Leadership in the system. - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Cali Panthers Fan · 03-11-2013, 10:40 AM

So an important question came up today in the Flames threads where another poster openly questioned if there are any leaders within the franchise if Iginla is traded away. I wanted to ask a general question regarding our prospect pool and their leadership qualities. Do they have any? Are they likely to put the team on their back? Do they make important plays at key moments in games? I know this will be an exceptionally hard thing to ask without watching a lot of them play live, without just highlights. Still, I want to know anything that anyone can add about possible leadership qualities.

For example, I feel like Bill Arnold, Tyler Wotherspoon, and Patrick Sieloff all seem like guys that can help lead a team. It probably has a lot to do with the style of play they have and the fact they've always been on winners, but I have nothing concrete to back that up.

Thoughts?

JiriHrdina · 03-11-2013, 10:43 AM

I would at Max Reinhart to the list.
I think Sven also has some great leadership attributes long-term.

Husky · 03-11-2013, 11:18 AM

Ramage has been captain for a few years and I believe he was captain for the US WJ team when he was on it too.

Cali Panthers Fan · 03-11-2013, 11:38 AM

I've heard very little of Ramage so far though and he isn't high on our prospect ranking list. Are we sure he can even be an NHL player at this point?

Thanks to Jiri for mentioning Reinhart. My only problem with that is he's struggling in Abbotsford this year. First pro season and all, but he has been disappointing so far.

dammage79 · 03-11-2013, 12:36 PM

Captain material? Tough call. Ramage as has been said already is a Captain. Reinhart I could see ending up being a Ryan Smyth type Captain. Wotherspoon with a neutral attitude and strong on ice play could be a candidate.

Assistant Captains? Gaudreau, Sven, Arnold, even Granlund if he can transition to NA ice nicely. Jankowski as well as he seems like a positive kind of guy.

Pierre "Monster" McGuire · 03-11-2013, 01:09 PM

Carter Bancks is a leader through and through. Unfortunately, he's not two inches taller or else he'd be with the Flames.

kirant · 03-11-2013, 01:11 PM

Problem with most of these guys is they can't excel and lead on the score sheet, but by example and by locker room presence. I don't see many of these guys cracking the top 6 or top 4 for our D so I can't see most of them carrying the team. Unless Gelinas gives them his clutch genes.

Sieloff reminds me a bit of a Sarich type of player. He's the type of guy who'd be able to bring up game changing hits. In this sense, he's a quiet leader.

I could see Baertschi being given the "A" for his skill. It seems to be more frequent that your most skilled players are given a support role because of the fact that they can communicate with the ref in conjunction with their large time on ice numbers.

Reinhart is a heart and soul type of player. For those traits, I could see him being an alternate as the type of player that the coach points to and lets him guide the locker room dynamics.

868904 · 03-11-2013, 01:23 PM

Lance Bouma.

For the next captain, I'd rather he be a 3rd liner Bouma type. I think it's too much to ask of your best player to be a captain. They have to worry about scoring and then dealing with the media and leading. When they get into a scoring funk, people start questioning whether or not he's leading by example.

I'd rather have a guy who just goes balls to the wall every shift and plays a simple in your face game as a captain. I think it'd be easier for a guy like that to go out and throw a big hit and start a fight, rather than losing your best player like Iginla.

devo22 · 03-11-2013, 01:28 PM

FWIW - Wotherspoon, Sieloff and Culkin all wear the "A" in the CHL this year and Elson is the captain of the Rebels. Plus if not for overager Rutkowski, I'm pretty sure Wotherspoon would have been the Winterhawks captain this year.

JiriHrdina · 03-11-2013, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

I've heard very little of Ramage so far though and he isn't high on our prospect ranking list. Are we sure he can even be an NHL player at this point?

Thanks to Jiri for mentioning Reinhart. My only problem with that is he's struggling in Abbotsford this year. First pro season and all, but he has been disappointing so far.

I think expectations were simply too high for Reinhart. His developed this year is following what should be an expected path. He’s a guy that will need at least 2 years down there and then even in the NHL work himself up from the 4th line. He’ll likely never be a captain but a leader ala Eric Nystrom. Someone that teammates look for emotional lifts from playing in a depth position.

kirant · 03-11-2013, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I think expectations were simply too high for Reinhart. His developed this year is following what should be an expected path. He’s a guy that will need at least 2 years down there and then even in the NHL work himself up from the 4th line. He’ll likely never be a captain but a leader ala Eric Nystrom. Someone that teammates look for emotional lifts from playing in a depth position.

Hasn't that always been the expectation for him? A hard working 3rd-4th liner with a good chance of not making it into the NHL?

Alberta_Beef · 03-11-2013, 01:57 PM

Bouma & Ramage both have the leadership qualities needed to be a future captain.

JiriHrdina · 03-11-2013, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kirant

Hasn't that always been the expectation for him? A hard working 3rd-4th liner with a good chance of not making it into the NHL?

I think some expected him to be close to NHL ready this season.

GreenLantern · 03-11-2013, 02:23 PM

When I think of Reinhart I think of a Stephene Yelle type player, would that be accurate?

Pierre "Monster" McGuire · 03-11-2013, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I think some expected him to be close to NHL ready this season.

Flames management sure boosted fan expectations though.

Last season Feaster made a comment about expecting Reinhart to start the year in Abby and finish it with the Flames.

Understandably fans, including myself, got excited about this. My expectations have since been curbed a bit.

JiriHrdina · 03-11-2013, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pierre "Monster" McGuire

Flames management sure boosted fan expectations though.

Last season Feaster made a comment about expecting Reinhart to start the year in Abby and finish it with the Flames.

Understandably fans, including myself, got excited about this. My expectations have since been curbed a bit.

Yeah stuff like that doesn't help to be sure.

Vulcan · 03-11-2013, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Yeah stuff like that doesn't help to be sure.

Yeah, they did the same thing with Backlund, Baerstschi, and Brodie. Sometimes I wish they'd just keep their mouths shut but I guess they have to sell tickets.

Johnny Rotten · 03-11-2013, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Yeah stuff like that doesn't help to be sure.

I remember after a draft during the time Darryl was g.m., and Tod Button saying something to the effect of the Flames not "pimping out their prospects".

I don't think the prospects need to be ignored, but I like that way of thinking.

I think most of us remember the Robbie Schremp days in Edmonton. Too much hype too early. Maybe if he'd started with the Red Wings he'd still be in the NHL like Daniel Cleary.

Ashasx · 03-11-2013, 04:47 PM

We better hope Elson is a good leader, or he's a waste of a contract spot.

Calgary4LIfe · 03-11-2013, 06:25 PM

I think the Flames as a whole will have enough leadership moving forward if Iginla moves. There are still guys like Gio to lead by example. Not sure who is and isn't vocal in the room, but from my understanding the Flames have a 'really great room'.

As for the prospects - lots of guys have had letters while in Junior. As they progress, so will their leadership abilities. Young men are not only developing their bodies and their skills in the AHL, but also their minds. I wouldn't worry too much about it. Was Todd Simpson a terrible captain? Well, he was really young, and he wasn't one of the best players on the ice, but I think he was fine as a captain (remember that fight with Domi?).

Ramage, Wotherspoon, Kulak, Culkin, Reinhart, Bouma, Granlund and probably more (sure I am missing some) I think have all either had letters or have been outright captains at some point in their young careers.

I think IF the Flames make some trades at the deadline unloading some vets for prospects and picks (and seemingly more likely this year), it will just add to that mix.

Also, the Flames seem to be about 2 things in terms of prospects:
1) High Hockey-IQ players - 'thinkers'
2) Seem high on Ward and how he tries to make a player better both professionally and personally. Seems like a developmental philosophy the Flames are very high on.

If the Flames keep molding their direction in this nature, I think it will be very positive long-term. Leadership will just fall into place. It doesn't matter if your leader is a skilled player, a grunt, or somewhere in-between. As long as your leader leads, then who he is is of little consequence.