Bolts 4 Flames 3

[zamler]

Strong moral victory in this one.

[JurassicTunga12]

It got close, but man, just when we think things are starting to look up for the Flames, they lay a doody on our faces with a game like that.
MAN, what a frustrating team.

Ward is not a head coach. What are the assistants doing as well? Do they not know what a timeout is? that they have it? wake up...

Gotta win tomorrow to make this a pretty good road trip still.

[djsFlames]

Bennett and Lucic are not going to help you tie the goddamn game.

Why throw away that opportunity after making it 4-3? Never mind the lack of a timeout.

Geoff, you're an idiot.

[JohnnyB]

This has not been a good season as a Flames fan, but I'm glad they're at least providing entertaining games again.

[minnow]

Love Mangi. That is all.

[Iginla]

Not sure how Ward doesn't take a timeout and come back with the top line. Also, that should have been an intentional offside with a faceoff in the attacking zone to close out the game.

[Joborule]

I ask again as I did in the GT, what does Ward actually do? That's TWICE in the game he should've called a timeout. He knows they exist right?

He's really a burden for the team. At least he finally got Bennett back with Dube.

[memphusk]

#### me. Ward is another Gulutzan. Look at the situation.

[Rubicant]

I have seen more than enough of the Geoff Ward experiment.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Played hard against a tough team, but man we gave up a lot of grade A chances.

[bigrangy]

Idiot Flames lose game in idiotic fashion even though they deserved to lose anyways

At least lose without being stupid about it ####

[Scroopy Noopers]

I had to do a cartoonesque head shake and triple take when I didn’t see the top line out there. What the hell just happened!?

[scobel]

Ok I thought that Ward was just getting a bad wrap but wow how do you not call a timeout? Did I miss something?

[Abatedmean]

Wouldnt blink an eye if Ward doesnt play another game as a flame coach.

[Erick Estrada]

Lightning were the better team but the Flames didn't embarrass themselves as it was special teams that let them down. Ward seems hell bent on taking himself out of the running to coach this team next season. His player deployment at times is as clueless as I have seen from any coach.

[CaptainCrunch]

Boy's I don't think we're going to State.

[skcli]

Brad Tre, look at Tempa and you learn how to build a winning team. By the way, spend some money to get a top 6 winger. Your current first line is not going to cut it.

[AustinL_NHL]

Sure, we lost by 1 and many will consider that a small victory, but the Lightning totally dominated us that game.

The Flames were incredibly sloppy, had awful positioning, and couldn't make a pass to save their lives the majority of the game.

Also, Ward is as braindead as coached come

[SebC]

GT about to get locked, so I'll ask here: can anyone explain how that's not an intentional offside?

[Flash Walken]

Normally the time out crowd makes me chuckle but man, what a huge downgrade from Monahan tkachuk gaudreau Lindholm to Bennett backlund mangiapane lucic

[GranteedEV]

Looking at the bright side. Could have lost 3-0 or 5-0 and had the goal differential drop to -9 or -11

Only lost 4-3. Goal differential at -7

[AC]

So frustrating watching this team when the top players just seem off. Tkachuk with the empty net made 3 awful plays with the puck.

Unfortunately this game comes down to that terrible PP for the shorthanded goal. 3 odd-man rushes against before they finally scored.

[Dragomir]

See you all at the draft, this team is not making the playoffs sadly

[Abatedmean]

Lightning were the better team but the Flames didn't embarrass themselves as it was special teams that let them down. Ward seems hell bent on taking himself out of the running to coach this team next season. His player deployment at times is as clueless as I have seen from any coach.

I was just thinking the same way. He is either clueless or just really does not want the job for next year.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Normally the time out crowd makes me chuckle but man, what a huge downgrade from Monahan tkachuk gaudreau Lindholm to Bennett backlund mangiapane lucic

They finally looked like they were rolling in this game too.

[Jetfire]

I don't see any situation where a timeout shouldn't be used when you're down by just a goal with only a couple minutes left. We had momentum scoring the power play goal, the team was buzzing, surely you want your best guys out there as much as possible and not do the "roll 4 lines" crap in a situation that crucial to the season.

It's the Lightning and I wasn't necessarily expecting a win, though I certainly hoped for one. Get back at it and beat the Panthers and then we've got 7/10 points on a difficult road trip.

[Erick Estrada]

So frustrating watching this team when the top players just seem off. Tkachuk with the empty net made 3 awful plays with the puck.

Unfortunately this game comes down to that terrible PP for the shorthanded goal. 3 odd-man rushes against before they finally scored.

He held onto the puck forever with the empty net and when he finally makes a pass it's a bad one near a Lightning player and they lose possession.

[nieuwy-89]

Too little, too late.

Makes that lost point in Nashville hurt even more.

Tomorrow is now a must-win game.

[zamler]

Bennett and Lucic are not going to help you tie the goddamn game.

Why throw away that opportunity after making it 4-3? Never mind the lack of a timeout.

Geoff, you're an idiot.

I tragically laughed when I saw them out there.

[BrennyBaller]

We’re not going anywhere with Lucic getting a regular shift on the 3rd line when we’re chasing the game, getting PP time, and getting time in the last minute to tie the game. As long as his best bud Geoff is coaching he will never be held accountable. I don’t even mind Lucic, but when you’re chasing a game he should be stapled you the bench, not Ryan.

[ComixZone]

33 wins. 33 losses.

This loss was predictable right from the get go - no one wanted it enough. No one pushed with the extra effort it requires to win games at this time of the year. That’s disappointing.

[direwolf]

If we can get a favorable OOT tonight and beat the Panthers tomorrow, everything will be fine.

[Manhattanboy]

Ward is clueless.

We could have the guy from Weekend at Bernies behind the bench and it would make no difference.

[skcli]

I don't see any situation where a timeout shouldn't be used when you're down by just a goal with only a couple minutes left. We had momentum scoring the power play goal, the team was buzzing, surely you want your best guys out there as much as possible and not do the "roll 4 lines" crap in a situation that crucial to the season.

It's the Lightning and I wasn't necessarily expecting a win, though I certainly hoped for one. Get back at it and beat the Panthers and then we've got 7/10 points on a difficult road trip.


Remember the Flames sucks at home ice.

[djsFlames]

Wouldnt blink an eye if Ward doesnt play another game as a flame coach.

Flames ownership probably thinks they can squeeze in for that playoff revenue even with him behind the bench, so they can get away without shelling out another couple mil for a proper coach. Even though the team is begging for it at this point.

[midniteowl]

Does Ward know there is a thing called Time Out that he can use? :whaa:

[Jetfire]

Remember the Flames sucks at home ice.

Yeah I'm aware, we really need these road points. We have next to no road games left after this road trip in comparison to home ones.

[Abatedmean]

Ward is clueless.

We could have the guy from Weekend at Bernies behind the bench and it would make no difference.

Eh, at least they make fluke into making the right call here or there

[GirlySports]

I know this is unpopular here but I hope the Flames miss the playoffs this year. I cant stomach them accidentally winning a round and signing Ward for 3 years.

[OldSam]

Ward knows you lose the timeout after the game, right? So embarrassing. I guess we will lose tomorrow because we are truly a .500 team.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Tampa is a great team, and it showed this afternoon.


However, Flames didn't do themselves any favours. Score I felt somewhat flattered the Flames as they got two squeakers past Vasilevski.


I don't think Rittich was bad. How many grade-A point-blank saves is he required to make to pull out a win?


Flames were chasing the game, yet still got out-scored and, IMO, greatly out-chanced. Tampa had way too many clean looks from in-tight on Rittich.



This team is playing slow out there. I can't even say that they didn't play without effort. They showed both a tonne of emotion and effort, but they just couldn't sustain much outside of a few flurries and Monahan's goal. They had some quality offensive zone time, but weren't able to turn that time into QUALITY chances. Tampa did.


Tampa defended better, and they transitioned better, and they generated better, and they out-scored Calgary. That's the game.


And yes, how on Earth does an NHL head coach not call a time-out with under a minute left? Give your team a chance to win at least.

[JBR]

GT about to get locked, so I'll ask here: can anyone explain how that's not an intentional offside?

Player caught offside didn’t touch the puck.

[TheScorpion]

I try not to criticize coaches too much but I just cannot comprehend how Ward didn't call a timeout with 40 seconds left instead of throwing Bennett, Lucic, Hanifin, and Gustafsson on the ice.

That's a huge downgrade and Monahan is the guy you want out there in that situation.

[Erick Estrada]

I know this is unpopular here but I hope the Flames miss the playoffs this year. I cant stomach them accidentally winning a round and signing Ward for 3 years.

My biggest fear is that they scrap by into a wildcard spot get hot at the right time winning a round and the team feels they need to keep him on as head coach.

[Chingas]

The Tampa cross checkers amirite

[Abatedmean]

Ward knows you lose the timeout after the game, right? So embarrassing. I guess we will lose tomorrow because we are truly a .500 team.

Was under the impression that they stacked up??? So when we (dont) get to the playoffs without using a single timeout we will have so many to workwith.

[Aarongavey]

Have a chance for a .500 road trip tomorrow. Despite not really being in the game, the Flames made this close. Lucic had a good net front presence in the final minute there.

[JurassicTunga12]

I try not to criticize coaches too much but I just cannot comprehend how Ward didn't call a timeout with 40 seconds left instead of throwing Bennett, Lucic, Hanifin, and Gustafsson on the ice.

That's a huge downgrade and Monahan is the guy you want out there in that situation.

I hope the media ask Ward what the heck he was thinking.

[Johnhitbox]

Words hard

Ward bad* at coaching

[Erick Estrada]

Have a chance for a .500 road trip tomorrow. Despite not really being in the game, the Flames made this close. Lucic had a good net front presence in the final minute there.

It doesn't matter how many times you say it, nobody is buying it.

[chubeyr1]

Johnny Gaudreau was calling for a timeout but the coach did not listen.

I try not to rag on coaches but that was a horrible mistake.

Sure we got out played. Yet maybe we tie it up with .1 seconds left.

Terrible coaching decision. No reason not to call a timeout!

[taxbuster]

Would help if, when they have the odd man at the end of the game, they actually directed the puck towards the net. They DO know that's how goals get scored, right?

They diddle and piddle with the puck constantly, until they lose it. Dumb hockey.

They might make the playoffs, but this team is going nowhere. Not like that.

[Infinit47]

I know this is unpopular here but I hope the Flames miss the playoffs this year. I cant stomach them accidentally winning a round and signing Ward for 3 years.

Short of going to the SCF they will not hire Ward as a full time HC. He makes embarassing mistakes.

Guess we will roll the dice next year with another "Trelieving is the smartest guy in the room" coaching hire from the discount bin.

[Huntingwhale]

I know this is unpopular here but I hope the Flames miss the playoffs this year. I cant stomach them accidentally winning a round and signing Ward for 3 years.

The hell, you would rather miss the playoffs then win a playoff round?

Terrible game by Tkachuk. Looks like he's gunning for the giveaway crown the past couple of games.

[Aarongavey]

It doesn't matter how many times you say it, nobody is buying it.

I should have used the green text I guess, I thought the “have a chance for a .500 road trip tomorrow” was a dead giveaway that it was sarcasm.

[midniteowl]

Johnny Gaudreau was calling for a timeout but the coach did not listen.

I try not to rag on coaches but that was a horrible mistake.

Sure we got out played. Yet maybe we tie it up with .1 seconds left.

Terrible coaching decision. No reason not to call a timeout!


Yah, I saw Johnny was signalling timeout, he even yelling timeout to the bench. I guess Ward figured he knows better. :confused:

[djsFlames]

Was really hoping the opposite of the Preds game might happen tonight after the Preds snatched points IMO they didn't earn, like Calgary might've if they found a way here.

But in steps Ward to handicap the Flames and ensure the regulation L.

[Flash Walken]

If I can't have "Assist Machine" as my custom user title, can it be "Net Front Presence" ?

[Flash Walken]

Yah, I saw Johnny was signalling timeout, he even yelling timeout to the bench. I guess Ward figured he knows better. :confused:
Yep, I saw that too.

Johnny calling T, then taking a seat in the bench.

[TheScorpion]

Darryl Sutter is still available. Gallant and Laviolette too.

But my guess is the Flames hire one of Mike Yeo or Phil Housley in the offseason. Maybe they can bring back Brent!

[Infinit47]

Yep, I saw that too.

Johnny calling T, then taking a seat in the bench.

But at least Ward has kept Lucic happy, I mean, how would we possibly replace 5 goals for $5.25 mil on the open market?

Flames ownership deserves to miss for cheaping out on coaches. Sad time to be a Flames fan.

[djsFlames]

Johnny is going to get fed up with this crap if he isn't already.

He knows the ins and outs of coaching better than the coach...... ugh

Wake up management, wake up ownership! This is embarrassing.

[nieuwy-89]

My biggest fear is that they scrap by into a wildcard spot get hot at the right time winning a round and the team feels they need to keep him on as head coach.

If they get in and win a playoff series or two, Ward would go down as one of the all-time great Flames coaches. I’d take one or two more years of Ward if it means we finally get another taste of playoff success.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Normally the time out crowd makes me chuckle but man, what a huge downgrade from Monahan tkachuk gaudreau Lindholm to Bennett backlund mangiapane lucic

Agreed, the timeout crowd is usually stupid. But in this case, timeout is line selection and if you want to tie it, you have to use your best guys.

I was watching the TB feed. Not sure if they showed it on Sportsnet, but you could see Johnny making the time out sign on the way to the bench with 53 seconds left. At least twice, he was asking for it

They were the guys in the ice who scored the 4-3 goal quickly, then maintained possession trying to tie. They seemed to be feeling it, and Ward in this case makes nothing short of an idiotic decision

[calgaryred]

If Ward is coach next season I think CP will have the biggest meltdown

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

[Erick Estrada]

If they get in and win a playoff series or two, Ward would go down as one of the all-time great Flames coaches. I’d take one or two more years of Ward if it means we finally get another taste of playoff success.

Yeah probably a bad example as winning the first round is a major feat for a Flames head coach. Winning two rounds would put a coach in rare company over 3 dacades. Sigh.:(

[TheScorpion]

Yeah probably a bad example as winning the first round is a major feat for a Flames head coach. Winning two rounds would put a coach in rare company over 3 dacades. Sigh.:(

List of Flames coaches to win in the first round

Al MacNeil
Badger Bob
Terry Crisp
Darryl
Bob Hartley

Oof

[Flash Walken]

List of Flames coaches to win in the first round

Al MacNeil
Badger Bob
Terry Crisp
Darryl
Bob Hartley

Oof

Jesus.

is the list 3 names for round 2?

[Buff]

I'm not sure if anybody has mentioned it yet, but why doesn't Ward use his timeouts? Should he not have used a timeout to keep his bestest players on the ice with less than a minute left and only one goal is needed to tie it up? Mind bottling.

[Manhattanboy]

My biggest fear is that they scrap by into a wildcard spot get hot at the right time winning a round and the team feels they need to keep him on as head coach.

I still want playoffs and would love to win a round but can’t see that happening with this group starting with goaltending.

[zamler]

At least we're not Pittsburgh they've lost 5 straight. Another positive less PGT gifs to make so I have that going for me which is nice.

[djsFlames]

It would be so unexpected and uncharacteristic of them to hire a guy in the final few weeks, yet if they did it (and brought in one of the vet guys available) I think they would be rewarded MASSIVELY.

I pray that this dawns on someone upstairs and that they're not watching these games from a bench perspective thinking that it's been acceptable for a team that they think has aspirations.

[Erick Estrada]

I still want playoffs and would love to win a round but can’t see that happening with this group starting with goaltending.

Looking at their remaining schedule I see them playing around .500 hockey which probably won't be good enough to hold on to the last wildcard spot.

[TheScorpion]

Jesus.

is the list 3 names for round 2?

Four. Hartley comes off the list.

[Aarongavey]

Jesus.

is the list 3 names for round 2?

No it is 4, Flames made the third round in their first season in Calgary

[Traditional_Ale]

Was I watching a different game than everyone else? Tampa are a stupid good team and I thought the Flames played with a lot of heart. This is the kind of game they can take a lot away from and learn from. The worst play by any Flame today was Ward not calling a timeout at the end to rest the top line.

[The Cobra]

Looking at their remaining schedule I see them playing around .500 hockey which probably won't be good enough to hold on to the last wildcard spot.



Based on winning percentage, they are not currently in a playoff spot, but it’s a fractional difference behind Minny.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[zamler]

Was I watching a different game than everyone else? Tampa are a stupid good team and I thought the Flames played with a lot of heart. This is the kind of game they can take a lot away from and learn from. The worst play by any Flame today was Ward not calling a timeout at the end to rest the top line.
What can the players learn from this game?

[midniteowl]

Was I watching a different game than everyone else? Tampa are a stupid good team and I thought the Flames played with a lot of heart. This is the kind of game they can take a lot away from and learn from. The worst play by any Flame today was Ward not calling a timeout at the end to rest the top line.


I agree that Tampa has a very good team, also they seem to be very systematic. The way they go up the ice, everyone seems to know where everyone else is on the ice, they go up the ice as a team. Where as the Flames lack that precision.

[tvp2003]

One one hand, they started to look a little slow/tired out there (especially compared to Tampa's speed). On the other hand, they still hung in there despite being outplayed for the majority of the game. Mangiapane was really impressive. Rittich had some nice saves in the third to keep them in it.


My hope is that by playing good teams like Boston and Tampa, it pushes them to be better going forward. Doesn't always work that way though.


Must win tomorrow against Florida? Not mathematically, but it sure feels like it...



Johnny Gaudreau was calling for a timeout but the coach did not listen.




Well that's a kick in the nuts. Are we now back to trying to win in spite of our coach?

[Manhattanboy]

Agreed, the timeout crowd is usually stupid. But in this case, timeout is line selection and if you want to tie it, you have to use your best guys.

I was watching the TB feed. Not sure if they showed it on Sportsnet, but you could see Johnny making the time out sign on the way to the bench with 53 seconds left. At least twice, he was asking for it

They were the guys in the ice who scored the 4-3 goal quickly, then maintained possession trying to tie. They seemed to be feeling it, and Ward in this case makes nothing short of an idiotic decision

Brutal. Just brutal.

If I was Treliving I would be furious.

Ward is terribly unqualified.

[shadowlord]

Even if Ward inexplicably doesn't go with the top unit for that last shift, why not go with Backs/Mangiapane at the very least? They've been the hot hand.

[Aarongavey]

What can the players learn from this game?

I would be chatting with some of the Tampa players about what golf courses are in good condition in the Tampa area in case they are planning a spring golf trip

[djsFlames]

Bread is a beauty.

Paul Byron 2.0 right now, maybe better.

[TheScorpion]

Even if Ward inexplicably doesn't go with the top unit for that last shift, why not go with Backs/Mangiapane at the very least? They've been the hot hand.

They were both out there at the end. But they should have been out there with Monahan, Gaudreau, Lindholm, and Giordano.

[ComixZone]

Brutal. Just brutal.

If I was Treliving I would be furious.

Ward is terribly unqualified.

He only has himself to be furious with.

[Manhattanboy]

Someone PLEASE tell me. What did Bennett and Lucic do this game that warranted they be on the ice during the last minute?

Ward has a rap sheet of stupid decisions that require his immediate dismissal the more I think about it.

Oh I see there is another thread on this already lol.

[shadowlord]

They were both out there at the end. But they should have been out there with Monahan, Gaudreau, Lindholm, and Giordano.My bad. I was listening on the radio, and they must not have touched the puck because I only heard Lucic, Bennett and Gustafsson's name called out.

[Joborule]

My biggest fear is that they scrap by into a wildcard spot get hot at the right time winning a round and the team feels they need to keep him on as head coach.

You would hope though that even by the small chance the team makes it past round 1 if they do make playoffs, that the player exit interviews would make it known to Brad that there has to be changes behind the bench; most importantly with the head coach. I can't imagine the players are happy with Ward for not calling a timeout, and putting your scoring line back on when they've just pulled it within one.

Like seriously, I still can't get over that. WTF was that? "Thanks for the goal guys, now I'm gonna send the other line out with 30 seconds left, and not set up a plan."

[GioforPM]

No it is 4, Flames made the third round in their first season in Calgary

The list of coaches who went more than one round more than once is Tiny.

[djsFlames]

Too much faith upstairs in "their guys"

It's getting in the way of their intellectual honesty (salutes the general direction of feaster)

Loyal to a fault. Ward isn't (yet) cut out for this spot. It's not even what he signed up for here to begin with. Get a guy that's here to coach the whole thing.

[Fan in Exile]

Ward just trolled you all. Putting Bennett and Lucic out there in the last minute was just to distract you from the inexplicable decision to start Rittich. Bizarre lineup decisions ever since he took over.

[zamler]

This really does feel like Glue Gun and Butter hockey all over again.

[Aarongavey]

This really does feel like Glue Gun and Butter hockey all over again.

I prefer to call it Flames hockey. Been this way since about 95. There was the the Hartley season, 2004, the 2006 regular season and the regular season last year which were abnormalities, but the rest of the Flames seasons since 1995 are pretty similar to this season. Some years it was clear we were not good enough early on, one year they started 11 games over .500 and found a way to miss the playoffs, a lot of years the Flames were close all year but with objectively tough math to make the playoffs. The Flames over the past 25 years have had many different paths to mediocrity, nonetheless this season feels like a typical Flames season to me.

[jlh2640]

Close but close doesn’t count when you’ve done this all year.

[Erick Estrada]

I prefer to call it Flames hockey. Been this way since about 95. There was the the Hartley season, 2004, the 2006 regular season and the regular season last year which were abnormalities, but the rest of the Flames seasons since 1995 are pretty similar to this season. Some years it was clear we were not good enough early on, one year they started 11 games over .500 and found a way to miss the playoffs, a lot of years the Flames were close all year but with objectively tough math to make the playoffs. The Flames over the past 25 years have had many different paths to mediocrity, nonetheless this season feels like a typical Flames season to me.

Pretty much. They will probably finish 9th, 2 or 3 points out of 8th due to the really costly losses earlier in the season against bottom feeder teams like the Kings, Habs, Senators, etc. All they had to do was show up in those games and they are comfortably in a playoff spot unlikely to miss the playoffs.

[MisterJoji]

A one goal loss to an elite team like the Lightning isn’t the end of the world but man that extra point against the Predators would’ve been huge. Rittich has been fighting it lately. Don’t know if it’s just fatigue or what, but he was stellar to start the year and has been really bad the last few weeks. I still think we’ll make the playoffs, just based on how weak our division is. Team isn’t good enough to be a real threat but isn’t bad enough to miss either. Just another typical remarkably average Flames season. Barring a miracle run where they win a couple rounds, Ward will almost assuredly be kicked back down to associate coach in the offseason. The roster has some dangerous weapons but we need an established coach to help lead them. GG, Laviolette, Boudreau, there’s some really good names available. Tre getting one those guys and a legitimate starting goalie will be huge. Those are the two most obvious glaring holes right now. Win tomorrow and it’s a 3-1-1 road trip. Not bad.

[Flash Walken]

Pretty much. They will probably finish 9th, 2 or 3 points out of 8th due to the really costly losses earlier in the season against bottom feeder teams like the Kings, Habs, Senators, etc. All they had to do was show up in those games and they are comfortably in a playoff spot unlikely to miss the playoffs.

ugh, that sens game before the all-star break

5-2 sens, Rittich .800 sv%

[Aarongavey]

ugh, that sens game before the all-star break

5-2 sens, Rittich .800 sv%

Fun game to be at, almost as good as their effort in Montreal 4 days earlier.

[Freddy]

All the belly aching by posters for Ward not taking a time out to get our ‘top’ line out is kind of funny as our most effective (ie: top) line right now is definitely Backs-Chucky-Mangiapane. In fact I’d say the Monahan-Gaudreau-Lindholm line looks like it’s being sheltered from matchups with opposing top lines because of their ineffectiveness at controlling the puck on zone entries (they’re not good at dump & chase either) and Johnny’s constant turnovers. By all means put them out there for offensive zone faceoffs & powerplays, but I’m not convinced they are our best options when battle levels are high and the best players are on the ice for the opposition.
I’d say the losses in Nashville & Tampa are a result of force feeding Forbort & Gustafsson minutes to get them acclimated to systems. Forbort looks a bit out of game shape & rusty while Gustafsson has been defensively suspect as advertised.

This last stretch is an accurate reflection of who the Flames are, a bubble team who will be lucky to steal a round if they make it to the dance.

[Joborule]

A one goal loss to an elite team like the Lightning isn’t the end of the world but man that extra point against the Predators would’ve been huge. Rittich has been fighting it lately. Don’t know if it’s just fatigue or what, but he was stellar to start the year and has been really bad the last few weeks. I still think we’ll make the playoffs, just based on how weak our division is. Team isn’t good enough to be a real threat but isn’t bad enough to miss either. Just another typical remarkably average Flames season. Barring a miracle run where they win a couple rounds, Ward will almost assuredly be kicked back down to associate coach in the offseason. The roster has some dangerous weapons but we need an established coach to help lead them. GG, Laviolette, Boudreau, there’s some really good names available. Tre getting one those guys and a legitimate starting goalie will be huge. Those are the two most obvious glaring holes right now. Win tomorrow and it’s a 3-1-1 road trip. Not bad.
If Ward is the coach who has a handle on the PP though, he shouldn't be anywhere near the organization at the start of next season.

World's worst entry ever.

[AustinL_NHL]

Not pinning this loss on Rittich because the Flames were completely outplayed, but in his last 10 games since the bat flip, Rittich has a sub-.900 save percentage in 6 of those games, including a sub-.800 save percentage in 2 of them

[memphusk]

Geoff Ward is a Dave Lewis.

[heep223]

Tampa was diving all over the ice today. Bunch of cheating losers.

[Erick Estrada]

Not pinning this loss on Rittich because the Flames were completely outplayed, but in his last 10 games since the bat flip, Rittich has a sub-.900 save percentage in 6 of those games, including a sub-.800 save percentage in 2 of them

He's not a 2nd half of the season type of guy. He's slumped in the 2nd half of all three of his NHL seasons. He's at best a 1B goaltender as the GM needs to upgrade this position in the offseason.

[GranteedEV]

Rittich has been fighting it lately.

It was by no means Rittich's best game but the goals he allowed were

Netfront PP tip x 2
2 on 1 top corner snipe (the third such rush in a minute span)
breakaway with tons of time


I'd argue he was the better goalie today and the only reason the score was so close.

And yes the Lightning hit a few posts - but posts are not the area the goalie is supposed to prevent pucks from going.

[Aarongavey]

Geoff Ward is a Dave Lewis.

Dave Lewis coached immediately after a hall of famer. Ward coaches after a guy who will have accumulated one playoff victory in his entire NHL coaching career.

[soulchoice]

I wonder when Kylington draws in next again? Not that he would have been the difference maker, but am curious.

As far as the lack of a timeout call, I am baffled.

[memphusk]

Dave Lewis coached immediately after a hall of famer. Ward coaches after a guy who will have accumulated one playoff victory in his entire NHL coaching career.

You're correct. That said, both of them will always be known as good assistant's

[GioforPM]

All the belly aching by posters for Ward not taking a time out to get our ‘top’ line out is kind of funny as our most effective (ie: top) line right now is definitely Backs-Chucky-Mangiapane. In fact I’d say the Monahan-Gaudreau-Lindholm line looks like it’s being sheltered from matchups with opposing top lines because of their ineffectiveness at controlling the puck on zone entries (they’re not good at dump & chase either) and Johnny’s constant turnovers. By all means put them out there for offensive zone faceoffs & powerplays, but I’m not convinced they are our best options when battle levels are high and the best players are on the ice for the opposition.
I’d say the losses in Nashville & Tampa are a result of force feeding Forbort & Gustafsson minutes to get them acclimated to systems. Forbort looks a bit out of game shape & rusty while Gustafsson has been defensively suspect as advertised.

This last stretch is an accurate reflection of who the Flames are, a bubble team who will be lucky to steal a round if they make it to the dance.

I suppose the end of the game call by Ward, in the face of JG’s insistent timeout requests, might have been a message to the “top line”. I’m not agreeing with it, and I didn’t get to see the majority of the game (just the last 10m). But that could have been it. That said, I’m not sure why since they’d just potted the 3rd goal.

I do get why Lucic was out to stand in front of the net. I mean, making people fall all over the place worked for Nashville.

[D as in David]

Terrible game by Tkachuk. Looks like he's gunning for the giveaway crown the past couple of games.

Agreed. Tkachuk has been quite sloppy with the puck the last number of games.

[FanIn80]

Is there a clip somewhere of Johnny calling for a timeout?

[JohnnyB]

Not sure how Ward doesn't take a timeout and come back with the top line. Also, that should have been an intentional offside with a faceoff in the attacking zone to close out the game.

Totally OT, I'm just amazed to see the username Iginla was still available in Feb 2020 for a new board member.

[browna]

Just watched highlights from the Tampa feed.
Have to say it, Rittich played ok but he lost his net on the 3rd goal, and that was a backbreaking one. Tampa color guy said maybe it’s because he was to fired up from earlier when he entered the scrum.
Like last year and the year before, he’s regressing under the pressure down the stretch. Like last year, glad we have a vet as the other option, and let’s hope Talbot gets on a bit of a roll starting tomorrow.

As far as the Ward debate, but he should’ve been replaced as interim coach around the ASG. He’s a players coach, but this franchise has always needed task masters, givenwith how well the players get treated by then organization (or whatever it is). Playfair was a disaster after Sutter, Brent Sutter was so so in the task master department, and of course GG also let the inmates run the asylum, certainly in the second year.

Ward is the same, the fresh air bump they got from him was fine for 2 months, but the team needs a guy in the same vein as Hartley and Peters, obviously with a little more tact than both, to smarten guys up the up front and honest way.


Stuck with him now, and, a win tomorrow is almost essential if this team is going to make the playoffs again an FLA team that also played today, especially with the dropped point in Nashville souring this trip.

[zamler]

Is there a clip somewhere of Johnny calling for a timeout?

https://streamable.com/snt7u

[mile]

https://streamable.com/snt7u

He signalled it 3 times :confused:

[zamler]

Is Ward all there? The most obvious stuff you'd think a coach would do he doesn't, just stands there lost in space.

[dissentowner]

I think Bruce Boudreau ends up being the guy. I think Seattle will lock up GG early. I don't think PL wants to coach in Canada.

[midniteowl]

Is Ward all there? The most obvious stuff you'd think a coach would do he doesn't, just stands there lost in space.


May be he figured he knows better than Johnny. :confused:

[browna]

Just seeing this now, Ward with a major blunder.
May it not be said now (nor was it previous year if you watched JG live and how upset he was at losing and not just what they show you on TV) that JG doesn’t want to win and is going through the motions or is disengaged. He gave MT a tap on the pads to say “it’s coming”, then Ward yanks them.

[Flash Walken]

https://streamable.com/snt7u

this is some mike babcock ####

The flames bottom 2 lines got absolutely filled in during this game and basically generated 0 offense. Let's put them out when we are desperate for a goal with our season potentially on the line.

[Manhattanboy]

I would not be surprised if JG wants out of this circus.

[sa226]

I don't know if it's fair game to ask Ward in a presser why he didn't take a time out. But I'd very much like to hear the answer.

Sent from my SM-G973W using Tapatalk

[cam_wmh]

this is some mike babcock ####

The flames bottom 2 lines got absolutely filled in during this game and basically generated 0 offense. Let's put them out when we are desperate for a goal with our season potentially on the line.

As much as we pile on Francis, this is an opportune time for him to be his traditional contrarian self, and pile on the Flames Management and Ward over this.

That is one of the most elementary examples to use a time out.

[zamler]

I would not be surprised if JG wants out of this circus.
I want out but this team is my Hotel California.

[bizaro86]

Looking at their remaining schedule I see them playing around .500 hockey which probably won't be good enough to hold on to the last wildcard spot.

The central teams they are competing with for the spot have hard schedules playing lots of central teams playing meaningful games.

As an example: Nashville plays the wild 3 times, the stars twice, avalanche twice, and the jets once.

Given the difference between first second in central for quality of round 1 opponent, I'd expect the avalanche to play hard to the end, and the jets and wild are their competition for the spot.

[zamler]

Yotes score 5 unanswered and win. Jets sucks. Things look rather grim right now.

[FanIn80]

https://streamable.com/snt7u

Un-friggin-believable.

[CSharp]

I would not be surprised if JG wants out of this circus.

Right now, I wouldn't care. He's just a perimeter guy not wanting any physical contact and will not even go into the boards if he knows there's a defender near him. It's like the last minute of play with 6 guys out with an empty net, no one is the dirty area of the opposition net. Everyone pretty much on the perimeter. Pretty pathetic. Tampa played a perfect box knowing that no Flames forwards are brave enough to penetrate their box.

[The Cobra]

I’m not saying I agree, but the reason not to take a time out is to keep the best defensive players on TB on the bench. Perhaps Ward thought the match up was better.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Aarongavey]

I’m not saying I agree, but the reason not to take a time out is to keep the best defensive players on TB on the bench. Perhaps Ward thought the match up was better.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Having Lucic on the ice to score a goal is really unforgivable. There is no world where keeping good defensive players on Tampa’s bench is a better option than having Lucic and company on the ice.

[Huntingwhale]

Even worse than no time out was no shots on net that entire sequence. Brutal.

[Manhattanboy]

Right now, I wouldn't care. He's just a perimeter guy not wanting any physical contact and will not even go into the boards if he knows there's a defender near him. It's like the last minute of play with 6 guys out with an empty net, no one is the dirty area of the opposition net. Everyone pretty much on the perimeter. Pretty pathetic. Tampa played a perfect box knowing that no Flames forwards are brave enough to penetrate their box.

Ya it was so obvious on the 6 on 5. Not one Flame near the net or in the slot. TB players totally boxed us to the outside. This is why we need a coach.

[djsFlames]

I don't know if it's fair game to ask Ward in a presser why he didn't take a time out. But I'd very much like to hear the answer.

Sent from my SM-G973W using Tapatalk

Calgary media is too spineless to ask the tough questions. And if they do then they dress it up in such a harmless, inoffensive way that it gives them an easy out / way around it.

[DazzlinDino]

Ya it was so obvious on the 6 on 5. Not one Flame near the net or in the slot. TB players totally boxed us to the outside. This is why we need a coach.

I noticed that too, didn't they learn anything from the Nashville game!? Crash the net!

[Robo]

I wasn't really following the game today but reading cp it sounds like ward made some bone headed decisions seems like he fits right in with this organization

[drewtastic]

It’s like existing in a perpetual state of Groundhog Day, cheering for this team...

Same song for at least a decade...

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200301/65187062ee13d4cbb11aceb42f91d242.jpg

[combustiblefuel]

I want out but this team is my Hotel California.

Me too bit with Seattle so close I may have a light at the tunnel. Never could cheer for the Canucks but Seattle could open a exit ramp at year 26 of my flame relationship.

[81MC]

That final faceoff should have been in the offence zone.
Flames were outplayed most of the game.
Mangiapane is awesome.
Like to see the flames being a physical, chirpy team.
Flames need to start getting quality chances from their offensive zone time. Poor low percentage passing and a lack of drive to the net.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Me too bit with Seattle so close I may have a light at the tunnel. Never could cheer for the Canucks but Seattle could open a exit ramp at year 26 of my flame relationship.

I've been a fan for longer and I could never imagine just switching allegiances.

Yes, there's been some tough times. But when they do hoist the big silver mug again it will just make it all the sweeter.

It's entertainment. Some days are rough, some are fun. It's a roller coaster. Just try to enjoy the ride.

[UKflames]

I am pleased to see that we have manged to stop Bennett's little flash of good play, we wouldn't want that on a regular basis. Keep him on the wing, he does far to well at centre.

[BigBrodieFan]

I guess I am the type of sports fan who wants my team to win every year. Rebuilding in my opinion, is BS and not something a professional team should do. This is why I loved the Broncos with Pat Bowlen as owner- he made it a point to be a contender EVERY SINGLE YEAR. His philosophy- if you aren’t a SB contender every year, it’s a failure and you have to strive to make it all the way the next year. Having said that, there is no way I would ever cheer for the Flames to not make the playoffs for future ‘maybes.’ I am going to cheer for our boys to make the playoffs and win, regardless if it’s an unpopular opinion. Life is too short to hope your team loses.

I am having a little family party for today’s game and we will all be cheering the boys on come hell or high water! Go Flames!

[GioforPM]

I am pleased to see that we have manged to stop Bennett's little flash of good play, we wouldn't want that on a regular basis. Keep him on the wing, he does far to well at centre.

Bennett has no control over his good or bad play I guess? For example, I don’t see how Bennett’s position made him take that dumb penalty the other night.

[CGY12]

I've been a fan for longer and I could never imagine just switching allegiances.

Yes, there's been some tough times. But when they do hoist the big silver mug again it will just make it all the sweeter.

It's entertainment. Some days are rough, some are fun. It's a roller coaster. Just try to enjoy the ride.

Some? Try all (minus 04), i'm 33 and don't remember the late 80s.

[CalgaryFan1988]

Bennett has no control over his good or bad play I guess? For example, I don’t see how Bennett’s position made him take that dumb penalty the other night.

Bennett puts his stick in a bad spot, the player holds it and falls down.
Dube puts his free hand on a player, player holds it and falls down.

Bennett is an "idiot" and Dube got a "weak call" against him, funny how it works in here sometimes.

[ricardodw]

On the coaches no time out and putting out Bennett Lucic Backlund Gustavafson Hanifin and Mangiapane:

Victor Hedman finished the game with a 4:11 shift

I think that Ward was fully expecting for Tampa to call a time out to rest their best defenseman and if they didn't there should be an expectation that Lucic/Bennett would be able to physically dominate the dog tired Hedman.

Most of the last minute game tying goals involve physical play in the scoring zone in front of the net.

The only other options for the 2nd "wave" of offense talent to replace Bennett/Lucic would be Ryan and Brodie.

Who would have thought that the Flames from 2018-19 would turn out to be so short of scoring depth. Pretty sure that Ward would have put out Toffoli or Coleman or Pageau or .... one of the several top-6 guys that other teams added

[powderjunkie]

I’m not saying I agree, but the reason not to take a time out is to keep the best defensive players on TB on the bench. Perhaps Ward thought the match up was better.


This wasn't an icing...Tampa could and did change. Everyone but Hedman, who had been on the ice for the last 3-4 minutes, and stayed out. Who are the Selke matchups we were avoiding? I think it was the Cirelli line before that; they might be Tampas 'shut-down' line, though I'm not sure any of the lines really standout in that regard?

My only guess is that Ward thought Hedman would come off or be gassed. Weird to downgrade 5 players to work around 1.

It’s like existing in a perpetual state of Groundhog Day, cheering for this team...

Same song for at least a decade...

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200301/65187062ee13d4cbb11aceb42f91d242.jpg

Gio's quote is interesting...normal 'hockey talk' focuses on "60 mins"...Gio might be signalling about the last few minutes...or last minute in particular

[Erick Estrada]

It could be possible he's referencing the previous game where the Preds in fact did that and the Flames could not in their next game.

[GioforPM]

Bennett puts his stick in a bad spot, the player holds it and falls down.
Dube puts his free hand on a player, player holds it and falls down.

Bennett is an "idiot" and Dube got a "weak call" against him, funny how it works in here sometimes.

A. That’s a super generous interpretation of what Bennett did (for no real reason).

B. I never said anything about young Dube. When there’s some huge demand for Dube to play centre let me know.

[Harry Lime]

After the first four forwards left the ice, the next best talent would be Mangiapane, Dube (not on the ice), Bennett (at center to crash the net), and Ryan (tenacious and good puck control). Backlund has never been good in these situations, for whatever reason, and Lucic doesn't really cycle the puck well because of his slow pivot.

Does Ward not know his own players?

[Harry Lime]

A. That’s a super generous interpretation of what Bennett did (for no real reason).

B. I never said anything about young Dube. When there’s some huge demand for Dube to play centre let me know.
A. Bennett reached around, but the player fell on his own, which he had done two times already that game, trying to draw a penalty. Bennett fault here was that he should have known Blackwood was playing a dirty game.

B. I'd rather have Dube or Bennett at center instead of Jankowski.

[GioforPM]

A. Bennett reached around, but the player fell on his own, which he had done two times already that game, trying to draw a penalty. Bennett fault here was that he should have known Blackwood was playing a dirty game.

B. I'd rather have Dube or Bennett at center instead of Jankowski.

Id be happy to see Jankowski out of the lineup. I suspect the only reason he’s at C instead of Bennett on that line is that they’ve tried in practice and he’s hopeless. So while Bennett is better at C it might be more than offset by putting Jankowski on wing. My solution would be to cut bait on him and bring up Gawain, Quine or even use Rinaldo

[GranteedEV]

Bennett has no control over his good or bad play I guess? For example, I don’t see how Bennett’s position made him take that dumb penalty the other night.

He was F1 when he took the penalty you're referring to. Typically as a center he would have been F3 or F2 and far less aggressive on the man, because he would have linemates to play the man. Bennett's far better at covering a zone and picking off passing lanes than he is at trying to body guys and pickpocket them, the latter resulting in overaggressive penalties.

He's also far more patient with more ice time than he is with less icetime. When he falls down the lineup he gets frustrated and sulks. Of course the solution around here is to ship him off for not being a perfectly mature vet as if he's not actually a 23 year old with higher expectations of himself than a checking winger.

I don't think Bennett is helpful to this team as a 4LW. Those penalties aren't removed from that.

I think he is helpful to this team in roles down the middle that give him confidence, patience, and responsibility. When is the last time he took a poor penalty at center? Probably back when Troy Brouwer was on his wing because Brouwer was just so useless on the forecheck. I also think he could help on either side of special teams yet he is trotted out there like Zac Rinaldo. In the previous game for instance people were whining about his 1 on 3 rush. How about the fact that he backchecked like a madman to break up what could have been a tip in for Palat, and then started the breakout right away? I think that has value even if you have to tolerate a failed rush. He isn't the only player who gets caught one on three.

Now, if you are referring to after-the-whistle stuff - Bennett is a hothead and I wouldn't want it any other way. You need a few guys like that.

[djsFlames]

I've been a fan for longer and I could never imagine just switching allegiances.

Yes, there's been some tough times. But when they do hoist the big silver mug again it will just make it all the sweeter.

It's entertainment. Some days are rough, some are fun. It's a roller coaster. Just try to enjoy the ride.

I've gained a slight fondness for the Canes, which was helped by their play in front of and treatment of Ayres.

They're far enough removed from the Flames that they feel like a safe #2 in case the wheels fall off this thing.

Flames are for life though. Even if they're being held back right now by a GM and coach that won't give them the best opportunity to succeed. I admire how much the top guys have dug in in recent weeks and I hope they don't quit now, even though it feels like they up against it.

Teams catch lightning in a bottle every year at just the right time. If they can keep that mojo and not get discouraged by games like the last two, the breaks will eventually go their way.

Here's to saving garbage bag day until at least may this year, in a season when nobody is expecting it. Gfg!

[Aarongavey]

After the first four forwards left the ice, the next best talent would be Mangiapane, Dube (not on the ice), Bennett (at center to crash the net), and Ryan (tenacious and good puck control). Backlund has never been good in these situations, for whatever reason, and Lucic doesn't really cycle the puck well because of his slow pivot.

Does Ward not know his own players?

Pretty sure the way they Backlund is playing right now he should be in your first 6 players let alone the second 6.

[GranteedEV]

Id be happy to see Jankowski out of the lineup. I suspect the only reason he’s at C instead of Bennett on that line is that they’ve tried in practice and he’s hopeless. So while Bennett is better at C it might be more than offset by putting Jankowski on wing. My solution would be to cut bait on him and bring up Gawain, Quine or even use Rinaldo

Jankowski has been used on the wing, both in college and in the AHL. He was perfectly competent at it. Even his powerplay role on the AHL squad was more of a winger type of role, and I feel his penalty kill role also represents that.

If Bob Hartley could convert Joe Colborne to wing, there's no reason a more intelligent player like Jankowski couldn't succeed there, after a short adjustment period.

The team's inflexibility is nothing new. The last three coaches have all suffered from this.

[Bingo]

Hey guys sorry for the lack of game story ... busy kids hockey weekend with city championships etc.

Whizzed through the game when I got home and didn't have the energy.

My late thoughts ...

- score flattered Calgary.
- Rittich still not "on" to me. Don't blame him on the first two, but that fourth one in particular has to be stopped
- odd no time out call, laughed reading all your reactions this morning
- team didn't quit, but they were pretty rough defensively.
- Hanifin had a tough afternoon in particular

Some stats

- the best one? Tampa 8-0 in high danger chances. Giving up 8 actually isn't bad, but only getting one???!??
- in all play it was 13-2 Tampa, which meets the eye test
- Bottom six got filled in by Tampa ... 20-35% for all of them.
- Bottom pairing was outstanding, led the team with 56% CF%
- Backlund line and Lindholm good games as well

Rittich ...

- now ranked 39th in GSAA and slipping
- since Jan 1 he's 56th out of 63 goalies that have played 250 minutes

[GranteedEV]

that fourth one in particular has to be stopped

The breakaway where the guy had time to deke around Rittich without a checker in his vicinity?

[Strange Brew]

Yeah the Rittich last season slides are a concern. Excuses have surfaced in last two years but sure looks like it could be a pattern. Going to be hard to trust him as a playoff goalie.

[rooster]

Johnny Gaudreau was calling for a timeout but the coach did not listen.

I try not to rag on coaches but that was a horrible mistake.

Sure we got out played. Yet maybe we tie it up with .1 seconds left.

Terrible coaching decision. No reason not to call a timeout!

If that is true that johnny could recognize the situation and Ward couldn't Ward needs to be replaced today. Rittich needs to sit for a while. You can't let those squeakers go between the arm and body. He is letting that happen every game.

[rooster]

I'm not sure if anybody has mentioned it yet, but why doesn't Ward use his timeouts? Should he not have used a timeout to keep his bestest players on the ice with less than a minute left and only one goal is needed to tie it up? Mind bottling.

He is too busy staring at that F&^%$# video screen in the floor!!

[Bingo]

The breakaway where the guy had time to deke around Rittich without a checker in his vicinity?

Sorry ...maybe I meant the third one when he got beat post and in from outside home plate.

[Joborule]

Rittich ...

- now ranked 39th in GSAA and slipping
- since Jan 1 he's 56th out of 63 goalies that have played 250 minutes

This really elaborates that Talbot needs to be given more of a opportunity to become the primary starter. Rittich simply isn't fulfilling that role anymore.

[Erick Estrada]

Rittich ...

- now ranked 39th in GSAA and slipping
- since Jan 1 he's 56th out of 63 goalies that have played 250 minutes

That's some sobering evidence that Treliving still has his work cut out for him in the offseason. Goaltending simply isn't good enough.

[browntrout]

Brad Tre, look at Tempa and you learn how to build a winning team. By the way, spend some money to get a top 6 winger. Your current first line is not going to cut it.

I do like the speed that Tampa Bay has developed in there players...Tampa learned to build a winning team by drafting 1 st overall like 3 times in the last 20 years...if they don't win those lotteries...they are not the "winning team" you have described... IMO

[Flame On]

Nice to see some data behind the goalie slide, to hold up to the knee-jerk "its not the goalie's fault" points. Of course it's a team game but we'e seeing a pattern where Rittich is not a difference maker in terms of team wins, and is at least helping with team losses.

[Jiri Hrdina]

That's some sobering evidence that Treliving still has his work cut out for him in the offseason. Goaltending simply isn't good enough.

Yup and adds a new wrinkle to the whole Johnny/Hall things.
Can you afford a new goalie + Johnny
Can you afford a new goalie + Hall if you trade Johnny
Do you use Johnny to trade for a proper #1.

Big decisions ahead.

[Bingo]

Flames are 14th in team save percentage on the season.

21st in team save percentage since January 1st.

But that's not all on goaltending the team since January 1st is ...

17th in xGA/60
21st in SCA/60

They are 12th in HDCA/60, so they've limited the high danger stuff to a large degree.

[btimbit]

That's some sobering evidence that Treliving still has his work cut out for him in the offseason. Goaltending simply isn't good enough.

LOVE Rittich, but man, you had a chance to grab Lehner last year and missed, don't lose that opportunity again.

[Coach]

The only rationale I can come up with for forgoing the timeout is that Ward did want Tampa to be able rest their top PK unit. It's still dumb and shows fear of the competition vs trusting your team to close it out. We have multiple players with a history of late, clutch goals. Monahan, Tkachuk, Giordano and Gaudreau have all had golden times in the dying minutes of games. And especially with Gaudreau basically begging to stay on after having full sustained pressure like that. Yeah I don't know. Bad move. It feels like I've said this before. Did Gulutzan do this exact same thing once?

I think bringing Laviolette in would light a fire under Gaudreau. He was the coach of what were likely his favorite Flyers teams.

[Bingo]

I just hope the fan base this summer doesn't jump to the conclusion that any coach not hired was a possibility.

I think some are ear marked for specific markets (Gallant), and others have hinted that North of the border is no go.

[Erick Estrada]

Yup and adds a new wrinkle to the whole Johnny/Hall things.
Can you afford a new goalie + Johnny
Can you afford a new goalie + Hall if you trade Johnny
Do you use Johnny to trade for a proper #1.

Big decisions ahead.

I'm all aboard the Markstrom train if the Canucks are foolish enough to let him hit free agency. It seems Flames defenses rarely ever live up to their billing so I would rather solidify goaltending than shuffle the deck chairs on defense and go with the same goaltenders. The exact same defensive group they have today (minus Brodie, plus Valimaki) in front of Markstrom would be better than overpaying a guy like Barrie and praying that Rittich will have a season where he doesn't melt down in the 2nd half.

[Erick Estrada]

I just hope the fan base this summer doesn't jump to the conclusion that any coach not hired was a possibility.

I think some are ear marked for specific markets (Gallant), and others have hinted that North of the border is no go.

Yep. Laviolette likely won't be coming to Calgary and while that sucks, it's not the organization's fault as you can't force an American to move to Canada.

[AC]

I just hope the fan base this summer doesn't jump to the conclusion that any coach not hired was a possibility.

I think some are ear marked for specific markets (Gallant), and others have hinted that North of the border is no go.

Agreed. It's the same as criticizing Treliving for not landing a UFA or trading for a player that has a NTC without knowing if coming to Calgary is a non-starter. Unfortunately Calgary simply isn't a highly desirable location.

[Flash Walken]

I do like the speed that Tampa Bay has developed in there players...Tampa learned to build a winning team by drafting 1 st overall like 3 times in the last 20 years...if they don't win those lotteries...they are not the "winning team" you have described... IMO

Wow, imagine that, a team letting themselves be bad instead of moving a ####load of draft picks to 'make a run' at 10th place.

There are 7 rounds in a draft. Over a 10 year period if you kept all your own picks, you'd make 70 selections.

Guess how many Tampa has made in the last 10?

81

In that span they've been contending, with 3 conference finals appearances and a trip to the cup final

Guess how many draft picks the flames have made?

67

In that span they've made the second round 1 time

I WONDER IF THAT IS A CONCIDENCE

What if, and this is probably a crazy theory, but what if the success tampa has had is because they are a well run organization and the lack of success the flames have had is because they are a very badly run organization?

[Erick Estrada]

The Flames have traded away way too many draft picks over the years. Even this deadline Treliving casually traded away their 3rd and 4th round picks for depth players. That all adds up over time especially after the crippling trade for Hamonic that cost the Flames a lot in draft capital. As the days and weeks go by, the more I tire of the current GM's growing pile of mistakes.

[djsFlames]

The Flames have traded away way too many draft picks over the years. Even this deadline Treliving casually traded away their 3rd and 4th round picks for depth players. That all adds up over time especially after the crippling trade for Hamonic that cost the Flames a lot in draft capital. As the days and weeks go by, the more I tire of the current GM's growing pile of mistakes.

They have the 4th from buffalo. Forbort is next year's 4th.

Extending Gustafsson who isn't old and can help their offence at D justifies the 3rd IMO. I didn't mind that move. And if Neal draws back in for enough games...

They could've done a lot worse in terms of spending assets. It didn't gut them.

Maybe they can move one of the UFA dmen for a pick for early negotiation rights, like what the Flames did for Wideman.

[Erick Estrada]

They have the 4th from buffalo. Forbort is next year's 4th.

Extending Gustafsson who isn't old and can help their offence at D justifies the 3rd IMO. I didn't mind that move. And if Neal draws back in for enough games...

They could've done a lot worse in terms of spending assets. It didn't gut them.

Maybe they can move one of the UFA dmen for a pick for early negotiation rights, like what the Flames did for Wideman.

I don't mind kicking the tires on Gustafsson because they need a powerplay QB bad. I imagine that he will be doing just that at the deadline for Brodie and maybe Hamonic (I hope).

[Strange Brew]

They have the 4th from buffalo. Forbort is next year's 4th.

Extending Gustafsson who isn't old and can help their offence at D justifies the 3rd IMO. I didn't mind that move. And if Neal draws back in for enough games...

They could've done a lot worse in terms of spending assets. It didn't gut them.

Maybe they can move one of the UFA dmen for a pick for early negotiation rights, like what the Flames did for Wideman.

Those moves can be defended in isolation, I agree. It’s the totality over the years of resorting to using your draft picks as currency to trade for middle or bottom of the roster players.

[djsFlames]

This really elaborates that Talbot needs to be given more of a opportunity to become the primary starter. Rittich simply isn't fulfilling that role anymore.

Rittich was excellent in the first half both last year and this year before slowly dropping off.

Tells me he's a great 1B being used like a starter. Has some elite ability but doesn't yet have the longevity to handle a starter workload.

Can he turn a corner in the final 6 weeks and show he's taken a step beyond that? Sure but until then that's where hes at.

[Aarongavey]

Wow, imagine that, a team letting themselves be bad instead of moving a ####load of draft picks to 'make a run' at 10th place.

There are 7 rounds in a draft. Over a 10 year period if you kept all your own picks, you'd make 70 selections.

Guess how many Tampa has made in the last 10?

81

In that span they've been contending, with 3 conference finals appearances and a trip to the cup final

Guess how many draft picks the flames have made?

67

In that span they've made the second round 1 time

I WONDER IF THAT IS A CONCIDENCE

What if, and this is probably a crazy theory, but what if the success tampa has had is because they are a well run organization and the lack of success the flames have had is because they are a very badly run organization?

Someone has been day drinking. If we kept the picks we would not have Elliott, Smith, lazar and Hamonic (let alone Stone and Fattenberg). Do you want to live in that world?

The frightening thing is that when the Sens likely hit on their picks this year they will probably be in a position by 2023 to say that they have made multiple deep runs over the past 6 years and everyone seems to think they are a dumpster fire. They already have a complete stud dman and one pretty good forward to build around. They are going to get 3-4 more pieces this summer at the draft in all likelihood. I suspect they will be another example of why you build through the draft, especially when you are a small market Canadian team.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Agreed. It's the same as criticizing Treliving for not landing a UFA or trading for a player that has a NTC without knowing if coming to Calgary is a non-starter. Unfortunately Calgary simply isn't a highly desirable location.If the coaches don't want to sign in Calgary, that's fair. My issue is, Treliving didn't even look at anyone besides Peters last time. He didn't even attempt to interview another coach.

That's totally different to me.

[CalgaryFan1988]

A. That’s a super generous interpretation of what Bennett did (for no real reason).

B. I never said anything about young Dube. When there’s some huge demand for Dube to play centre let me know.

I wasn't referring to you specifically, just the general consensus.

[GranteedEV]

Sorry ...maybe I meant the third one when he got beat post and in from outside home plate.

It was saveable, but I wouldn't call it a softy. The Bolts player was coming in with speed on his offwing on an odd man rush, with the other bolts player crashing the net hard.

I though Vasilevskiy gave up two worse goals. We didn't lose yesterday because we had the worse goalie. We lost because the better team won.

[Bingo]

They have the 4th from buffalo. Forbort is next year's 4th.

Extending Gustafsson who isn't old and can help their offence at D justifies the 3rd IMO. I didn't mind that move. And if Neal draws back in for enough games...

They could've done a lot worse in terms of spending assets. It didn't gut them.

Maybe they can move one of the UFA dmen for a pick for early negotiation rights, like what the Flames did for Wideman.

Yeah I wouldn't even call them depth as much as needed with the injuries, especially with Mangiapane coming on and filling the hole up front.

They basically air mailed in a bottom third league second pairing to be a third pairing, patched the hole with Hamonic gone long term, and added a PK and PP guy to take some minutes off of Giordano as he tries to get up to speed.

The could have just sold, but if they wanted to help their playoff chances the moves were pretty smart in my mind.

[Flash Walken]

Someone has been day drinking. If we kept the picks we would not have Elliott, Smith, lazar and Hamonic (let alone Stone and Fattenberg). Do you want to live in that world?

The frightening thing is that when the Sens likely hit on their picks this year they will probably be in a position by 2023 to say that they have made multiple deep runs over the past 6 years and everyone seems to think they are a dumpster fire. They already have a complete stud dman and one pretty good forward to build around. They are going to get 3-4 more pieces this summer at the draft in all likelihood. I suspect they will be another example of why you build through the draft, especially when you are a small market Canadian team.
Which team makes a conference finals appearance first, the Flames or the Kings?

Flames or the Sens?

Flames or the Rangers?

[Jiri Hrdina]

Which team makes a conference finals appearance first, the Flames or the Kings?

Flames or the Sens?

Flames or the Rangers?

Impossible to predict but the Kings and Sens have a LOT of work to do - both organizations lack top end talent.
The Sens in particular have Chabot and not much else, including in their prospect base. They have a deep prospect pool, but there's not a lot of top line potential there. They should get at least two good pieces this year, but they have long-term gaps basically across their roster.
Same with the Kings.

I like how the Rangers are positioned, particularly because they have high end talent in all positions, and the advantage of being in a market that seems like is attractive to talent.

I know your narrative is that they need to engage in a complete re-build but I don't see it. They have a lot of pieces in place already.

[djsFlames]

Yeah I wouldn't even call them depth as much as needed with the injuries, especially with Mangiapane coming on and filling the hole up front.

They basically air mailed in a bottom third league second pairing to be a third pairing, patched the hole with Hamonic gone long term, and added a PK and PP guy to take some minutes off of Giordano as he tries to get up to speed.

The could have just sold, but if they wanted to help their playoff chances the moves were pretty smart in my mind.

Yeah, it was a decent TDL for them given current needs as well as future.

Just wish they weren't so negligent when it came to the coaching side of things.

[GioforPM]

I wasn't referring to you specifically, just the general consensus.

OK, but still, who has been calling for Dube to get a bigger role (be it moving to C or up a line),

[Flash Walken]

Impossible to predict but the Kings and Sens have a LOT of work to do - both organizations lack top end talent.
The Sens in particular have Chabot and not much else, including in their prospect base. They have a deep prospect pool, but there's not a lot of top line potential there. They should get at least two good pieces this year, but they have long-term gaps basically across their roster.
Same with the Kings.

I like how the Rangers are positioned, particularly because they have high end talent in all positions, and the advantage of being in a market that seems like is attractive to talent.

I know your narrative is that they need to engage in a complete re-build but I don't see it. They have a lot of pieces in place already.

Is valimaki a top end talent in your opinion?

[GranteedEV]

OK, but still, who has been calling for Dube to get a bigger role (be it moving to C or up a line),

I think if Dube were 262W - 222L (54.1%) on the faceoff dot the past three seasons, and not 16W - 26L(38.1%), most of us would absolutely be clamoring for Dube to get a chance to center a line. It would be in the team's best interest given how underwhelming and unorthodox two of our regular centers are.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Is valimaki a top end talent in your opinion?

Don’t know. I suspect his ceiling is a number two or three

[Flash Walken]

Don’t know. I suspect his ceiling is a number two or three

I'm just going with a thought experiment here.

I admittedly don't know much or care much about prospects in a system, but in my mind if Valimaki is a top end talent then Brannstrom should be seen that way as well.

Gabe Vilardi has 3 points in 5 games as a 6'3 20 year old centre...

I think to say they are missing top end pieces something you could probably say about just about every team, because who knows how it ends up. Turcotte could be a Bennett, could be a Monahan, could be a Tkachuk. I'm willing to bet though that as a top 5 pick he's probably a top end talent.

It would be fun to revisit this in 2 or 3 years.