Black teen shot and killed by neighborhood watch in Orlando gated community

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

The girlfriend's account of her telephone conversation with him pretty much says otherwise.

He refused his girlfriends request to flee.

She insists the victim - her boyfriend - said the first words in the fatal confrontation. It was an angry question directed at George Zimmerman, demanding an answer.

As I noted earlier, the story from the girlfriend, relayed through her lawyer, doesn't actually contradict Zimmerman's account. He says he was returning to his vehicle when he was confronted by the victim.

It will be interesting to know if her story, as relayed through her lawyer, does indeed confirm a lengthy interval between her request that he "run" and the final confrontation that she heard.

The amount of BS leaps you've made in relation to this phone call is truly astounding.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

6'3" hoodied kid not known to be a resident in a community beset by burglaries. And, as it turned out, he didn't live there.

Zimmerman phoned it in. Neighbourhood watches are set up for that circumstance. He had that right.

The kid also has the right to walk where he wants (although one of his suspensions from school was for walking in a place he wasn't supposed to be) just like Zimmerman or any other citizen has the right to phone it in as well.

From the point of view of statistical probability, I don't mind if Zimmerman added emphasis because the kid was black. That's not necessarily racist. It could be considered practical. Admittedly, however, that would be a controversial position to mouth ahead of time to a police dispatcher if it all goes south on you.

For all you or I know, Treyvan might have got that women's jewellry he couldn't explain from the same neighbourhood a few weeks earlier.

The rest of the night is open to discussion.

Cowperson

Making up more things I see, or are you just changing facts as you go along now?

[kirant]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

The girlfriend's account of her telephone conversation with him pretty much says otherwise.

He refused his girlfriends request to flee.

She insists the victim - her boyfriend - said the first words in the fatal confrontation. It was an angry question directed at George Zimmerman, demanding an answer.

As I noted earlier, the story from the girlfriend, relayed through her lawyer, doesn't actually contradict Zimmerman's account. He says he was returning to his vehicle when he was confronted by the victim.

It will be interesting to know if her story, as relayed through her lawyer, does indeed confirm a lengthy interval between her request that he "run" and the final confrontation that she heard.

Is there any place we can get a transcript or a recording of their call? I think that could be a huge swing one way or the other for the details of this case if they can release what Martin could understand.

I'm guessing though that it's not released and we're just going by word of mouth.

[woob]

Am I reading this right? Are we getting trolled by Cowperson??

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

Umm, everyone knows that this isn't a picture of Trayvon right? This was debunked a few days ago in the media.

[Bigtime]

Here is an interesting take on this from local author Chris Turner, "How the street failed Trayvon Martin":

http://www.mnn.com/green-tech/transp...trayvon-martin

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Umm, everyone knows that this isn't a picture of Trayvon right? This was debunked a few days ago in the media.

Doesn't matter now, it's out there!

[FlamingLonghorn]

2 different voice analyst experts are saying that no way the screams for help could have been Zimmerman.

[FlamingLonghorn]

New enhanced police video shows sign of gashes on Zimmerman's head.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by Sowa

New enhanced police video shows sign of gashes on Zimmerman's head.

And? So there may have been a struggle and even a fight,fact is one had a gun and used it,I haven't read this whole thread so please excuse me people if it has been talked about but I find it extremely disturbing when some guy "watching" a gated community plays executioner because of a confrontation. This was probably a kid full of piss and vinegar not doing anything wrong except for wearing a hoodie walking in an area that had been burglarized in the past. When I was his age I definitely would have been shot as well but fortunately for me I grew up in a country where there aren't 200 million handguns in the hands of it's citizens so I survived with just a bruise or two!

Sowa
First Line Centre

Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Austin, Tx

I guess I'm not surprized given you location

Wake up America

[moon]

Originally Posted by T@T

[/B]
I guess I'm not surprized given you location

Wake up America

Not surprised about what?

That he knows how to read the news and relay that information on a message board?

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by T@T

And? So there may have been a struggle and even a fight,fact is one had a gun and used it,I haven't read this whole thread so please excuse me people if it has been talked about but I find it extremely disturbing when some guy "watching" a gated community plays executioner because of a confrontation. This was probably a kid full of piss and vinegar not doing anything wrong except for wearing a hoodie walking in an area that had been burglarized in the past. When I was his age I definitely would have been shot as well but fortunately for me I grew up in a country where there aren't 200 million handguns in the hands of it's citizens so I survived with just a bruise or two!

[/B]
I guess I'm not surprized given you location

Wake up America

LOL you obviously haven't read this thread. I was just reporting facts on my last two posts. I have been saying he should be in jail since the beginning. Also, you obviously know absolutely nothing about Austin, Tx as it is one of the most liberal, progressive cities in the USA. The rest of Texas however is very conservative.

[HotHotHeat]

Originally Posted by Sowa

LOL you obviously haven't read this thread. I was just reporting facts on my last two posts. I have been saying he should be in jail since the beginning. Also, you obviously know absolutely nothing about Austin, Tx as it is one of the most liberal, progressive cities in the USA. The rest of Texas however is very conservative.

This is true - I've talked to lots of people down there through work. I was amazed at how progressive the people there seem to be. Haven't had a chance to visit yet, but I look forward to it.

Anyways.

[jayswin]

I hate it when Canadiens on CP make sweeping, ignorant generalizations about Americans, and then get owned by said Americans. I mean, I enjoy the owning part, but god damn, stop makig us look bad.

[Notorious Honey Badger]

Originally Posted by flameswin

I hate it when Canadiens on CP make sweeping, ignorant generalizations about Americans, and then get owned by said Americans. I mean, I enjoy the owning part, but god damn, stop makig us look bad.

Why are hockey players from Montreal even posting on here?

[SeeBass]

So what we have is a thread about one group of people being sterotyped due to their appearance.
Now we have somebody sterotyping about another because of were they are from. But the person giving out the sterotype is admonishing the other for sterotyping.

[troutman]

I spent last week in Orlando. This was certainly big news in the local media there - reporters posted outside the Sanford Police Station. Public rallies. Talk radio was consumed with the case - almost all callers mystified as to why there has been no arrest.

[tendulkar23]

I just don't see a case for defending Zimmerman's actions. He could have just pulled his gun out and the kid would have run away. He wasn't on the brink of life or death, he didn't have to kill the kid.

If Zimmerman gets away with this, it sets a dangerous precedent in Florida. Some idiots will carry guns and not hesitate to use them in physical altercations. Self defence is valid in some cases, but if you're following someone, it can be taken as a sign of aggression and it might make them feel threatened. Therefore, it could be argued that Trayvon was acting out of self defence. Zimmerman does not belong to any official neighbourhood watch group, he did not have any uniform on that conveyed he was patrolling the neighbourhood. It's normal for someone to feel threatened when being followed by a stranger.

The stuff cowperson has been posting is just outrageous. If anyone that has been suspended gets killed, we shouldn't feel bad because that person wasn't an angel. I know every time there is a tragedy, I look over every person's school records and I only mourn the loss of the people who weren't suspended.

It's just stupid that cowperson expects Trayvon to act in this perfect manner. He is supposed to flee when being followed, he is not supposed to ask why someone is following him, he is not supposed to wear a hood in the rain, etc. Why couldn't Zimmerman follow the instructions of the 911 dispatcher? Why couldn't he act like an adult and explain to Trayvon in a calm manner why he was following him?

Regardless of any of that, Zimmerman should not have shot and killed Trayvon. If a small gash on your head and a broken nose are the criteria for killing someone in self defence, then someone should be killed in every bar on saturday night.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by tendulkar23

I just don't see a case for defending Zimmerman's actions. He could have just pulled his gun out and the kid would have run away. He wasn't on the brink of life or death, he didn't have to kill the kid.

If Zimmerman gets away with this, it sets a dangerous precedent in Florida. Some idiots will carry guns and not hesitate to use them in physical altercations. Self defence is valid in some cases, but if you're following someone, it can be taken as a sign of aggression and it might make them feel threatened. Therefore, it could be argued that Trayvon was acting out of self defence. Zimmerman does not belong to any official neighbourhood watch group, he did not have any uniform on that conveyed he was patrolling the neighbourhood. It's normal for someone to feel threatened when being followed by a stranger.

The stuff cowperson has been posting is just outrageous. If anyone that has been suspended gets killed, we shouldn't feel bad because that person wasn't an angel. I know every time there is a tragedy, I look over every person's school records and I only mourn the loss of the people who weren't suspended.

It's just stupid that cowperson expects Trayvon to act in this perfect manner. He is supposed to flee when being followed, he is not supposed to ask why someone is following him, he is not supposed to wear a hood in the rain, etc. Why couldn't Zimmerman follow the instructions of the 911 dispatcher? Why couldn't he act like an adult and explain to Trayvon in a calm manner why he was following him?

Regardless of any of that, Zimmerman should not have shot and killed Trayvon. If a small gash on your head and a broken nose are the criteria for killing someone in self defence, then someone should be killed in every bar on saturday night.

How many times does Cowperson have to tell you, the kid was caught skipping school one time. Good instincts Zimmerman!!!

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by tendulkar23

I just don't see a case for defending Zimmerman's actions. He could have just pulled his gun out and the kid would have run away. He wasn't on the brink of life or death, he didn't have to kill the kid.

If Zimmerman gets away with this, it sets a dangerous precedent in Florida. Some idiots will carry guns and not hesitate to use them in physical altercations. Self defence is valid in some cases, but if you're following someone, it can be taken as a sign of aggression and it might make them feel threatened. Therefore, it could be argued that Trayvon was acting out of self defence. Zimmerman does not belong to any official neighbourhood watch group, he did not have any uniform on that conveyed he was patrolling the neighbourhood. It's normal for someone to feel threatened when being followed by a stranger.

The stuff cowperson has been posting is just outrageous. If anyone that has been suspended gets killed, we shouldn't feel bad because that person wasn't an angel. I know every time there is a tragedy, I look over every person's school records and I only mourn the loss of the people who weren't suspended.

It's just stupid that cowperson expects Trayvon to act in this perfect manner. He is supposed to flee when being followed, he is not supposed to ask why someone is following him, he is not supposed to wear a hood in the rain, etc. Why couldn't Zimmerman follow the instructions of the 911 dispatcher? Why couldn't he act like an adult and explain to Trayvon in a calm manner why he was following him?

Regardless of any of that, Zimmerman should not have shot and killed Trayvon. If a small gash on your head and a broken nose are the criteria for killing someone in self defence, then someone should be killed in every bar on saturday night.

While I agree with most of what your saying, when you start talking about the criteria and legalities for killing and self defense you are looking at it through our laws and our morals. I can tell by the way you are speaking that you are. The laws are different in Florida and a lot of peoples view on the matter are too. Do we up here agree with them? No. I'm as sick about it as many hare. And I think even many people down in Florida and the US in general will say things have gone too far in one direction. But to say it will open up dangerous precedents or there will be a rise in problems might be overstating the position a bit. Besides, the fallout around the situation has already been heightened in the States. It's not like the lens HASN'T been turned on the situation. It is bigger than the average news story. I guess we will see how long it continues to be.