[News] 84-85 Oilers named Greatest Team of All Time

[shermanator]

Why do people care about this stuff? Some random internet poll ranked a team the greatest of all time. And?

[codynw]

2002 Red Wings better

Look at that lineup. Unreal.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

The top team on his list (which was made in 2002) is the '95-96 Red Wings, with a winning percentage 2.58 standard deviations above that year's average. Since that team did not win the Stanley Cup, it's easy to take it off the list of all-time greats. The #2 team on the list is the '88-89 Flames, with a WPZS of +2.31; followed by the '88-89 Habs at 2.19, another Stanley Cup loser. The '76-77 Canadiens, #4 with +2.18, are the second highest rated Cup winner. The '84-85 Oilers are tied for 42nd on the list at +1.53.

I've never seen a season with two such dominant teams. IIRC, the Flames and Habs, between them, were #1 or #2 in pretty much every catagory. GF, GA, PP, PK. Vernon and Roy were the two top goalies in the league. The Habs won their conference by 23 points and the Flames won their conference by 26 points.

In our playoff draft that season, every skater for both teams was drafted. Rick Nattress. Craig Ludwig. Every skater.

[CaptainCrunch]

There's no doubt that that Oiler team was good, but there were better Oiler teams.

As well I tend to put more weight into a team that had to compete in a 6 team league as opposed to a team that was in one of the most watered down era in NHL history.

I would also be tempted to name the 1980-81Islanders as in the conversation for greatest of all times.

[ToewsFan]

Those Oilers teams were some of the most exciting and dominant teams ever. Not sure if I agree with the 84-85 team being the best, as the 87' club could give them a run for their money.

[zukes]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

The 1988-89 Flames were obviously a great team (most any Stanley Cup Champion is) but of course an old Lanny McDonald and Colin Patterson were 9 and 10 forwards. The real story is the abundance of youth on that team as the following players were 25 years old or younger at the time: Nieuwendyk, MacInnis, Suter, Gilmour, Roberts, Fleury, and Vernon. That is an exceptional group of young talent - maybe not the same elite level of talent as the Oilers had but likely more depth, especially on defense.

This is how it will play out for the next little while as well. Let's hope a good depth team game works out better for us than it did then vs. a star laden team with average to below average depth (and D).

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

The 1988-89 Flames were obviously a great team (most any Stanley Cup Champion is) but of course an old Lanny McDonald and Colin Patterson were 9 and 10 forwards. The real story is the abundance of youth on that team as the following players were 25 years old or younger at the time: Nieuwendyk, MacInnis, Suter, Gilmour, Roberts, Fleury, and Vernon. That is an exceptional group of young talent - maybe not the same elite level of talent as the Oilers had but likely more depth, especially on defense.

Agree on your comments about McDonald but Patterson was a Selke nominee that year - and performing at an extremely high level. A often under-rated part of that team.
Don't disagree with your broader points - just underscoring how good Patterson was at that time.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by shermanator

Why do people care about this stuff? Some random internet poll ranked a team the greatest of all time. And?

And yet you clicked on a link to tell everyone that you didn't care.
It is summer and it is a fun discussion.
No need to take part if it doesn't interest you.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by shermanator

Why do people care about this stuff? Some random internet poll ranked a team the greatest of all time. And?

The best part is that it was a random poll that anyone could vote for.

So of course the 84-85 Oilers won it. As far as Oilers fans go that was the epitome of Hockey and everything since has been downhill.

Pretty par for the course. This should be in the E=NG thread.

[JD]

Colin Patterson might have been #9 in points (I didn't check), but he wasn't really used as a #9. My recollection is he played LW on the top line with Mullen and Gilmour. He didn't get the PP time as Otto was elevated from his 3rd line spot to be used for faceoffs and net-front-presence.

That was actually my favourite thing about that Flames team; how dominant their PP was. At some points in the season it seemed almost automatic they would score. They were tough enough to muck it up if they had to but they could make you pay on the scoreboard too.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by JD

That was actually my favourite thing about that Flames team; how dominant their PP was. At some points in the season it seemed almost automatic they would score. They were tough enough to muck it up if they had to but they could make you pay on the scoreboard too.

They had the deadliest powerplay I've ever seen. MacInnis, of course, fired bombs from the point. But people forget Suter had a very good shot too. Niewendyk was one of the best, if the not the best net-front presence in the league, who was incredibly deft at deflecting those MacInnis blasts or flipping in the rebound. Then you had guys like Mullen and Loob who could move the puck so well in tight. It was actually quite surprising when they didn't score on the PP.

[looooob]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

They had the deadliest powerplay I've ever seen. MacInnis, of course, fired bombs from the point. But people forget Suter had a very good shot too. Niewendyk was one of the best, if the not the best net-front presence in the league, who was incredibly deft at deflecting those MacInnis blasts or flipping in the rebound. Then you had guys like Mullen and Loob who could move the puck so well in tight. It was actually quite surprising when they didn't score on the PP.

they were even deadlier offensively in 87-88. In fact I believe ( I may have invented this stat and it might be wrong) that that team scored more goals than any team that didn't have Gretzky or Orr on it. while Gilmour and Fleury (half a season in 89) weren't on that team, Mike Bullard and his 48 goals, Brett Hull (50 goal pace), and a few other net front guys (tonelli etc) were, Reinhart was even around (although mostly injured). I think that team had a scarier PP.
however the swap outs of Bullard for Gilmour and Hull for (well we know that story) improved the team defence more than the lack of offence, goal differential improved the following year

[CalgaryFan1988]

Originally Posted by Wild GM

And yet you clicked on a link to tell everyone that you didn't care.
It is summer and it is a fun discussion.
No need to take part if it doesn't interest you.

I think the post you quoted is more talking about why certain posters get all butt hurt when anything positive about the Oilers is mentioned. It's an interesting topic, but not sure why people get all worked up over fans opinions of a team from over 30 years ago.

The Oilers had a great team that year.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

I think the post you quoted is more talking about why certain posters get all butt hurt when anything positive about the Oilers is mentioned. It's an interesting topic, but not sure why people get all worked up over fans opinions of a team from over 30 years ago.

The Oilers had a great team that year.

What I largely observe is a healthy and lively debate and not a lot of butthurt or folks getting worked up

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Mean Mr. Mustard

The 1988-89 Flames were obviously a great team (most any Stanley Cup Champion is) but of course an old Lanny McDonald and Colin Patterson were 9 and 10 forwards. The real story is the abundance of youth on that team as the following players were 25 years old or younger at the time: Nieuwendyk, MacInnis, Suter, Gilmour, Roberts, Fleury, and Vernon. That is an exceptional group of young talent - maybe not the same elite level of talent as the Oilers had but likely more depth, especially on defense.

The Flames were probably the most well rounded team in the NHL that year, and possibly even for a few seasons before and after. They could beat teams in a number of ways like a Swiss Army Knife.

The defense was particularly strong. Everyone remembers MacInnis and Suter, but guys like Macoun and McCrimmon were also extremely effective defensive guys in an era that didn't really reward defensive play as much as it should have. And for forwards, Otto may have quite possibly been IMO the best important cog in the machine. He could do everything.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

They had the deadliest powerplay I've ever seen. MacInnis, of course, fired bombs from the point. But people forget Suter had a very good shot too. Niewendyk was one of the best, if the not the best net-front presence in the league, who was incredibly deft at deflecting those MacInnis blasts or flipping in the rebound. Then you had guys like Mullen and Loob who could move the puck so well in tight. It was actually quite surprising when they didn't score on the PP.

Even the second unit which, IIRC had Otto standing in front was good. That team had the best centre depth I've ever seen: Newy, Gilmour, Otto and McLellan. And the defensive depth - MaCinnis, Suter, McCrimmon, Ramage, Macoun and Murzyn. That's amazing.

You had a classic rookie call-up sensation in Fleury. A classic grizzled vet in Lanny. A Selke nominee in Patterson. Snipers like Mullen and Loob, not to mention Roberts and Hrdina would could contribute. Grinders like Mark Hunter and Peplinski. A top enforcer in Tim Hunter.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by CMPunk

While a great team, there were still better. This is why internet polls are a terrible idea.

Agreed. However, the internet poll objectively did a better job at it than the NHL's panel of experts for its top 100 list.