The obstacles to eliminating smokeless tobacco from baseball

[Cowperson]

All tobacco products are banned from minor league baseball, but the players union in the majors insists its a CBA issue, wanting a concession from management in exchange for such a ban.

But one player is doing his part.

http://mobile.washingtonpost.com/c.jsp?item=http%3a%2f%2fwww.washingtonpost.com%2fw p-syndication%2farticle%2f2011%2f01%2f30%2fAR2011013 002738_mobile.xml&cid=578815&spf=1

And it makes you wonder how Donald Feud really views concussion since his leadership always actively insisted a steroids testing was a CBA issue too.

Cowperson

[dissentowner]

I think it is dumb, if a guy wants to chew tobacco that is his business.

[ricoFlame]

It is banned by baseball canada, you are supposed to get kicked out of the game if you're caught. I asked and ump mid-game in senior men's ball and he said he's never called it or seen it called, but sees several of us doing it each game...his exact words were "you're big boys, do what you're gonna do"

[Sylvanfan]

It's going to be exceptionally difficult, but if it's ever going to work, than it has to be the Majors that sets the example. When I was a teen ager playing baseball where the hell do you think I got the idea that I should chew tobacco from? It wasn't from seeing minor leaguers or senior mens leagues players doing it.

It's none of my business or anyones what they do off field. But on field on TV when you can see these guys with cans of chew in their pockets, and puffed out cheeks during games. It is part of the image the game is presenting.

[Locke]

Yeah, sorry, it may be part of the culture or image of baseball or whatever, but they're adults and its not illegal or anything so I dont see what they should do about it.

'Kids are going to copy their baseball heroes and do what they see them do on TV!!!! OMGZ!!!'

Okay, then maybe daddy should take two seconds away from chugging a whole case of Coors during an interminably long baseball game and tell little Timmy that he doesnt have to blindly do whatever he sees people on TV doing. That might be a good idea either way, baseball or otherwise.

Seriously, I hate this, its not a baseball player on TV's responsibility to make sure that your kid doesnt chew tobacco, regardless of whether hes deemed a 'role model' or not. It is not someone else's responsibility to set a good example for your kid.

[604flames]

I'd have a lot tougher time trying to justify junior hockey players using chew than major league ballplayers.

[united]

It's interesting as baseball is really the only sport where players use during play. Members of every other sport use it, but certainly none during the game situation which is where the main issue is.

I know quite a few NHL teams have banned it from use in their facilities, but players use it immediately upon exiting of course. Junior and college is a whole different story. It's everywhere.

I think that MLB should ban it from use during the game, but dugout, outside is free game.

[transplant99]

Yeah, sorry, it may be part of the culture or image of baseball or whatever, but they're adults and its not illegal or anything so I dont see what they should do about it.

'Kids are going to copy their baseball heroes and do what they see them do on TV!!!! OMGZ!!!'

Okay, then maybe daddy should take two seconds away from chugging a whole case of Coors during an interminably long baseball game and tell little Timmy that he doesnt have to blindly do whatever he sees people on TV doing. That might be a good idea either way, baseball or otherwise.

Seriously, I hate this, its not a baseball player on TV's responsibility to make sure that your kid doesnt chew tobacco, regardless of whether hes deemed a 'role model' or not. It is not someone else's responsibility to set a good example for your kid.


While I agree with that 100%, I also agree that if MLB doesn't want smokeless tobacco during the presentation of their product, they have every right to ban it.

MLB owners are the weakest in all pro sports, so who knows if this is something they really wanna fight about with the union or not. If it were my call i would just ban it and say it has nothing to do with any CBA and everything to do with the presentation of my product to the public. Nothing different than uniforms and hair lengths etc that are part of certain teams images.

[valo403]

While I agree with that 100%, I also agree that if MLB doesn't want smokeless tobacco during the presentation of their product, they have every right to ban it.

MLB owners are the weakest in all pro sports, so who knows if this is something they really wanna fight about with the union or not. If it were my call i would just ban it and say it has nothing to do with any CBA and everything to do with the presentation of my product to the public. Nothing different than uniforms and hair lengths etc that are part of certain teams images.

Have fun in court.

I don't know that this is ultimately a CBA issue, but if the union is treating it as such the league has to respect that possibillity.

[Sylvanfan]

Have fun in court.

I don't know that this is ultimately a CBA issue, but if the union is treating it as such the league has to respect that possibillity.

The players union will look brilliant trying to defend their right to consume tobacco on the job while on camera. Than again if there is one union in sports who'll fight for their right to basically smoke on the job...it's Baseball. I'm sure the court of public opinion will view them in high regard. Just like it is with their right to take steroids for all those years.

[valo403]

The players union will look brilliant trying to defend their right to consume tobacco on the job while on camera. Than again if there is one union in sports who'll fight for their right to basically smoke on the job...it's Baseball. I'm sure the court of public opinion will view them in high regard. Just like it is with their right to take steroids for all those years.

They're not defending their right to chew on the field, they're arguing that it's an issue covered by the CBA, and therefore needs to be negotiated. Two completely different things.

[SebC]

MLB should be get rid of it, the MLBPA are absolute buttholes for using the health of their membership as a bargaining point, and the fact that there's so much downtime that this can happen in the first place is one of the reasons why baseball is lame.

[Sylvanfan]

They're not defending their right to chew on the field, they're arguing that it's an issue covered by the CBA, and therefore needs to be negotiated. Two completely different things.

Of course they won't offer that as a concession unless they get compensated for it some other way. At which point.....owners will just let it slide since Baseball owners have no backbone.

[ricoFlame]

From the Baseball Canada rules of Baseball:

"4.06.1 THAT the use of all tobacco products, including smokeless tobacco, by all on-field participants (players, coaches, managers, umpires etc.) be prohibited at all competitions sanctioned by Baseball Canada, PENALTY: Automatic ejection from the game."

[speede5]

It's disgusting and it doesn't matter who is responsible for what kids do, they want to be just like the guys on the field and some will emulate them. We even train them with Big League Chew.

http://www.retroist.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/bigleague.jpg

The grounds crews and cleaners must just hate the stuff, the facilities could just outlaw the use of it as they have to clean it up. But the major tenant would of course protest that.

[burn_baby_burn]

It seems that MLB players are more discreet about chewing tobacco on the field than they used to be. Its pretty common to see buckets of Double Bubble behind the bench in a MLB dugout now days. Thirty years ago that would have been a box of Beachnut or Redman. I don't notice the players chewing as much as I used to. Who in the game today has a cheek puffed out like Lenny Dykstra?

[united]

It is definitely less noticeable now, but you can still see some guys throwing huge ones in almost every game.

Chase Utley, the Upton brothers, Troy Glaus, Nick Swisher, Jim Leyland come immediately to mind.

[PIMking]

It's not the ball players job to raise a child unless it's his own. The parents still have to instill right and wrong.

[burn_baby_burn]

From a nostalgia standpoint I never want to see smokeless tobacco taken out of baseball. However, like I posted yesterday, you hardly notice players chewing now days anyhow. As long as the players are discreet about it, I don't see it being a problem. Its not like we see the first base coach opening a pouch of Apple Jack and offering it to the runner after he reaches base.

[speede5]

It's not the ball players job to raise a child unless it's his own. The parents still have to instill right and wrong.That's such a cop-out for bad behavior. While the statement is technically correct, and this applies to all public figures, sports film, music, they sell themselves as the product and people want not only to see the product but emulate it. There is an indirect responsibility on the stars to be a good example.

The parents do have the most control, they can keep their children away from the events, I'm sure if attendance dropped in half because of this there would be a change in attitude, but it doesn't have to go that far.

[valo403]

That's such a cop-out for bad behavior. While the statement is technically correct, and this applies to all public figures, sports film, music, they sell themselves as the product and people want not only to see the product but emulate it. There is an indirect responsibility on the stars to be a good example.

The parents do have the most control, they can keep their children away from the events, I'm sure if attendance dropped in half because of this there would be a change in attitude, but it doesn't have to go that far.

And it won't, because there is absolutely no way that the presence of chew is going to cause 50% of the people who attend baseball games to stay away. They aren't feeding virgins to lions on the field.

[Locke]

And it won't, because there is absolutely no way that the presence of chew is going to cause 50% of the people who attend baseball games to stay away. They aren't feeding virgins to lions on the field.

This might actually increase baseball attendance.

[burn_baby_burn]

Ultimately its up to the owners to decide if the use of smokeless tobacco is hurting their image resulting in a loss of revenue. Baseball from what I have read recently, is having a tough time attracting young fans. The attitude of the owners is going to have to change dramatically to reverse the trend.

[valo403]

Ultimately its up to the owners to decide if the use of smokeless tobacco is hurting their image resulting in a loss of revenue. Baseball from what I have read recently, is having a tough time attracting young fans. The attitude of the owners is going to have to change dramatically to reverse the trend.

I don't think that has to do with the presence of dip though, it's more an issue of the game being boring and the inability to stop living in the past. Young people aren't into baseball because it's not 'cool'. It's an old persons sport that's filled with so many traditionalists who keep it that way. Change is impossible because of some idiotic notion that baseball should be this pure piece of Americana. A bunch of old men trying to pretend that America is still in 1956 and hanging on to their wistful childhood memories.

Honestly that's what turns me off the most about baseball, all the Joe Buck speeches about days gone by and that BS. It's by far the most pompous sport out there, and it has absolutely no right to be.

[Weiser Wonder]

I like how ridiculous it is.

Some of the players are obese. Not in a NFL lineman highly trained way either, they just don't take care of themselves.

Players can eat and chew during the game.

All this absurd patting the field, themselves and the bat before taking an at-bat.

The screaming matches where the manager and ump are literally centimeters from each other's face.

The huge amount of time it takes to do anything.

Never change, baseball, never change.

[speede5]

And it won't, because there is absolutely no way that the presence of chew is going to cause 50% of the people who attend baseball games to stay away. They aren't feeding virgins to lions on the field.Exactly. The overwhelming majority shrug their shoulders and accept it as is.

[dustyanddaflames]

I think the simple fact that baseball players are allowed to be seen with tins of chaw in their back pockets speaks volumes that MLB doesn't feel it is harming their product.

You wanna ban it from their pant pocket - go ahead. I am not sure it would cause a ruckus, but these guys are grown men - they legally can make the choice to chew or not, and don't need anyone telling them what to do. They know the facts, just as you or I know the facts - yet some continue to do it. It isn't performance enhancing steroids, it isn't marijuana or cocaine - and until this stuff is banned from over the counter purchasing - I say do as you please.