View Full Version : Kobe says trade me right effing now
habernac
05-30-2007, 10:57 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2886927
troutman
05-30-2007, 11:08 AM
Trade him to Denver. Where he had the incident.
Trade him to the worst team in the league. There, he can take 80 shots each game and get all the attention. That's all he wants. It's not about winning for this loser.
Sylvanfan
05-30-2007, 11:16 AM
Funny when he was originally drafted by the Hornets he demanded they trade him to the Lakers because that was the only team he wanted to play for. Now he wants out. Kobe is actually a pretty intelligent guy in real life as I remember seeing an interview with him before all the bad stuff when he was 21. Speaks fluent Italian and looked very mature for his age, but he's made some awfull descisions in his life and has given himself a terrible image in which he looks like the dumbest athlete in sports and a class A jerk to go with it. I also imagine ego let him develop those traits over time as well.
OILFAN #81
05-30-2007, 11:22 AM
I hope this happens! I hate the Lakers the most in the NBA (been a Kings fan for 15 years) and I'm not a fan of Kobe! That being said, he is still one of the top 5 in the NBA so I hope this happens quick and the Lakers take a fall. I hope he gets traded to the Eastern Conference.
rubecube
05-30-2007, 11:24 AM
Send him home to Philly maybe?
socalwingfan
05-30-2007, 11:31 AM
He'll be a Bull - rumor has it that they have already made an offer
Send him home to Philly maybe?
West Philly where he was born and raised ?????
OILFAN #81
05-30-2007, 11:35 AM
West Philly where he was born and raised ?????
Where he was shooting some bball right outside of the school, when a couple of guys who were up to no good, started making trouble in his neighbourhood.
rubecube
05-30-2007, 11:36 AM
Where he was shooting some bball right outside of the school, when a couple of guys who were up to no good, started making trouble in his neighbourhood.
He got in one little fight and his mom got scared.
Saint Troy
05-30-2007, 11:48 AM
He'll be a Bull - rumor has it that they have already made an offer
Reading Bill Simmons yesterday, someone wrote in that the rumour out of Chicago was Deng, Gordon, cap body for Bryant.
EN FUEGO
05-30-2007, 11:57 AM
He got in one little fight and his mom got scared.
Didn't she say "You're moving in with your auntie and uncle in Bel Air?"
CaramonLS
05-30-2007, 12:02 PM
Didn't she say "You're moving in with your auntie and uncle in Bel Air?"
I whistled for a cab and when it came near...
MissTeeks
05-30-2007, 12:05 PM
I whistled for a cab and when it came near...
The license plate said "Fresh" and it had dice on the mirror...
rubecube
05-30-2007, 12:08 PM
If anything I could say that this cab was rare...
bluejays
05-30-2007, 12:08 PM
Reading Bill Simmons yesterday, someone wrote in that the rumour out of Chicago was Deng, Gordon, cap body for Bryant.
Doesn't Bryant have something like $90M left on his contract over 4 years? I don't think Deng, Gordon and a cap body would cover the $22M or so he makes a year. Also, those guys are pretty good, but it's not the type of return that would be worthy of Bryant either. Wasn't the rumor earlier this year that Pau Gasol was on his way for those same guys + Thomas? I don't know who Bryant is going to be traded for, but Chicago seems like a good bet to stroke his ego as him being the follow-up to Jordan. Philly would be a good fit too considering they have a ton of cap space (I think), but no players respectable to go the other way.
OILFAN #81
05-30-2007, 12:12 PM
If anything I could say that this cab was rare...
But I thought now forget it, yo home to bel-air
I pulled up to a house about seven or eight
And I yelled to the cabby "yo, home smell you later"
Looked at my kingdom I was finally there
To settle my throne as the prince of bel-air!
rubecube
05-30-2007, 12:16 PM
But I thought now forget it, yo home to bel-air
I pulled up to a house about seven or eight
And I yelled to the cabby "yo, home smell you later"
Looked at my kingdom I was finally there
To settle my throne as the prince of bel-air!
There's a good chance all of us might deserve a blue square.
CaramonLS
05-30-2007, 12:19 PM
There's a good chance all of us might deserve a blue square.
The fact that a lot of us can actually recite that from memory alone is quite disturbing.
From what I've heard on the story it looks like Bryant has a legitmate beef here.
When he re-signed with the Lakers he was given Jerry Buss' word that there would be no rebuilding period. Obviously this isn't the case and if Bryant wasn't lied to in the first place then he wouldn't even be a Laker right now.
Also, the fact that Shaq agrees with Kobe when Bryant said that he didn't run Shaq out of town speaks volumes. If Shaq is siding with Kobe then clearly he has a legitimate beef with the organization.
Sylvanfan
05-30-2007, 12:29 PM
There's a good chance all of us might deserve a blue square.
If you post a video of yourself dancing like Carlton to Tom Jones' "It's not Unusual" that's worth a red squre.
socalwingfan
05-30-2007, 12:46 PM
Man those $1000+ courtside seats are going to real popular with the starting back-court of Smush Parker and Sasha Vujacic in the purple and gold!!!
Sylvanfan
05-30-2007, 12:48 PM
Man those $1000+ courtside seats are going to real popular with the starting back-court of Smush Parker and Sasha Vujacic in the purple and gold!!!
Will it get to a point where Clipper fans buy Lakers tickets so that they'll get to see 2-3 Clippers games?:D
Talk about a reversal of fortune.
I_H8_Crawford
05-30-2007, 12:54 PM
The Lakers flat out lied to Bryant so they could keep him - they need the star power to keep the LA stars asses in the seats.
They let him take all the heat for Shaq leaving, and, to his credit, he did.
Then they throw him under the bus this year because they don't want to take the fall for a bunch of crappy seasons.
I am not a Bryant fan, but I feel for the guy now - I think he does want to win, hell, he was going to the lakers saying "how about we get Baron Davis? how about Carlos Boozer? How about Ron Artest?" what more do you want from the guy?
I think Bryant has every right to demand a trade now, the Lakers have flat out screwed him over and he is finally fed up.
I can't believe I am saying this, but I actually kind of feel bad for Bryant and the crap he has put up with from the Lakers...
socalwingfan
05-30-2007, 01:04 PM
The Lakers Front Office is so dysfunctional - they make the Yankees look like the Cosby Show. You got old man Buss running around trying to be a mini-Hugh Hefner leaving the team to his crackhead son Jimmy, who has never had a job in his life. His daughter who runs the business operations, happens to be sleeping with the Head Coach. Mitch Kupchak who is essentially a puppet - has no eye for talent if you look at his drafting record - it's atrocious.
Gee I wonder why Kobe wants out?? The Lakers are going down and they are going down hard.
Juventus3
05-30-2007, 01:25 PM
I dont think I've saidthis before, but Kobe was right to do what he did today. He had been lied to and pushed around by the lakers for quite sometime. He gets stomped on by his own fans for not being perfect in every way, and he's had enough. Good on em.
Maritime Q-Scout
05-30-2007, 03:09 PM
There's a good chance all of us might deserve a blue square.
hell no red squares all around, but OILFAN#81 line for line, I wanted to get a line in
ahhh back when Will Smith could rap :whistle:
J pold
05-30-2007, 03:33 PM
Come on Celtics
socalwingfan
05-30-2007, 03:53 PM
Kobe after talking it over with Phil Jackson now wants to be a "Laker for Life". Phil must have some damn good chronic in the old peace pipe
StrayBullet
05-30-2007, 06:32 PM
Trade him to the worst team in the league. There, he can take 80 shots each game and get all the attention. That's all he wants. It's not about winning for this loser.
You obviously didn't read the article or listen to the Steven A. Smith or Dan Patrick radio shows to form this ridiculous opinion of yours. ***NEWS FLASH*** - Without Kobe, the Lakers are easily the worst team in the league. Kobe is a competitor and winning is exactly what he's asking for.
"I'm a big baby and not getting my way. So trade me! I know I signed a contract that says you can't trade me, but what I want I get and I want out!"
Co-Signed - Kobe Bryant & Chris Pronger
My mom told me if I didn't have anything nice to say about anybody I should keep my mouth shut. Sorry Mom. Kobe is an over rated meatbag and I hope they trade him to some team where he won't do squat. Trade him someplace like the Knicks, thats where the thugs and other meatbags go.
It's all about his ego. When things aren't going his way he demands a trade.
Trade him to Denver when he can compete with another ego named Iverson.
I wanna be like Miikka
05-30-2007, 11:50 PM
Did some of you even hear the interview and read up on what happened?? The guy got blamed for Shaq leaving when the owner told him that he didnt want Shaq regardless of if Kobe signed. So Kobe put up with that crap for a couple years, then when he finds out that someone in the organization said it was Kobes fault and they also said the team was rebuilding (which the team promised him they weren't doing) he spoke out because he was sick of all the lies.
The Kobe hate on is getting to the point where it is just plain stupid.
I think there are only four teams that could even make a trade for Kobe.
Seattle and Portland will have either Durant or Oden and both are going to be superstars but both teams would have to give up something else and i am not sure what else either team would have to offer. The only decent player on is Ray Allen so Seattle is the front runner of the two.
Suns for Amare would be a blockbuster and almost a straight up trade but would the Lakers trade him to a division rival and could he share the spotlight with Nash. Magic 8 ball says all signs point to no.
NY is the best bet for any trade. Francis has matured and he makes the players around him better which is something Kobe has never done. NY would have to throw in a little more but since Kobe decided to go public his value would go down and add to that they are the biggest market and in the Eastern confrence this would make the most sense for the Lakers
Like him or not he is one of the top players in the league but any team that is already a contender would pretty much have to dismantle their starting roster just to get him anyways so as i see it these are pretty close to the only options barring some crazy multi team trade.
Locke
05-31-2007, 03:39 PM
There's a good chance all of us might deserve a blue square.
That was hilarious, you shoulda let it keep going one post after another.
StrayBullet
05-31-2007, 05:33 PM
Did some of you even hear the interview and read up on what happened?? The guy got blamed for Shaq leaving when the owner told him that he didnt want Shaq regardless of if Kobe signed. So Kobe put up with that crap for a couple years, then when he finds out that someone in the organization said it was Kobes fault and they also said the team was rebuilding (which the team promised him they weren't doing) he spoke out because he was sick of all the lies.
The Kobe hate on is getting to the point where it is just plain stupid.
No kidding. It was like, people read the title of the post and didn't bother to read or find out what was going on.
The funny thing about all of this is, the media and the general public have been blaming Kobe for Shaq leaving Los Angeles when Shaq re-inforced yesterday that he believes Kobe 100%. You know, I understand the hate for an athlete, but if you don't know ##### about the sport or the story, don't say a thing.
StrayBullet
05-31-2007, 05:36 PM
"I'm a big baby and not getting my way. So trade me! I know I signed a contract that says you can't trade me, but what I want I get and I want out!"
Co-Signed - Kobe Bryant & Chris Pronger
Read the story, he's retracted his "demands".
StrayBullet
05-31-2007, 05:37 PM
It's all about his ego. When things aren't going his way he demands a trade.
Trade him to Denver when he can compete with another ego named Iverson.
...because there is no such thing as a pro athlete with an ego? Good one.
No kidding. It was like, people read the title of the post and didn't bother to read or find out what was going on.
The funny thing about all of this is, the media and the general public have been blaming Kobe for Shaq leaving Los Angeles when Shaq re-inforced yesterday that he believes Kobe 100%. You know, I understand the hate for an athlete, but if you don't know ##### about the sport or the story, don't say a thing.
Sure he wasn't 100% responsible for him leaving but he certainly had a part to play in it by not wanting Shaq to stay. I don't think he is a bad guy for wanting Shaq gone I think he is an idiot. Had Shaq stayed Kobe would have had a shot at at least 5-8 more titles. Instead his ego got in the way he wanted to prove that he could win without Shaq and he was wrong.
I hate Kobe because he is selfish, a cry baby, a dirty player, a rapist and the epitome of everything that is wrong with basketball and its players today.
Kobe deserves every bit of ill will sent his way and has brought it on himself for the way he has acted throughout his career.
It always amazes me how many Kobe apologists out there who believe this poor Kobe BS and that he is such a matyr.
StrayBullet
05-31-2007, 06:09 PM
Sure he wasn't 100% responsible for him leaving but he certainly had a part to play in it by not wanting Shaq to stay. I don't think he is a bad guy for wanting Shaq gone I think he is an idiot. Had Shaq stayed Kobe would have had a shot at at least 5-8 more titles. Instead his ego got in the way he wanted to prove that he could win without Shaq and he was wrong.
I hate Kobe because he is selfish, a cry baby, a dirty player, a rapist and the epitome of everything that is wrong with basketball and its players today.
Kobe deserves every bit of ill will sent his way and has brought it on himself for the way he has acted throughout his career.
It always amazes me how many Kobe apologists out there who believe this poor Kobe BS and that he is such a matyr.
When did anyone say he was a martyr? People like yourself only have one image that they keep of Kobe. They hold onto that one impression because of what has happened or what they think happened over the years in LA. He's the athlete people love to hate.
As said in the interviews, Shaq was not going to stay in LA. Jerry Buss was not going to let it happen, especially since Jerry West had left the franchise. Shaq didn't want to stay anyway. He didn't want to play with Kobe anymore. The thing is people like yourself insist that it was all Kobe's fault that the Lakers didn't win more thean 3 titles. It was all Kobe's fault because of his ego. So, I ask, Shaq never had an ego? Phil Jackson never had an ego? Michael Jordan never had an ego?
All of these athletes have egos. They're the best at what they do.
How can you say that he was wrong because he belives that he can win without Shaq? Kobe is in his prime and is still the best player in the league. He has changed as an athlete and has changed his game. Being this "selfish player" or "dirty" or whatever it is you think is not exactly a part of his game. Watch a Lakers game and figure it out yourself.
"The epitome of what's worng with players today" ??? hmmm...The best player in the league and he's what's wrong. The truest talent of this generation. Yea, he's so wrong.
Read the story, he's retracted his "demands".
Probably because he talked ot the owner and they are going to bow down to his every demand....the fact that these guys making all this money to play a sport can cry about so much just blows my mind. I hope one day an owner will stand up to one of these guys and pay them their money but make them sit on the bench for 2-4 years of their contract...
"The epitome of what's worng with players today" ??? hmmm...The best player in the league and he's what's wrong. The truest talent of this generation. Yea, he's so wrong.
I have seen plenty of Lakers games and Kobe's game and I don't think he is the best player in the league or the "truest talent" of his generation, so yes he can be whats wrong. He is a dick and criminal off the court. A "me" player on and off the court and that is what is wrong with the league.
Not sure how he is better than Duncan, Nash, Wade or Lebron. These guys alll not only play at an exceptional level they are able to make their teammates better players. Thats what I haven't seen from Kobe.
I_H8_Crawford
05-31-2007, 09:04 PM
Lebron is currently choking away a game 5 win.
Edit: Haha I was wrong - Lebron scores 29/30 points for the Cavs in the late 4th and 2OTs and Cavs win! I guess he really is the best player in the NBA!
I wanna be like Miikka
06-01-2007, 02:29 AM
I have seen plenty of Lakers games and Kobe's game and I don't think he is the best player in the league or the "truest talent" of his generation, so yes he can be whats wrong. He is a dick and criminal off the court. A "me" player on and off the court and that is what is wrong with the league.
Not sure how he is better than Duncan, Nash, Wade or Lebron. These guys alll not only play at an exceptional level they are able to make their teammates better players. Thats what I haven't seen from Kobe.
Man stop embarassing yourself moon. You don't even address the real points and you just state that Kobe "probably" had something to do with Shaq leaving. Buss said he was not resigning Shaq regardless of what Kobe did during that offseason. Just read the damn details before you say useless comments. Sure kobe made his mistake with that girl but do you honestly think that was rape. You think Kobe Bryant had to rape a girl to have sex...... right. Try thinking before you have a useless hate on for the most talented player in the NBA.
Man stop embarassing yourself moon. You don't even address the real points and you just state that Kobe "probably" had something to do with Shaq leaving. Buss said he was not resigning Shaq regardless of what Kobe did during that offseason. Just read the damn details before you say useless comments. Sure kobe made his mistake with that girl but do you honestly think that was rape. You think Kobe Bryant had to rape a girl to have sex...... right. Try thinking before you have a useless hate on for the most talented player in the NBA.
I never said probably had something to do with it. I said that if he wanted Shaq to stay he could have told Buss that and I am sure that Buss would have kept Shaq. Instead he kept quiet because he wanted to show that he could win without him. No probably in that. I have read the damn details.
I don't have that much hatred for Kobe. There are many others I dislike more than him and have stated before that he is not the most talented player in the league. If he is than he sure isn't doing much to help his team with all that "talent."
I wanna be like Miikka
06-01-2007, 11:33 AM
I never said probably had something to do with it. I said that if he wanted Shaq to stay he could have told Buss that and I am sure that Buss would have kept Shaq. Instead he kept quiet because he wanted to show that he could win without him. No probably in that. I have read the damn details.
I don't have that much hatred for Kobe. There are many others I dislike more than him and have stated before that he is not the most talented player in the league. If he is than he sure isn't doing much to help his team with all that "talent."
You flat out called him a criminal for the "rape" charge. You are just trying to find reasons to hate Kobe, instead of blaming Buss who didnt want Shaq you blame Kobe for not trying to convince Buss to keep him. Remember what happened when vince carter convinced management to sign alvin williams, JYD, Antonio Davis etc. to massive long contracts.... Sure he could have done something but it is not HIS fault that Shaq left. Kobe didn't come out and say that he didnt tell Buss to keep Shaq so you can't just assume that he didnt speak out because he was a selfish player who wanted his own team. Plus in the article it says that Buss told Kobe it didnt matter if he signed in LA or not because they weren't bringing Shaq back, they wanted the value for him right now because he was an older center (who usually become a lot worse within a few years).
As for talent, he is one of the best in the NBA (82 points or whatever in 1 game). The guy has 3 championships and brought a Laker team to the playoffs 2 consecutive years in a tough Western conference. You want to compare the teams of the superstars previously mentioned. Kobe has Kwame, Smush Parker, Odom, Walton etc. Nash has Amare, Marion, Bell, Barbosa while Lebron has Ilgauskus, Hughes, Gooden, Marshall, Damon Jones. All 3 of those players are amazing but if Kobe had a better halfcourt then his team would be competing on the same levels of the other superstars. He does make players better and if you watched him the last 2 years he has changed his game a lot, he makes more passes at better times as seen in last years Suns-Lakers series where he actually took too much heat for not shooting enough. He makes players around him better and while it is tough to coin one player as the most talented in the league, an easy argument can be made for Kobe.
Either way your argument is just stacked with assumptions and useless hate ons like the fact that he "Raped" a girl and that he purposely chose not to speak out about Shaq cuz he wanted his own team. I'm done talkin with you about this subject because it is clear how easy you let personal opinions get in the way of a logical discussion.
Either way your argument is just stacked with assumptions and useless hate ons like the fact that he "Raped" a girl and that he purposely chose not to speak out about Shaq cuz he wanted his own team. I'm done talkin with you about this subject because it is clear how easy you let personal opinions get in the way of a logical discussion.
Ya its me who is letting personal feelings get in the way of a logical discussion. :rolleyes:
Since you are done I won't bother responding to your points but you do seem to have a hard time reading as I have mentioned it wasn't his fault for Shaq not coming back already. I think it was dumb of him for not wanting him to come back and that if he wanted him back he could have made it happen, but it wasn't his fault.
CaramonLS
06-01-2007, 02:30 PM
Sure kobe made his mistake with that girl but do you honestly think that was rape. You think Kobe Bryant had to rape a girl to have sex...... right.
Rape isn't always about sex.
StrayBullet
06-01-2007, 04:24 PM
Wow. This conversation is ridiculous. You would think that someone who could talk so much smack about a player, would actually know something about the sport and the league. I guess not.
...be like miika - It's obvious moon has this personal vendetta against Kobe if he truly believes what he posts. If he really doesn't think Kobe is doing wonders with the garbage bag of teammates he has compared to Nash and the Suns, Wade and the Heat (with Shaq, mind you) and Duncan and the Spurs, then it's clear indication that he is ignorant to the daily going of the NBA and basketball. It's actually insulting.
moon - Why would it be dumb for an athlete to prove that he can lead a team? Why is it dumb for any athlete in any sport to believe that he can win any and every game? It's the killer instinct that great superstars have - From Joe Montana to Wayne Gretzky to Tiger to Michael to Tom Brady, etc. Kobe - just like them - wanted it just as much as anyone else in the league. The fact that you still think that he's a "me" player makes me question your credibility. I really don't think you watch the sport, rather just watch TSN and SportsNet highlights to form your opinion.
StrayBullet
06-01-2007, 04:25 PM
Rape isn't always about sex.
...and so he supposedly raped her because she didn't ask him to sleep with her or she wasn't after a paycheque. ...okay, I get it now.
StrayBullet
06-01-2007, 04:28 PM
Lebron .... I guess he really is the best player in the NBA!
He's making his way to get there, but not quite. He impressed me. I don't like Lebron, but he impressed me last night.
CaramonLS
06-01-2007, 04:30 PM
...and so he supposedly raped her because she didn't ask him to sleep with her or she wasn't after a paycheque. ...okay, I get it now.
You on crack, son?
I said nothing about Kobe in my post, nor was I implying anything about his current situation. I was merely pointing out the fallacy of Miikka's argument.
StrayBullet
06-01-2007, 04:36 PM
You on crack, son?
I said nothing about Kobe in my post, nor was I implying anything about his current situation. I was merely pointing out the fallacy of Miikka's argument.
Yes. I live for the glass pipe.
I wanna be like Miikka
06-01-2007, 04:39 PM
You on crack, son?
I said nothing about Kobe in my post, nor was I implying anything about his current situation. I was merely pointing out the fallacy of Miikka's argument.
Yeah I understood what you were saying, I wasnt intending it to come across the way it did. My point bringing up the rape incident is just that you can't choose a side and say he IS a criminal because he DID rape a girl when there is plenty of logic and evidence forming a counter argument. I mean that girl had a history of sleeping around (4 people the month b4 that or something) and she even flew to Calgary and partied hard here.
...be like miika - It's obvious moon has this personal vendetta against Kobe if he truly believes what he posts. If he really doesn't think Kobe is doing wonders with the garbage bag of teammates he has compared to Nash and the Suns, Wade and the Heat (with Shaq, mind you) and Duncan and the Spurs, then it's clear indication that he is ignorant to the daily going of the NBA and basketball. It's actually insulting.
moon - Why would it be dumb for an athlete to prove that he can lead a team? Why is it dumb for any athlete in any sport to believe that he can win any and every game? It's the killer instinct that great superstars have - From Joe Montana to Wayne Gretzky to Tiger to Michael to Tom Brady, etc. Kobe - just like them - wanted it just as much as anyone else in the league. The fact that you still think that he's a "me" player makes me question your credibility. I really don't think you watch the sport, rather just watch TSN and SportsNet highlights to form your opinion.
I have no personal vendetta against Kobe. I don't think he is the clearly most talented player in the league or his generation and that he has done alot of things over his career to bring the hate on himself.
He certainly is in the top five players talentwise but how you can say that he is physically more talented than Lebron, Wade or KG is beyond me and that he is a better BB player than Nash, Nowitski, Wade, Lebron, Duncan is equally crazy in my mind. In my view Nash, Kobe, Duncan, Lebron and Wade are all about equal overall and to say that one is better than the other is highly debateable.
I am busy now and will get back to the other points by tomorrow.
...be like miika - It's obvious moon has this personal vendetta against Kobe if he truly believes what he posts. If he really doesn't think Kobe is doing wonders with the garbage bag of teammates he has compared to Nash and the Suns, Wade and the Heat (with Shaq, mind you) and Duncan and the Spurs, then it's clear indication that he is ignorant to the daily going of the NBA and basketball. It's actually insulting.
moon - Why would it be dumb for an athlete to prove that he can lead a team? Why is it dumb for any athlete in any sport to believe that he can win any and every game? It's the killer instinct that great superstars have - From Joe Montana to Wayne Gretzky to Tiger to Michael to Tom Brady, etc. Kobe - just like them - wanted it just as much as anyone else in the league. The fact that you still think that he's a "me" player makes me question your credibility. I really don't think you watch the sport, rather just watch TSN and SportsNet highlights to form your opinion.
I never compared Kobe's teammates to SA, Phoenix or Miami. I compared Kobe to Nash, Duncan and Wade though. But it is good to see that you were able to make stuff up so you could be insulted. I would say the fact that you feel the need to maufacture arguments with is more ignorant than anything else in this thread.
It isn't dumb for an athlete to want to prove that he can lead a team, but unlike those guys you mentioned Kobe hasn't shown that he can lead a team on his own yet. If he were about winning than he would have realised that a team with him and Shaq would have been able to compete for another 8-10 years. I never heard of Gretzky asking Sather to get rid of Messier so he could lead a team on his own or Montana wanting to dump Rice. They were able to lead their teams and show the killer instinct while working well with the other stars on their team.
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