AMD/ATI, I wish ATI was still Canadian.

[photon]

Definitely take a look at some of the benchmarks and such for the Phenom before you take the plunge, if it was even somewhat close it'd be ok, but it just gets pounded.

If you do end up getting a Phenom though, you might want to wait until an updated version that fixes a bug found in the initial release is fixed (though not sure when that will be if it isn't already). The bug required an update to the BIOS of Phenom systems, but because the bug fix was at that level it degraded the performance of the CPU by 10-20%! For a processor already struggling to keep up, that's pretty significant.

Some benchmarks:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/amd-phenom.html

If it's just a gaming PC, another option is to go with the X2 processors for now until the next spin of their quad core and upgrade then.

[Cliche]

Are you certain about the Antec 900 case? It does have a lot of fans, which can get annoying if you have them cranked. Also the other thing is that unless the PSU is ~1 year old, I'd probably drop it and get another one. The reasoning is that the electrolyte in the capacitor that they use for the PSU will change over time, so the amount of Amperage that the PSU provides may not be what it is rated for.

Other than what was already covered, (EG. Poorer performance from the Phenom,) THere's not much more that I can pick over what you have there.

[Nehkara]

Are you certain about the Antec 900 case? It does have a lot of fans, which can get annoying if you have them cranked. Also the other thing is that unless the PSU is ~1 year old, I'd probably drop it and get another one. The reasoning is that the electrolyte in the capacitor that they use for the PSU will change over time, so the amount of Amperage that the PSU provides may not be what it is rated for.

Other than what was already covered, (EG. Poorer performance from the Phenom,) THere's not much more that I can pick over what you have there.

My power supply is quite new... probably 6-8 months. Should be alright.

I like the Antec 900 case and I like that it has a lot of fans... Keeps things pleasantly chilly in the case.

I understand about the poorer performance of the Phenom and I have been keeping an eye on it... I'm hoping AMD will launch another round of quad cores soon.

[Burninator]

I have the Antec 900 case. The fans have 3 settings and you can't hear them if you have them set to low or medium. At full speed they can be loud, but I would never have them set to that. Only down side of the case is that the lights are always on and they are kinda bright. I have my computer in my room and I can't sleep with it on, it lights up my room too much. Other than that it's a great case. In retrospect I probably would have gone with a Antec 180/182, but I don't really regret that decision too much.

[photon]

I've got the P180 and it's a great case.

[4X4]

you could save some $$ by going for a faster Core 2 Duo dual core as well.

That may save him $$, but it'll cost him his tongue when he orders it.

[Nehkara]

I just looked into it and a whole bunch of new Phenom processors are launching relatively soon so I will keep an eye on that. ATI Radeon HD 3870 X2 comes out on January 28th as well... I will keep an eye on it too.

[photon]

Yeah I really want to know what the price point of the X2 will be at... and how the drivers are. The problem with Crossfire and/or SLI is it isn't supported in all games/apps, and in the ones where it isn't supported the performance is just like having one card, not a great thing. With a single card crossfire engineered by ATI they should be able to get around that, but the question is will they... they certainly didn't the last time they tried this.

If the card debuts at $400 it'd be very interesting, but much more than that and it's silly; otherwise just get 2 3870's.

[Nehkara]

Yeah I really want to know what the price point of the X2 will be at... and how the drivers are. The problem with Crossfire and/or SLI is it isn't supported in all games/apps, and in the ones where it isn't supported the performance is just like having one card, not a great thing. With a single card crossfire engineered by ATI they should be able to get around that, but the question is will they... they certainly didn't the last time they tried this.

If the card debuts at $400 it'd be very interesting, but much more than that and it's silly; otherwise just get 2 3870's.

Exactly.

I will be interested to see if this card is in the $350-400 range. I think they could make a killing.

[photon]

Or lose even more money :D

[Regorium]

Yeah I really want to know what the price point of the X2 will be at... and how the drivers are. The problem with Crossfire and/or SLI is it isn't supported in all games/apps, and in the ones where it isn't supported the performance is just like having one card, not a great thing. With a single card crossfire engineered by ATI they should be able to get around that, but the question is will they... they certainly didn't the last time they tried this.

If the card debuts at $400 it'd be very interesting, but much more than that and it's silly; otherwise just get 2 3870's.

I just remember the 7950GX2 debacle - two 7800's were faster, and the GX2 cost more, was hotter, and drew more power. Then the first edition 8800 came out and 1 card was faster than the GX2 (and cheaper to boot).

I'd expect basically the same from AMD, with the lone benefit being it only takes up one PCI-E slot.

[Nehkara]

I just remember the 7950GX2 debacle - two 7800's were faster, and the GX2 cost more, was hotter, and drew more power. Then the first edition 8800 came out and 1 card was faster than the GX2 (and cheaper to boot).

I'd expect basically the same from AMD, with the lone benefit being it only takes up one PCI-E slot.

Well, the HD 3870 X2 is louder and draws significant power but it is faster than Crossfire HD 3870s and it is also the fastest card on the market.

Good result for AMD/ATI, esepcially at the $450 price point.

[Bobblehead]

Well, the HD 3870 X2 is louder and draws significant power but it is faster than Crossfire HD 3870s and it is also the fastest card on the market.

Good result for AMD/ATI, esepcially at the $450 price point.

It doesn't draw that much extra power. Less than the 8800 at idle but 20-30 watts more at full load. Not bad consider there are 2 cores in there.

[Vulcan]

It doesn't draw that much extra power. Less than the 8800 at idle but 20-30 watts more at full load. Not bad consider there are 2 cores in there.

On the Future Shop web page for this card [$499] it recommends having a 450 watt PSU and 550 watts for XFire. That's not bad.

[Bobblehead]

On the Future Shop web page for this card [$499] it recommends having a 450 watt PSU and 550 watts for XFire. That's not bad.

This page from [H]ardOCP (http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTQ1NCw3LCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==) measures the system power usage from the wall plug.

At idle, the X2 used 207W, the 8800GTX 225W
At Full load, the X2 used 380, the 8800GTX used 322W

So it is 58 more watts, but it is 2 cores and it is much less than 2 cards.

Additionally, the article states that the Crossfire is transparent to the system.

I'd be interested to see how much these test were affected by the 512MB/core. When Sapphire or somebody boosts it to 1GB/core it should be interesting to see the results.

[Nehkara]

I was just thinking that I could stick the HD 3870 X2 in my current machine but I think it might explode. I'm not sure if it would know what to do with that kind of power.

[Nehkara]

Memory Express has the HD 3870 X2 from Diamond for $490 (http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/PID-MX19846(ME).aspx).

[llama64]

I was just thinking that I could stick the HD 3870 X2 in my current machine but I think it might explode. I'm not sure if it would know what to do with that kind of power.

Make the neighbouring systems tremble in fear.

http://alexplorer.net/guitar/text/guitar/tarkin.jpg