08-14-2017, 01:26 PM
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#61
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Franchise Player
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This really isn't meant to be implemented at the pro level - it's a development tool for kids. It's not about anything other than that.
In 10 years, when the US has a new generation of kids that learned an entire unique skillset to play with the puck while on the PK, that's going to have an impact.
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The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to GreenLantern2814 For This Useful Post:
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08-14-2017, 01:37 PM
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#62
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
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What a stupid ####ing rule. Hopefully that never comes to the NHL. The game is fine the way it is ffs. More goals does not equal more exciting hockey lol.
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08-14-2017, 01:45 PM
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#63
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Franchise Player
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What's better for the team on the PP...
A (basically) 50-50 saw off for possession in the faceoff circle but a little more "real" time on the PP or ability to move the puck up ice and find coverage holes as a 5 man unit facing a 4 man unit while burning time off the clock?
I'm not sure but something tells me in the junior, college and pro game everything comes out in the wash.
I understand it for the kids as it will help foster skill and decision making in pressure situations.
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08-14-2017, 02:25 PM
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#64
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Crash and Bang Winger
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: 202-19 (4) 216-11(3)
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Yeah, the best strategy will still be to ice it. So now we will just have a couple extra faceoffs each PP.
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08-14-2017, 03:15 PM
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#65
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sunshine Coast
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The reasoning behind this is all about teaching skill at a young age and to be honest the Americans are developing skilled young players more so than we Canadians, I believe.
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The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Vulcan For This Useful Post:
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08-15-2017, 08:04 AM
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#66
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In the Sin Bin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vulcan
The reasoning behind this is all about teaching skill at a young age and to be honest the Americans are developing skilled young players more so than we Canadians, I believe.
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Are they?
Central Scouting's top ten NA skaters heading into recent drafts:
2017: Canada 8, USA 1
2016: Canada 2, USA 5 (+Matthews, who was listed as a European prospect)
2015: Canada 4, USA 3
2014: Canada 9, USA 0
2013: Canada 7, USA 1
2012: Canada 4, USA 2
2011: Canada 8, USA 0
2010: Canada 7, USA 3
2009: Canada 8, USA 2
2008: Canada 8, USA 2
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08-15-2017, 10:26 AM
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#67
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NOT breaking news
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814
This really isn't meant to be implemented at the pro level - it's a development tool for kids. It's not about anything other than that.
In 10 years, when the US has a new generation of kids that learned an entire unique skillset to play with the puck while on the PK, that's going to have an impact.
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I would love to play that team in 10 years so I could strip the puck off of them while on the PP.
__________________
Watching the Oilers defend is like watching fire engines frantically rushing to the wrong fire
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08-15-2017, 12:10 PM
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#68
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tromboner
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: where the lattes are
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Something that's perhaps being overlooked is what the defensive team is going to do after they win the face-off. Under current rules, they usually ice it. That would result in another face-off though, so it wouldn't be much of a win. The actual penalty killing has to be a soft dump, possession by the penalized team, or possession by the offensive team.
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08-15-2017, 04:03 PM
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#69
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sunshine Coast
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Resolute 14
Are they?
Central Scouting's top ten NA skaters heading into recent drafts:
2017: Canada 8, USA 1
2016: Canada 2, USA 5 (+Matthews, who was listed as a European prospect)
2015: Canada 4, USA 3
2014: Canada 9, USA 0
2013: Canada 7, USA 1
2012: Canada 4, USA 2
2011: Canada 8, USA 0
2010: Canada 7, USA 3
2009: Canada 8, USA 2
2008: Canada 8, USA 2
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In 2017 there were actually 4 Canadians and 1 American taken in the top ten so your argument is skewed. Also in team play the American juniors are beating our Canadian kids fairly regularly.
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08-15-2017, 04:11 PM
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#70
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Bay Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SebC
Something that's perhaps being overlooked is what the defensive team is going to do after they win the face-off. Under current rules, they usually ice it. That would result in another face-off though, so it wouldn't be much of a win. The actual penalty killing has to be a soft dump, possession by the penalized team, or possession by the offensive team.
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Though time has been removed from the clock, and the flow of the play has been broken up - which likely(?) favours the PK team.
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08-16-2017, 09:59 AM
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#71
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Franchise Player
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For younger players (such as proposed) I really like this change as it encourages thinking, puck patience and some skill when you are on the PK. Nothing wrong with that since it is all about skill development at that age. Last time we played games in the U.S. they also did not have the tag up offside rule, it was an automatic whistle on an offside. I liked that one too as it also encourages patience and puck movement while you wait for your team mates to clear the zone rather than just mindlessly dump it in every time.
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08-16-2017, 10:13 AM
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#72
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In the Sin Bin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vulcan
In 2017 there were actually 4 Canadians and 1 American taken in the top ten so your argument is skewed. Also in team play the American juniors are beating our Canadian kids fairly regularly.
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On the first: Obviously, since Europeans are drafted as well. I used CSB's top ten NA skaters list as it has consistent criteria and largely restricts itself to the two nations under discussion.
On the second: I presume you are referring to USA Hockey's success at the U18 level? Much of that is a result of the US U18 team being the USNTDP program team, which plays together throughout the season. That offers a significant advantage over teams that are thrown together just for tournaments. At younger age groups, Canada's talent base is divided into two or four teams per tournament. And none of this has translated at the U20 and adult levels, however.
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08-16-2017, 10:25 AM
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#73
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NOT breaking news
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lubicon
For younger players (such as proposed) I really like this change as it encourages thinking, puck patience and some skill when you are on the PK. Nothing wrong with that since it is all about skill development at that age. Last time we played games in the U.S. they also did not have the tag up offside rule, it was an automatic whistle on an offside. I liked that one too as it also encourages patience and puck movement while you wait for your team mates to clear the zone rather than just mindlessly dump it in every time.
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i think in the 90s the non-tag offside rule was easily 'trapped' by the defending team. Line 5 guys on the blueline, how to you get in?
For it to work, there has to be absolutely no tolerance of interference which with NHL refereeing is not possible.
__________________
Watching the Oilers defend is like watching fire engines frantically rushing to the wrong fire
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08-16-2017, 11:28 AM
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#74
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GirlySports
i think in the 90s the non-tag offside rule was easily 'trapped' by the defending team. Line 5 guys on the blueline, how to you get in?
For it to work, there has to be absolutely no tolerance of interference which with NHL refereeing is not possible.
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Agreed, would not work in the NHL. I am referring to minor hockey where skill development, especially at younger ages is important. Specifically in regards to tag up offside I noticed the biggest difference not at the initial zone entry but rather when a team had possession in the O Zone and the puck came out momentarily. Typically when there is the tag up rule and the defenceman got back to the puck and was under any kind of pressure they just dump it back in, everyone tags up, and then goes back on the forecheck. With the immediate whistle it forced the D man (or whomever had possession) to look for a pass option (D to D etc.) or maneuver away from the pressure while waiting for the forwards to clear the zone.
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08-17-2017, 02:14 PM
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#75
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: SW Ontario
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lubicon
For younger players (such as proposed) I really like this change as it encourages thinking, puck patience and some skill when you are on the PK. Nothing wrong with that since it is all about skill development at that age. Last time we played games in the U.S. they also did not have the tag up offside rule, it was an automatic whistle on an offside. I liked that one too as it also encourages patience and puck movement while you wait for your team mates to clear the zone rather than just mindlessly dump it in every time.
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Both rules add more whistles (and thus more time) to a game's playing time. NHL would be crazy to do it. For the icing rule to work in the NHL, it'd have to be a penalty so it wouldn't happen often.
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08-17-2017, 02:37 PM
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#76
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Powerplay Quarterback
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Republic of Panama
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When the WHA was functioning their rule was you had to carry or pass the puck over your own blue line before being able to ice it while killing a penalty. Failing to do that would result in a regular icing call.
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