[News] Expansion decision expected by June 22 - Page 3 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

sureLoss · 05-31-2016, 09:14 AM

The NHL gave all those potential owners in Seattle a chance to put their money where there mouth is and apply for an expansion team.

None of them did (I am sure for varying reasons). Says a lot in terms of the current state of Seattle as a potential NHL expansion city.

Flash Walken · 05-31-2016, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sureLoss

The NHL gave all those potential owners in Seattle a chance to put their money where there mouth is and apply for an expansion team.

None of them did. Says a lot in terms of the current state of Seattle as a potential NHL expansion city.

So you're telling me it was all just a ruse when Darryl Katz flew to Seattle to talk about moving the team?

Say it ain't so, SureLoss. Say it ain't so.

troutman · 05-31-2016, 09:18 AM

QC - I predict a riot.

Erick Estrada · 05-31-2016, 09:20 AM

If there were any doubts about the ability of Vegas to support professional sports the NFL wouldn't entertain it and it's looking like a matter of time until they approve the Raiders move there. I believe it's an untapped market ready for a professional sports franchise. I don't have a crystal ball that tells me it's a 100% slam dunk but it's the best overall city in the running for a team and the league wants to add another team.

Lanny_McDonald · 05-31-2016, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Which is why Gary Bettman needs to go. Vegas is the next Arizona Coyotes only worse, it is going to fail and fail miserably. The current season ticket drive might be doing ok but the novelty will wear off quickly. People go to Vegas to have a good time gambling, or going to shows, or a million other things to do besides go to a hockey game. Quebec City on the other hand is a hockey crazed city that would sell out every single game. I get that Bettman's ultimate goal is to make the game bigger in the States but this is just an epic fail of an idea.

Someone doesn't understand what Bettman's job is or who he represents. A guy that manages to get $500M in expansion fees from anyone is guaranteed to have long term employment with any league. The owners have to be tickled pink with his performance, as does the NHLPA.

I don't disagree with what you are saying about Vegas. In fact I support much of what you say about the likelihood Vegas is successful. But the reality here is the NHL is positioning itself to have 32 teams and have better balance east-to-west. Vegas may not end up being successful, but I believe that the long term goal is to get a team in Seattle and have Portland as a relocation target for Phoenix or Vegas. One will survive. Phoenix's survival likely depends on ASU, otherwise they will likely move in he next five years. Vegas may not be viable, but the fact that the NFL wants to get into Vegas as well should give the NHL a lot more confidence in their position. I think there is still a ton of risk, as selling 10 games is much easier than selling 44. I think Vegas is fraught with risk and wouldn't go down that road, but $500M is a lot of money to turn down.

I fully expect the NHL to announce that Las Vegas is getting an expansion team, starting play in 2017-18. Quebec City will not get an expansion team, but will see a relocation of Carolina in the near future, probably 2017-18 or 2018-19. Seattle will be an expansion team down the road, and the NHL will have balance across the conferences. At least this is what I think makes the most strategic sense.

troutman · 05-31-2016, 09:24 AM

LV home games will be a strange experience, where fans of the visiting team far outnumber the home team fans. Moreso than Phoenix.

PepsiFree · 05-31-2016, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Ok, you are a tourist coming to Vegas. You can go to shows, concerts, gambling, etc...but instead you are going to go to a hockey game, the least popular sport in the U.S.? I really don't think so.

The least popular sport in the US? Care to find a reference for that because it's not even close. The least popular of the "Big 4"? Yeah, but it's still part of the Big 4.

I mean, Celine Dion isn't one of the top 10 most popular artists in the US, but she did fine.

The only major league sports team IS going to be a draw, even if the NFL comes in (considering the difference in amount of games played).

Least popular of the Big 4 =/= Not popular. That's basic stuff.

troutman · 05-31-2016, 09:33 AM

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...e-stanley-cup/

Not an exact science, but more grist for the mill.

saskflames69 · 05-31-2016, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troutman

LV home games will be a strange experience, where fans of the visiting team far outnumber the home team fans. Moreso than Phoenix.

Our neighbours at the lake own a home in Henderson NV where they reside over the winter. Both are die-hard Habs fans, and have already signed up for season tickets. The husband plans on wearing his Larry Robinson jersey to every game, but basically, he's just excited to watch the 30 other NHL teams - his exact words.

My aunt and uncle also own a home down there, so I'm pretty excited to go to Vegas in 2017-18

FiveSeven · 05-31-2016, 09:57 AM

What about the people that live in Vegas? It's not like they keep on living the Vegas lifestyle. There are a lot of normal people just living life. I don't think the novelty will wear off so drastically that it will look like a terrible move. Only time will tell though.

Resolute 14 · 05-31-2016, 10:22 AM

Vegas will be an interesting experiment, that's for sure. It will have one major advantage over Phoenix in that the arena will be right at the heart of the city. Level of success may well depend in large part on whether or not the team has any success.

Enoch Root · 05-31-2016, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Vegas will be an interesting experiment, that's for sure. It will have one major advantage over Phoenix in that the arena will be right at the heart of the city. Level of success may well depend in large part on whether or not the team has any success.

This is a key point, and the reason that the expansion rules have changed. It is silly to invite teams into the league and then expect them to suck balls for 5 years - completely counter-intuitive to trying to grow a new fanbase.

I am really interested in seeing just how competitive the expansion team(s) will be right from the start. It would be awesome (though obviously unlikely) for them to make the playoffs in year one. Talk about giving the fanbase an injection of excitement!

Oling_Roachinen · 05-31-2016, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troutman

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/...e-stanley-cup/

Not an exact science, but more grist for the mill.

1.6M population for Calgary and Edmonton? Even 'media market' population that seems excessive.

EldrickOnIce · 05-31-2016, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Ok, you are a tourist coming to Vegas. You can go to shows, concerts, gambling, etc...but instead you are going to go to a hockey game, the least popular sport in the U.S.? I really don't think so.

Doing some pretty rough calculations with information I got from
http://www.lvcva.com/stats-and-facts...or-statistics/
About 25,000,000 people visit Las Vegas during the NHL season, about 3,750,000 of them are Canadians. Obviously lots else to see/do, but will definitely sell some tickets to visitors too. I'd rather take in a Vegas/Anybody game than see Celine Dion.

Finger Cookin · 05-31-2016, 11:12 AM

Click into the article and it explains how the market sizes are determined. They're the TV market sizes as determined by Nielsen (USA) and Numeris (Canada), albeit from several years ago as the article itself is now three years old.

1qqaaz · 05-31-2016, 11:13 AM

Selfishly, I hope the expansion happens, just so it's easier for Calgary to get an elite goalie.

the2bears · 05-31-2016, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

1.6M population for Calgary and Edmonton? Even 'media market' population that seems excessive.

And more for Edmonton? The city proper and metro area numbers I've seen all show Edmonton less than Calgary.

EldrickOnIce · 05-31-2016, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

1.6M population for Calgary and Edmonton? Even 'media market' population that seems excessive.

Half million people outside the city in the Calgary media market?
Seems about right to me

Vinny01 · 05-31-2016, 11:23 AM

I have a bit of inside info on Vegas

What I was told is the home games for this team will typically always fall during the weekdays as such a huge portion of the locals work on the weekends. They are gearing up for a good home base of fans. Those hoping to catch a Friday or Saturday night flames game will likely be disappointed. On the bright side it is cheaper to go to Vegas on weekdays than the weekend but it chews up vacation days for us Mon-Fri crowd

Oling_Roachinen · 05-31-2016, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EldrickOnIce

Half million people outside the city in the Calgary media market?
Seems about right to me

Not really though, I mean depending on how far you want to go to define the market. Add up Airdrie, Okotoks, Chestermere, Cochrane, High River, and throw in some rural numbers and it still doesn't get really all that close to 1.6M. With those numbers, it seems that they are probably double dipping on Red Deer and including it in both markets.