QOTD: Pick your tandem

[Bingo]

What are the Flames going to do in goal? What two guys will be left standing when the dust settles either on the regular season or soon into it?

[doncherry]

Not heart broken with any scenario, prefer not to risk losing Ortio....went with Ramo-Ortio

[Kipper is King]

Ram0 and 0rti0!

I think Hiller has been good to the Flames, but he's also the most inconsistent IMO. Hiller also tends to cause heart attacks when he handles the puck.

[kyuss275]

Can you add another choice to poll?


Ortio - Don't care. Just trade one of them.

[Poe969]

I'm thinking Hiller goes to a team like the sharks, stars or pens in a deal before the season starts.

Ramo and Ortio this year, Ortio and one of our kids next year.

[Split98]

I have no issue with Hiller, and will be sad to see him go.

But I see Ortio taking the reigns this year, which leaves us with Hiller or Ramo needing to find a new home. Hiller I can see returning much more than Ramo would.

[Bingo]

I like Hiller as well ... no bad blood at all.

Really don't want to lose Ortio, and would prefer Ramo as he seems to still have some upside in his game that could get tapped with more responsibility.

[N-E-B]

I think Hiller is the ever-so-slightly better goalie between him and Ramo, but Ramo is younger, so I would go with Ramo-Ortio.

Is there any way to keep Hiller's pads though?

[devo22]

Ramo-Ortio. Nothing against Hiller, I just like Ramo more.

[codynw]

As long as it's one of the vets and Ortio, I don't care.

[Bingo]

Funny how things can change.

When Hiller was signed it looked like one of those "nobody else will let me start so I'll go there, play well and get dealt to a team bound for the playoffs" type of decision.

Now the Flames are in an odd pickle where he's good, and the more experienced guy so there's risk in moving him when the rest of the team looks playoff ready. Yet it's smart to move him if you look at the age of the core and remembering that they are still rebuilding.

Do you stop rebuilding if you make the playoffs in back to back years?

[corporatejay]

Can someone clarify the situation for me.

Does Ortio have to pass waivers regardless of when he gets demoted (i.e. if he starts the season in Stockton, does he have to pass through waivers first)?

[codynw]

Can someone clarify the situation for me.

Does Ortio have to pass waivers regardless of when he gets demoted (i.e. if he starts the season in Stockton, does he have to pass through waivers first)?

He has to go on waivers to be sent to the AHL, doesn't matter when.

[Otto-matic]

Funny how things can change.

When Hiller was signed it looked like one of those "nobody else will let me start so I'll go there, play well and get dealt to a team bound for the playoffs" type of decision.

Now the Flames are in an odd pickle where he's good, and the more experienced guy so there's risk in moving him when the rest of the team looks playoff ready. Yet it's smart to move him if you look at the age of the core and remembering that they are still rebuilding.

Do you stop rebuilding if you make the playoffs in back to back years?

I want to say no and they still need to stay on the rebuild track, IMO the flames need to add a few more pieces to become an elite team in the league.

I went with Ortio - Ramo.

Hiller is an odd situation, I enjoyed watching him play for the team but he will most likely be gone at the end of the year anyways as a free agent. Might as well get an asset for him.

[Canada 02]

Hiller played a lot more than Ramo. Was that due to injuries? Don't remember. May suggest the coaching staff has a preference. Ramo has never played more than 45 games in a season. Don't feel comfortable with him bring the veteran with Ortio. Went with Hiller and Joni

[Coach]

Funny how things can change.

When Hiller was signed it looked like one of those "nobody else will let me start so I'll go there, play well and get dealt to a team bound for the playoffs" type of decision.

Now the Flames are in an odd pickle where he's good, and the more experienced guy so there's risk in moving him when the rest of the team looks playoff ready. Yet it's smart to move him if you look at the age of the core and remembering that they are still rebuilding.

Do you stop rebuilding if you make the playoffs in back to back years?

I don't think the difference between Ramo and Hiller is big enough that you can say we are rebuilding with one or going for it with the other. In all honesty, neither of them are likely to be with the team at it's peak. We're probably looking at Gillies and Ortio, possibly MacDonald, going forward.

[Huntsy]

Get what you can for Hiller..

[Huntingwhale]

I'm one of the few people on CP who likes Hiller better. Obviously I think Ortio is ready. But Hiller plays such a different style then the other 2, that I think it's an advantaged to the Flames to have 2 different style goaltenders. At the same time, you can't really go wrong with 2 Finns.

At the end of the day, it matters not to me which of Hiller or Ramo departs. As long as Ortio can take the reigns and run with it.

[Imported_Aussie]

Hiller's style worries me with this team. He drops low and blocks pucks, whereas Ortio tries to smother/no rebound.
Hiller is more consistent than Ramo, but I feel like Hiller's predictability is what brought on trouble in the playoffs - teams worked him out, and he was chased. The Flames, even with the addition of Hamilton, are usually outmatched in size on the back end, so giving up rebounds is a risk, since you can't muscle guys away. Ramo will let in the odd softy more than Hiller does, but then he will go lights out.
All of this makes me think Ortio is going to be #1 by the end of the season - he is the best fit back there for the team.
Going with Ramo - Ortio more because I feel Hiller is easier to trade (salary retained). I would be happy so long as Ortio starts as #1B and works his way up

[Reggie Dunlop]

Ramortio.

No idea what happens with Hiller though.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Dump Hiller. Weakest link on the team, and that includes Raymond.

[Vinny01]

Hiller put up the numbers last year and was great against the Canucks but he is the odd man out. I think we have witnessed the best of Hiller but Ramo might still improve now that this will be his 3rd year back in the NHL. Obviously a young team like the Flames needs to keep the young goalie they drafted and developed so Ortio staying is a no brainer

[codynw]

Dump Hiller. Weakest link on the team, and that includes Raymond.

You're delusional.

The vets are fairly equal. If anything, Hiller was slightly better last year.

[Poe969]

Hillerito?

[Oil Stain]

I find it curious that Hiller had the best save percentage out of Calgary netminders by a fair margin and only 27% of the respondents want him back on the team.

Ortio had the worst save percentage last season and 97% want him on the team.


Do you think the perception of Hiller is colored by his two back to back poor playoff outings, rather than his season as a whole?

Is Ortio the result of shiny new toy syndrome? He didn't put up better numbers, but he is younger therefore he must be better in the future?

[King Theo]

I picked Hiller - Ortio. It could have been Ortio and either. Hiller over Ramo just because he has been in the NHL longer. 378 games played vs 98.

[devo22]

I find it curious that Hiller had the best save percentage out of Calgary netminders by a fair margin and only 27% of the respondents want him back on the team.
Hiller was unreal at the start of the season, IIRC his Oct/Nov numbers were crazy. But ultimately that was unsustainable and Ramo was outstanding in the playoffs. Combine that with the fact that Hiller plays a "different" style and is older than Ramo, I don't think it's that surprising. Hiller had better numbers, but most fans seem to trust Ramo more nevertheless.

[Benched]

Ramo-Ortio is high risk/high reward
Hiller-Ortio is lower risk with a proven starter, maybe less reward if Ortio doesn't get enough games
Hiller-Ramo is just plain not a good idea


I still think Hiller-Ortio

[FBI]

I find it curious that Hiller had the best save percentage out of Calgary netminders by a fair margin and only 27% of the respondents want him back on the team.

Ortio had the worst save percentage last season and 97% want him on the team.


Do you think the perception of Hiller is colored by his two back to back poor playoff outings, rather than his season as a whole?

Is Ortio the result of shiny new toy syndrome? He didn't put up better numbers, but he is younger therefore he must be better in the future?

Ortio played awesome in 4 of 6 games. The last game he lost is the reason his numbers were lower. The 1-0 shutout against the Canucks on the road that we always lose to, was a masterpiece. This is a case of eye test vs stats.

[neo45]

I found myself trusting Ramo over Hiller in the playoffs last year and I think that's when he finally won over the coaching staff

[TomLeeMC]

Went Hiller-Ortio. Really like Ramo but with Hiller being around the league longer he may be in a better position to take Ortio under his wing. I also think we'd get better return for Ramo being younger.

[drewtastic]

Hiller was unreal at the start of the season, IIRC his Oct/Nov numbers were crazy. But ultimately that was unsustainable and Ramo was outstanding in the playoffs. Combine that with the fact that Hiller plays a "different" style and is older than Ramo, I don't think it's that surprising. Hiller had better numbers, but most fans seem to trust Ramo more nevertheless.

I also prefer Ramo's style to Hiller's "puck-blocking" style, and I think that Hiller's more prone to "soft" goals due to what seems like a lower degree of mobility.

Having said this, so long as the Flames retain Ortio, I'm okay with Hiller being the other guy for this season. If that's the tandem they go with, then I'd prefer Hiller in the "veteran back up" role; somebody who can come into games if Ortio struggles.

Ultimately, I think the Flames are in some degree of a holding pattern until someone like Gillies matures. I think he's the true "franchise goalie" hope. In the meantime, we just hope Ortio develops into something like a capable #1/1A.

Big-picture, it's not THAT devastating to the team's progression if they miss playoffs this season, because they're still developing prospects and still a young team overall. Nevertheless, I see goaltending as the biggest need right now, and the sooner someone establishes himself as being able to carry the load, the better.

[burnitdown]

They're all pretty similar in my eyes and a case can be may that any one of them can stand out and play themselves into the role of our starting goalie for the next 3+ years. I think management just signed Ramo to a hefty one year deal so his spot is locked down while I don't see Hiller being traded nor being sent down...so I think by default, they'll test their luck and try to sneak Ortio through waivers.

The only thing I don't want is a situation with 3 goalies for the first couple months of the season. The goalies can never get into a rhythm and it will be a constant focus of the media.

[GranteedEV]

I find it curious that Hiller had the best save percentage out of Calgary netminders by a fair margin and only 27% of the respondents want him back on the team.

Hiller is 33, and turns 34 mid-season.
Ramo is 29.

It's as simple as this: A year from now both guys are UFAs, and both will look to be Ortio's backup. Would you rather bring back a 34 year old backup who's losing mobility or a competent 30 year old backup? Once we trade one, we can consider the bridge burned.

Hiller was better than Ramo last year. Will be better this year or next year? We can't predict when age starts to limit his effectiveness.

Ortio had the worst save percentage last season and 97% want him on the team.

Is Ortio the result of shiny new toy syndrome? He didn't put up better numbers, but he is younger therefore he must be better in the future?

Before a meaningless April game where Ortio was just returning from a high ankle sprain caused by Oilers prospect Bogdan Yakimov running him over, Ortio's save percentage was .935. The April game tanked his save percentage because our #1 defenseman on the night was Deryk Engelland.

Ortio is already better, it's not about the future. He's athletic, great rebound control, reliable positioning, great glove hand, tracks the puck as well as anyone, doesn't let in soft goals, and mentally tough/confident. These are things you see when you watch him play.

[Benched]

Big-picture, it's not THAT devastating to the team's progression if they miss playoffs this season, because they're still developing prospects and still a young team overall. Nevertheless, I see goaltending as the biggest need right now, and the sooner someone establishes himself as being able to carry the load, the better.

Great point.

If this is managments outlook, then they should go Ramo-Ortio, better longer term potential.

Hiller isn't going to be your guy in a few years, so it's time to look for a #1 to emerge. If it's not Ramo, or not Ortio, you keep looking/waiting.


If the goal is to make the playoffs again this year and push further....then you have to give Hiller a thought as he's proven.

[flylock shox]

I think Flames fans are inclined to prefer Ramo due to the Kipper effect.

We appreciate and trust athletic goaltending having watched it win us games for so long. That's why we like Ramo and really like Ortio, but are less sold on Hiller's blocking style.

That was my thinking until recently, but now I'm coming around to the idea of keeping Hiller as he's a steadier veteran presence and there's an advantage to having 2 goalies play different styles.

[zukes]

I'd trade Ramo or Hiller, whoever fetches more on the market and then ride the other duo. Glad I'm not the one making the call here.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Gotta keep Ortio, can't risk losing him on waivers for nothing.

I don't really care too much who they keep between the other two, but they did just re-sign Ramo so it would be strange to ink him then deal him within a couple months.

I guess I'd have to say Ramo/Ortio.

[Komskies]

Ramo-Ortio is what I'd like to see, Hiller-Ramo is what I think we'll be seeing (at least to start the season).

[topfiverecords]

Hiller - Ortio, but reverse order.

[Lanny_McDonald]

You're delusional.

The vets are fairly equal. If anything, Hiller was slightly better last year.

Hiller was average at best after November. There is a reason why the Flames had so many come from behind victories. Hiller, and Ramo, let in too many soft goals early. That can be a killer. Hiller's performance tranded downward as the year rolled on and Ramo's trended upward. Hiller should be the odd man out, and the fact that the team signed Ramo and has been trying to find a home for Hiller seems to indicate they agree with with me. So if I am delusional, so is Treliving and Hartley.

[1qqaaz]

I find it curious that Hiller had the best save percentage out of Calgary netminders by a fair margin and only 27% of the respondents want him back on the team.

Ortio had the worst save percentage last season and 97% want him on the team.


Do you think the perception of Hiller is colored by his two back to back poor playoff outings, rather than his season as a whole?

Is Ortio the result of shiny new toy syndrome? He didn't put up better numbers, but he is younger therefore he must be better in the future?

I think the a lot of the perception of Hiller is due to his age and the fact that he lost the net to Ramo in the playoffs (although he ended up with a much higher save percentage than Ramo in the playoffs). These things seem to outweigh the importance of stats both from last season and career-wise.

If you include the playoffs (in which Hiller has a career 93%), Hiller's career save percentage is as good as Carey Price's and Jonathan Quick's. They all have similar amounts of games played. Not saying Hiller is anywhere near as good, but sometimes he doesn't get the credit he deserves. His age hasn't affected him much so far, and 33 isn't that old.

I voted for Hiller/Ortio, because I feel like Ortio should be developed in the NHL (with Gillies in the AHL) and Ramo is too much of a gamble. In 4 seasons, Ramo has never had over 91.2%. Comparatively, Hiller has only been below 91.2% once in 8 seasons.

I am probably overvaluing the save percentage stat, but in this case, I think the difference is just too large to ignore.

[btimbit]

Ortio and whoever

[Flame19,289]

It seems that the hope from most posters here is that Ortio will be part of the tandem and will take the reigns and run with it.

But if Ortio struggles and becomes the de facto #2, I feel much more comfortable trusting Hiller to carry the bulk of the work, given that he's done it before. I'm not totally comfortable with Ramo getting 80% of the starts, if that were to become necessary.

I voted Hiller-Ortio.

[GioforPM]

I like Hiller in combo with Ortio better. He's steadier, way more experienced (which is what I want with a rookie as the other goalie). PLus the "soft first goal" thing is way overblown. Ramo's let in a few of those as well, and what looks like the occasional soft short side goal on Hiller is simply a matter of the percentages of his style (which a lot of goalie coaches employ). I also disagree that Ramo was way better in the POs. Statistically, they were almost a wash, except Hiller's save % was way better. Ramo made Belesky look like a star.

[Sainters7]

Ramo/Ortio, but frankly I'm fine with Ramo/Hiller. I know Ortio's young, but all my future Flames goalie hype is centered around Gillies, which has probably resulted in me being rather indifferent regarding Ortio's future here.

Regarding Hiller/Ramo, when at their best, Hiller's a little better. He's also more inconsistent IMO (my heart's always in my throat when he faces his first couple shots of a game), I just feel more comfortable when Ramo's in there. Just assumed Ramo was gone after last year, but after re-signing him, I think Hiller's the odd man out here, if Ortio finishes the pre-season strong.


Posted from Calgarypuck.com App for Android

[Fire]

Hiller and Ortio is the safer move. The Flames have the potential to be a really good team this season, I don't think you want to risk it by having a rookie and a guy who has never been a #1 in the NHL being the tandem. Keep and waive Ramo in case of injury to Hiller or Ortio. Obviously Ramo didn't garner much attention by other teams during the UFA discussion period so he took what he could with the Flames.

[codynw]

Hiller was average at best after November. There is a reason why the Flames had so many come from behind victories. Hiller, and Ramo, let in too many soft goals early. That can be a killer. Hiller's performance tranded downward as the year rolled on and Ramo's trended upward. Hiller should be the odd man out, and the fact that the team signed Ramo and has been trying to find a home for Hiller seems to indicate they agree with with me. So if I am delusional, so is Treliving and Hartley.

The "delusional" part of your post was the part where you said Hiller was the weakest link on the team, and worse than Raymond.

That's simply not true. Him and Ramo both had bad and great stretches throughout the year. Nobody really "stole" the number one job at any point.

[Bingo]

I find it curious that Hiller had the best save percentage out of Calgary netminders by a fair margin and only 27% of the respondents want him back on the team.

Ortio had the worst save percentage last season and 97% want him on the team.


Do you think the perception of Hiller is colored by his two back to back poor playoff outings, rather than his season as a whole?

Is Ortio the result of shiny new toy syndrome? He didn't put up better numbers, but he is younger therefore he must be better in the future?

I honestly think in this new advanced stat age people want to boil things down to numbers and numbers only.

Travis Yost had a thing on Calgary goaltending last week saying there shouldn't be a controversy as Hiller is better. Case closed.

But it didn't feel that way.

The eye test said Hiller was struggling. he gave up early goals, and he was down hoping not to get picked off high.

This isn't to say he didn't play well when he was in the nets, because he did. He was a good add.

But I think the Flames are more vulnerable in net with Hiller than Ramo when teams starting (if they haven't already) taking the team seriously. Spend more time on video and you can easily see how to beat Hiller. He dares you to do it.

Ramo overplays the shooter and leaves himself open to the pass or rebound, not doubt, but one on one he's tougher to beat.

Ortio is a decorated AHL goaltender that has shown he can dominate at the NHL level with a limited sample size. You can't let that walk away when you're core is 19-24 years old. You can't.

if he's the man great. If he's the filler until Gillies is ready that's fine too. But two vets, both of which had below NHL save percentages last year are simply not the guys to retain.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

It seems that the hope from most posters here is that Ortio will be part of the tandem and will take the reigns and run with it.

But if Ortio struggles and becomes the de facto #2, I feel much more comfortable trusting Hiller to carry the bulk of the work, given that he's done it before. I'm not totally comfortable with Ramo getting 80% of the starts, if that were to become necessary.

I voted Hiller-Ortio.
Pretty much my thoughts too. I think it will be 60% Hiller and 40% Ortio.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[GranteedEV]

Hiller was unreal at the start of the season, IIRC his Oct/Nov numbers were crazy. But ultimately that was unsustainable and Ramo was outstanding in the playoffs.

Save percentages by month/series:

Hiller Ortio Ramo
October 0.941 N/A 0.914
November 0.885 N/A 0.925
December 0.923 N/A 0.867
January 0.901 0.931 0.923 (1GP)
February 0.908 N/A 0.945
March 0.925 N/A 0.907
April 0.953 .773 (1GP) N/A
vs Canucks 0.931 N/A 0.905
vs Ducks .786 (1GP) N/A 0.907
(Pre-2015) 0.952 0.979 0.938

[Flash Walken]

Ramo is better than Hiller on a per game basis, Hiller is better than Ramo over the course of an entire season.

Hiller let's in one stinker per game, Ramo let's in several stinkers every 2-3 games

I would rather have Ramo-Ortio as it gives Ortio a better chance of sustained play when Ramo inevitably loses it for a 10-15 game stretch.

[Toonage]

I think the coach/GM decisions speak loudest. They could have let Ramo walk, and they didn't. They pulled Hiller at the most crucial time of the year twice and he never got the net back after that second time. If he was the guy, they wouldn't have signed Ramo. This isn't about Ortio not being ready. If they thought that they wouldn't have signed him to his new deal, they would have cut ties.

[Finger Cookin]

I'm in the minority, but I prefer Hiller in net over Ramo. Ramo's style has just never filled me with confidence. He can get into a nice groove, but his tendency to be all over the place and flail out of position just never inspires confidence in me.

Regardless of which veteran sticks around, it sure would be great to see Ortio step up and succeed in any games he gets. It would be nice to have a young goalie grab the reins at a time when so much of our young roster seems to be making progress.

[FlamesAddiction]

I would take Ramo and Ortio. Ramo is a little younger than Hiller even though they are probably in the same class. I would hate to see Ortio go after seeing him develop.

I would accept Hiller and Ortio though if they were offered a great deal for Ramo.

[GioforPM]

I think the coach/GM decisions speak loudest. They could have let Ramo walk, and they didn't. They pulled Hiller at the most crucial time of the year twice and he never got the net back after that second time. If he was the guy, they wouldn't have signed Ramo. This isn't about Ortio not being ready. If they thought that they wouldn't have signed him to his new deal, they would have cut ties.

They also started Hiller more, and Hartley started him against Anaheim even though Hiller was pulled and Ramo won the final Vancouver game. That tells me he's Hartley's starter. I don't think the final three games changed Hartley's mind.

I think Treliving signed Ramo because (a) he wasn't sure about Ortio yet and (b) because Treliving's pattern is to hold as many cards as possible.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

I'm not sure if people who say Ramo over Hiller due to age are saying that because he has more years of play in him, or if he has more potential, but either argument doesn't make much sense to me. Ramo is 29, Hiller is 33. There's very little difference in terms of years left of NHL level play between these two, and Hiller is far more experienced. If you think Ramo is going to still develop, I think this is as good as he's going to be. Goalies rarely look a whole lot better past his age. He is what he is at this point, so don't expect much more.

[dammage79]

Hiller-Ortio for 2015-2016!

Stability Stability Stability. Say it again. Once more.

[dustygoon]

You know the upside of hiller and ramo. Known quantities.

You don't know ortio's ceiling. Ortio can give you probably the same level of goaltending as either of two older guys with optionality of something even better.

It would be the height of stupidity to waive ortio. And he's cheap at the moment.

[schteve_d]

I`m all for Ramo and Ortio. Does Hiller have any trade value at all being a UFA at the end of this season?

[Property Manager DB]

According to the poll looks like Ortio is the clear #2 favorite

[foshizzle11]

I don't know how to view polls on Tapa-talk so I haven't voted yet but I would pick Ortio and Ramo.

I think if they can split the duty this year we will be in a similar position as last year, ie in the playoffs.

Ramo played well in the playoffs and I always felt more comfortable with him.

I would be sad to see Hiller's awesome retro mask go to waste though! He should auction it on CP for charity if he gets traded.

[Fire]

I`m all for Ramo and Ortio. Does Hiller have any trade value at all being a UFA at the end of this season?

Probably makes him easier to trade imo.

[Inferno]

Ramo scares me more than Hiller so I'd go with Hiller/Ortio

[Super-Rye]

I went Ramo/Ortio because I think Ramo has a little untapped potential compared to Hiller.

Either of the 2 vets with Ortio is fine though. Both guys are reliable goalies and both guys have their faults.

[PugnaciousIntern]

Wow, this poll is a little surprising to me.

Guess people simply want a changeup from last year. Seems reasonable

[FlamesAddiction]

Wow, this poll is a little surprising to me.

Guess people simply want a changeup from last year. Seems reasonable

I just don't think people want to lose a young goalie like Ortio. Nothing against Ramo or Hiller.

[Strange Brew]

I predict Hiller and Ramo to start the year with Ortio being risked on waivers. Hope I'm wrong. I just think if there was a market for either veteran, Hiller would already be gone and Ramo would have signed elsewhere.

[#-3]

Obviously Ortio cannot be waived

I picked Hiller I don't think there is enough between him and Ramo to commit one way or the other. But I think Hillers career path lends itself better to a 1A vet 1B rookie model that the Flames will probably move towards.

[Hatter]

Went Ramo - Ortio. I have nothing against Hiller, but I don't think he is strictly better than Ramo. Ramo is younger, cheaper, and more Finnish.

[ScorchyScorch]

I thought Ramo was super impressive against the Ducks. Didn't realize that Hiller had better numbers vs the Canucks and Ramo only maintained a .907 SV% in his series. Then again, the Ducks were a much tougher opponent.

I guess on the whole Hiller was slightly better last season. I still get irritated at his early game stinkers, and susceptibility to the odd sharp angle shot due to not staying glued to the posts, though.

[expatflame]

I voted Ramo and Hiller but forgot that would put Ortio on waivers and potentially lose him. I thought Ramo and Hiller were a pretty strong tandem last year and have looked very good in preseason.

[gilligans_off]

I want all three. It's not the best way to do it but it was also needed last year. Unless you can move one of the vets for a good return.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Save percentage vs Vancouver is not comparable to save percentage against Anaheim.

Comparing save percentages over the course of a season, particularly behind the same defense against a variety of teams is more sensible.

On the poll, Hiller's style seems more vulnerable in a playoff series (ie. Same opponent with time to adapt to his style). I think this team has roughly equal chance to make the playoffs with any of the three goalies.

Ramo-Ortio for me. But I like Hiller and hope he finds a good home

[GreenLantern2814]

Hiller is a guy you know can give you 60+ starts with a .910 save %. Whatever we think of Ramo, we don't 'know' he's capable of that kind of consistency.

Based on the poll, people are comfortable with Kari Ramo as the most experienced goaltender in the entire organization. I don't know that the Flames share that mindset. It seems very risky to me.

[Samonadreau]

The real question is - are they going to try to retain the guy they hold on to after this year? Obviously performance this season will influence that but if the plan moving forward is Ortio/Gillies then i beleive it doesnt matter who out of Hiller/Ramo they go with this year and who ever has any form of market value, try to get a pick out of them, even if you have to retain a large chunk of salary for this year.

Either Goalie with Ortio

The Ortio/Gillies tandem next year would also free up some cap for the signings required in the off season.

[expatflame]

I wonder if they'll keep all 3 goaltenders for the first 5-10 games and then make a decision.

[jroc]

I wonder if they'll keep all 3 goaltenders for the first 5-10 games and then make a decision.

That would just make another equally as difficult decision for the group of forwards.

[heep223]

Ortio and whoever. Most importantly - whoever it is, stay in your ####ing net!

[Alberta_Beef]

Do you stop rebuilding if you make the playoffs in back to back years?You never stop rebuilding. Just like you never stop trying to win. I don't think it needs to be one or the other unless you are making a deal as a contender trying to put your team over the top.

[kyuss275]

Not sure where to put this but does anybody know how San Jose sharks goaltending has been this pre-season? Its the only team i can think of that might want an experienced back-up/ 1b goalie and willing to pay $2 + million for it. ( that's assuming team will only take flames goaltender at 50% off)

[codynw]

Not sure where to put this but does anybody know how San Jose sharks goaltending has been this pre-season? Its the only team i can think of that might want an experienced back-up/ 1b goalie and willing to pay $2 + million for it. ( that's assuming team will only take flames goaltender at 50% off)

I think Martin Jones has been pretty solid for them so far. I know he got a shutout in one game.

They might want a more proven guy than Stalock to be his backup though.

[Erick Estrada]

My believe is if they go with Ramo and Ortio that there will be immense pressure on Ortio as I don't believe this team makes the playoffs if Ramo has to start 50+ games.

[indes]

Ortio and whoever for me, I would keep the one who has less of a problem being relied on the most

[Textcritic]

My believe is if they go with Ramo and Ortio that there will be immense pressure on Ortio as I don't believe this team makes the playoffs if Ramo has to start 50+ games.


Disagree entirely. I think Ramo had an off year last season, and am hoping that what we see this year is much more characteristic of his 2013–14 season. Once he settled in in the early part of 2014, he was one of the best goalies in the NHL down the stretch. He's done it before. He can do it again.

[Crumpy-Gunt]

I think we should go trade Hiller if anyone. He goes down way way too early, doesn't hug the posts and isn't good at getting across. I think ramo is better fundamentally and less scary to watch. I think he is a good guy to challenge Ortio as well.

[CMPunk]

Disagree entirely. I think Ramo had an off year last season, and am hoping that what we see this year is much more characteristic of his 2013–14 season. Once he settled in in the early part of 2014, he was one of the best goalies in the NHL down the stretch. He's done it before. He can do it again.

Last year was Ramos best season in the NHL, so I don't know how he was "off".

I just don't think at 29 Ramo is going to get much better, plus he's never played more then 45 games in a season. I'd rather keep Hiller who's been a capable #1 and keep the pressure off Ortio and let him ease into the starters role.

[Alberta_Beef]

Not sure where to put this but does anybody know how San Jose sharks goaltending has been this pre-season? Its the only team i can think of that might want an experienced back-up/ 1b goalie and willing to pay $2 + million for it. ( that's assuming team will only take flames goaltender at 50% off)I honestly think the Sharks are eyeing a top 5 pick this year and have no desire to improve their goaltending situation.

Disagree entirely. I think Ramo had an off year last season, and am hoping that what we see this year is much more characteristic of his 2013–14 season. Once he settled in in the early part of 2014, he was one of the best goalies in the NHL down the stretch. He's done it before. He can do it again.Ramo hasn't played more than 45 regular season games since 08/09 when he split time between Norfolk and Tampa Bay and he only played 50 games between the two teams. Expecting him to play 50+ is a significant risk when his backup has less than 20 games of NHL experience.

[Erick Estrada]

Disagree entirely. I think Ramo had an off year last season, and am hoping that what we see this year is much more characteristic of his 2013–14 season. Once he settled in in the early part of 2014, he was one of the best goalies in the NHL down the stretch. He's done it before. He can do it again.

That's always the excuse with Ramo. The guy never settles as he's either really good or really bad. He is perfect for the same role he had last year in that when he gets the call he can go on a run of good play if given the chance then spelled once he slumps. Having to depend on him for reliable 50+ starts is something the Oilers have been asking from career backups and we have seen the results. Dumping a proven NHL starting goaltender like Hiller who got the Flames into the playoffs for a career backup would be something I would expect from Kevin Lowe or Craig MacTavish.

[Textcritic]

Last year was Ramos best season in the NHL, so I don't know how he was "off".
Statistically speaking, yes. But from January to April in 2014 he posted the team's best save percentage @ 0.919, and had a winning record on a team that finished in 27th place. He looked generally more comfortable to me in that four month stretch than he did over the balance of the season last year, for whatever reason.

I just don't think at 29 Ramo is going to get much better, plus he's never played more then 45 games in a season. I'd rather keep Hiller who's been a capable #1 and keep the pressure off Ortio and let him ease into the starters role.
That's fair, and I think that is also generally true. However, I don't agree that his limited experience is a very good argument to retain Hiller in this situation. I flat out do not think that Hiller provides a better opportunity for the Flames to win games than does Ramo, and I don't believe that an additional handful of games (he played in 40 in 2013–14, and in 41 last season) is going to make all the difference.

That's always the excuse with Ramo. The guy never settles as he's either really good or really bad. He is perfect for the same role he had last year in that when he gets the call he can go on a run of good play if given the chance then spelled once he slumps.
"Always"? Ramo only came back to the NHL after a four-year hiatus to start the 2013 season—two years ago. This is just totally disingenuous, as it fails to account for the rather significant transition he experienced at the start of his return.

Having to depend on him for reliable 50+ starts is something the Oilers have been asking from career backups and we have seen the results. Dumping a proven NHL starting goaltender like Hiller who got the Flames into the playoffs for a career backup would be something I would expect from Kevin Lowe or Craig MacTavish.
Well, I guess we will see what happens. Although dumping the better of your two main options in goal is arguably much more stupid.

To put it simply: I don't expect Ortio to be exposed to waivers, which means that one of Hiller or Ramo will be traded in the next few weeks. This also means that the Flames quite possibly begin the season with all three on the roster. If Ramo shows better than Hiller in their first few starts, then I would expect Treliving to trade Hiller. I would not then judge this decision as a poor one on the sole basis of Hiller's longer resume.

I personally believe that Ramo is a better goalie than Hiller (technically more sound, laterally better, and with better rebound control), but I am not about to foolishly commit to the same air of certainty that punctuates your post.

[kyuss275]

Was looking up San Jose sharks goaltending for pre-season ( this is a team i thought might need a goalie). Jones has had a stellar pre-season and could run with it. Stalock has not looked bad either. I don't see them wanting to trade for a goalie before the season starts.

Really get the feeling that the flames are going to have no choice but to have 3 goaltenders to start the season. I just don't see a market for an expensive back-up/1b goalie right now. Things will change, but it could take a month or 2. Having 3 goalies is not good for practicing and will be a distration. It also means one less forward or D man on the roster.

[Flame19,289]

Was looking up San Jose sharks goaltending for pre-season ( this is a team i thought might need a goalie). Jones has had a stellar pre-season and could run with it. Stalock has not looked bad either. I don't see them wanting to trade for a goalie before the season starts.


San Jose also has Troy Grosenick just down the hallway in their AHL locker room. I think he's capable of filling in if Stalock isn't up to the task.

What's going on with Halak in Brooklyn/NYI? If there's any uncertainty about his health for more than a few weeks, I'm not sure that the Islanders want to be in a position where Greiss is carrying the load by himself. Maybe the Islanders would be an option?

[EVERLAST]

Having too many goalies and what to do with them is a good problem to have. Hopefully it gets solved soon obviously but I'm not going to lose sleep over it. I like it better than the days where we had Joey MacDonald. What a joke that guy was. Throwing the team under the bus whenever he had a bad outing. At least they got goalies now

[kyuss275]

Having too many goalies and what to do with them is a good problem to have. Hopefully it gets solved soon obviously but I'm not going to lose sleep over it. I like it better than the days where we had Joey MacDonald. What a joke that guy was. Throwing the team under the bus whenever he had a bad outing. At least they got goalies now


Having 3 goalies durring regular season play is one of the worst situations a team can have. I have not heard a coach, goalie, player, former player , or media man ever say anything good about that kind of situation.

Sure it's better than the days of MacDonald or noodles as the back-up, but i like to think the flames are well past that point, and would never make that mistake again.

[Strange Brew]

A lot of this depends on what your expectations are for the Flames this year. If you seriously believe they can contend for a division title, I just don't see how you can go with Ramo and Ortio. I agree that Ramo passes the eye test but he has been inconsistent. He and Ortio would give you one of the least accomplished goalie tandems in the league.

I believe the starter that BT wants is not currently on the roster and whatever he does will be temporary until he gets the guy he wants.

[flylock shox]

The Flames have lots of room to carry a 3rd goalie. They only need 4 defenceman, plus a fifth in case of injury. No need to rush a trade.