Calgary Public Transit - Discussion

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by RW99

Yeah, look at the 40th Ave station. Either they cut out the school and Timmy's on the West side or more houses and the church on the East side.

*edit Looks like a lot of single lanes on Centre, especially Southbound.

The church land will be redeveloped before the green line is finished. Centre Street Church is currently selling/just sold that property.

[Fuzz]

The centre street section is going to be a bit of a disaster. I know they are going for a "community" feel to this, but pedestrians are going to be running across that one or two lanes of traffic(that are going to be very busy) to get to the platform when they see a train coming. I can also see j-walkers using the tracks as a kind of safety island when they decide to cross centre, wherever they want. Until a train comes...

I give this a year before we have fences all over the place.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

The centre street section is going to be a bit of a disaster. I know they are going for a "community" feel to this, but pedestrians are going to be running across that one or two lanes of traffic(that are going to be very busy) to get to the platform when they see a train coming. I can also see j-walkers using the tracks as a kind of safety island when they decide to cross centre, wherever they want. Until a train comes...

I give this a year before we have fences all over the place.

16th to 36th will be an interesting social experiment.

[temple5]

I apologize if this has been answered before, is Centre street going to 1 lane in each direction for about 20 blocks north of 20th Ave or is the video just not showing 2 lanes?

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by temple5

I apologize if this has been answered before, is Centre street going to 1 lane in each direction for about 20 blocks north of 20th Ave or is the video just not showing 2 lanes?

Some sections will be 2, some 1, and I think it will switch sides where the 3rd lane is, depending on turn bays. In some ways, it shouldn't be a big deal as the buses often block the second lane anyway when they stop, and I would hope any remaining buses have stop bays out of the one traffic lane...

I chuckled a little seeing a bendy bus driving beside the LRT in the render. Why would we still run those monsters on that route with an LRT?

[temple5]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Some sections will be 2, some 1, and I think it will switch sides where the 3rd lane is, depending on turn bays. In some ways, it shouldn't be a big deal as the buses often block the second lane anyway when they stop, and I would hope any remaining buses have stop bays out of the one traffic lane...

I chuckled a little seeing a bendy bus driving beside the LRT in the render. Why would we still run those monsters on that route with an LRT?

Thanks and ouch. 1 lane, I wonder if people at the NW workshops were shown that render. I cant believe that because we live in a city that needs a people/cars vs trains thread that we cant run them on the normal road. Geez people get with it, how hard is it not be hit by a train - Darwinism at its best.

I as well hope there would be few buses on those sections. Hopefully they simply shuttle people to and from train stations in oval type routes

[RW99]

You would almost think they would do some optimization on Edmonton Trail and 4th ST NW prior to this work to make sure they can handle the increased traffic.

[Fuzz]

I hope so. I live just off of 4th st NW and this is going to bring some pain for awhile.

[Knalus]

Edmonton Trail is going to get so so busy.

Should have been the train route, to be honest.

[The Yen Man]

If 36th street is any indication, Centre street is going to be such a gongshow in the future once this is in. And 36th St. has 2 to 3 lanes all the way through, and does not have houses on either side. They should really bite the bullet and try to put as much of this underground as they can, or raise it up.

[Wormius]

Kinda my feeling too. I guess the tunnel boring is expensive, but it doesn't need to be as deep as it is closer to downtown.

[Wormius]

Kinda my feeling too. I guess the tunnel boring is expensive, but it doesn't need to be as deep as it is closer to downtown.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by GGG

No it won't, for local trips the bus is a very viable option for short trips.

Inner city bus service is always attrocious.

High frequency route? It's gonna be full of commuters before it gets to you.
Local service only? It's gonna be low frequency and limited hours.
Trying to cross downtown? You're going to be stopped at a timepoint somewhere in the middle of your route.

The best way to serve the inner city is with sufficient station density.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by SebC

Inner city bus service is always attrocious.

High frequency route? It's gonna be full of commuters before it gets to you.
Local service only? It's gonna be low frequency and limited hours.
Trying to cross downtown? You're going to be stopped at a timepoint somewhere in the middle of your route.

The best way to serve the inner city is with sufficient station density.

Is 4 stations enough density? It's the highest density per km^2 of any area in the city outside of 7th ave

[SebC]

Originally Posted by GGG

Is 4 stations enough density? It's the highest density per km^2 of any area in the city outside of 7th ave

NW line has has two stops north of the river and inside 16th Ave, and that seems appropriate to me.

[ken0042]

Actually the NW line has 3 stops. Sunnyside, SAIT, and Lion's Park. The difference being is that each of those stations serves many more people than 9th ave would.

First of all, that NW leg is about 3 km long, and the NC leg from the river to 16th ave is 1.4 km. Next, the surface distance from 9th ave to 16th ave is 650 metres, and Google puts that as an 8 minute walk. Next factor in at least a 5 minute escalator ride down to the station. So that means anybody north of 10th ave would be faster to get to the 16th ave station, and anybody passing what would be the entrance to 9th ave only adds 3 minutes to their trip.

So for very few people, you shave 3 minutes off their trip- but stop a train carrying 200 people for a minute.

At a cost of $250M, and also have the most expensive station to maintain. Having more escalators than the rest of Calgary Transit's stations combined, that is going to a monumental ongoing expense. I agree, if it could be a surface station or even 2 stories underground, it would be a worthwhile addition for the reasons you point out.

[MrMastodonFarm]

What are the potential ridership numbers for 9th ave station, ken?

[Fuzz]

Not sure I have seen anything on numbers, but the census area from 16th to the bluff, 4th st to Edmonton Trail has 6097 people. Transit share is 10-15% in that area. Assuming(generously) half the transit ridership would transfer to the LRT at 9th ave station, that's, what 300-450ish people? $500k per user, what a deal!

[Tyler]

Today City Council approved using fed/prov money plus cash from reserves to buy 6 new Mask LRT cars.

Total cost $29M. This is on top of The City's existing Mask train order.

[Jimmy Stang]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Not sure I have seen anything on numbers, but the census area from 16th to the bluff, 4th st to Edmonton Trail has 6097 people. Transit share is 10-15% in that area. Assuming(generously) half the transit ridership would transfer to the LRT at 9th ave station, that's, what 300-450ish people? $500k per user, what a deal!

Don't forget about riders that would be frequenting businesses in the area, or employed by them. It isn't very dense residential area, but there are a lot of businesses along Centre. I'm certainly not saying that this justifies such an expensive station right now, but the possibility of future TOD in the area would help to justify it later.

If this were a regular station, it would be a no brainer. But the depth/cost really does make it tricky.