Let's Talk about the Calgary Police Service

[MBates]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

why? I guess I feel like you deserve the ticket for getting all mad and aggressive and intentionally cutting off a car, and maybe you were tailgating to begin with, leading to him braking on you.

guess we'll see how it goes for you in court.

This is the kind of blind police worship I just cannot comprehend. You are prepared to excuse the deliberate careless driving of a police officer in this scenario on the speculation of "maybe you were tailgating to begin with".

If he was tailgating, why pray-tell would the officer not enforce the law, conduct a traffic stop in an orderly and safe manner and issue a ticket for following too close along with some well advised education on why that is unsafe?

Instead, he slams on his brakes which is itself road-rage type careless driving and you find no fault in that? Astonishing.

Calgaryblood should file a complaint against the officer for endangering lives on the road (what if he was tailgating and not paying enough attention and slammed into the rear of the police car during the brilliant and totally illegal 'brake check' maneuver?) and then defend the ticket on the basis of entrapment and abuse of process.

The phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" applies and all, but he never claimed he was in the "right" and still people are prepared to criticize only one of the "wrongs" since one of them was done by a police officer. Why?!

[Fuzz]

I think most of us are just questioning Calgaryblood's story. With no evidence, it sounds suspect. Especially when the story changes(cop doing 80, then 90).

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by MBates

This is the kind of blind police worship I just cannot comprehend. You are prepared to excuse the deliberate careless driving of a police officer in this scenario on the speculation of "maybe you were tailgating to begin with".

If he was tailgating, why pray-tell would the officer not enforce the law, conduct a traffic stop in an orderly and safe manner and issue a ticket for following too close along with some well advised education on why that is unsafe?

Instead, he slams on his brakes which is itself road-rage type careless driving and you find no fault in that? Astonishing.

Calgaryblood should file a complaint against the officer for endangering lives on the road (what if he was tailgating and not paying enough attention and slammed into the rear of the police car during the brilliant and totally illegal 'brake check' maneuver?) and then defend the ticket on the basis of entrapment and abuse of process.

The phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" applies and all, but he never claimed he was in the "right" and still people are prepared to criticize only one of the "wrongs" since one of them was done by a police officer. Why?!

I think you're reading too much into this. It was an emotional post from a someone who has a tendency to overreact. Maybe the events happened the way he said, but I'm thinking more than likely his view is a little different than what happened in reality.

[Resolute 14]

The problem, MBates, is that it is incredibly hard to believe that a cop was both doing 80 in the right lane and deliberately brake checked someone. You can complain about "blind police worship", but I'll counter with blind police hate.

More to the point, I've encountered a hell of lot more angry people who deserved their tickets making excuses for their behaviour than I have encountered cops deliberately creating dangerous situations on a freeway.

TBQH, I think Calgaryblood is full of crap.

[calgaryblood]

If I was making it up wouldn't I have said I didn't do anything wrong? When in fact I admitted to being in the wrong in the OP?

You don't have to believe me but calling me full of crap is uncalled for. I will be asking for disclosure including the dash cam video of the officer and will personally PM you relsolute so you can watch it and then you can apologize or you can keep acting like a petty child.

[llwhiteoutll]

Originally Posted by MBates

This is the kind of blind police worship I just cannot comprehend. You are prepared to excuse the deliberate careless driving of a police officer in this scenario on the speculation of "maybe you were tailgating to begin with".

If he was tailgating, why pray-tell would the officer not enforce the law, conduct a traffic stop in an orderly and safe manner and issue a ticket for following too close along with some well advised education on why that is unsafe?

Instead, he slams on his brakes which is itself road-rage type careless driving and you find no fault in that? Astonishing.

Calgaryblood should file a complaint against the officer for endangering lives on the road (what if he was tailgating and not paying enough attention and slammed into the rear of the police car during the brilliant and totally illegal 'brake check' maneuver?) and then defend the ticket on the basis of entrapment and abuse of process.

I don't see how he would claim entrapment when he is trying to defend cutting another vehicle off.

If he can prove that he was brake checked, then he should file a complaint for sure. But the cop going slower than the limit and CB deciding to cut him off isn't entrapment. The police dashcam might show some evidence of a brake check, but that isn't a defense to what CB got ticketed for.

[Torrie the Whaler]

I think they should stop arming the Cops with guns until they learn to police with out them.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

If I was making it up wouldn't I have said I didn't do anything wrong? When in fact I admitted to being in the wrong in the OP?

You don't have to believe me but calling me full of crap is uncalled for. I will be asking for disclosure including the dash cam video of the officer and will personally PM you relsolute so you can watch it and then you can apologize or you can keep acting like a petty child.

Oh, please do.

Face it, even if we take at face value that you were brake checked, that only is an admission you were following too close or tailgating. The lesson I am taking from your little story is that you are a dangerous a-hole who should not be on the road.

Cops certainly can be dicks, but I think you're just making excuses to rationalize your behaviour.

[MBates]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

The problem, MBates, is that it is incredibly hard to believe that a cop was both doing 80 in the right lane and deliberately brake checked someone. You can complain about "blind police worship", but I'll counter with blind police hate.

More to the point, I've encountered a hell of lot more angry people who deserved their tickets making excuses for their behaviour than I have encountered cops deliberately creating dangerous situations on a freeway.

TBQH, I think Calgaryblood is full of crap.

I guess I missed that the story is seen as false because of the history of the poster. I can't comment on that I just don't know individual people here that well as to make that judgment. Seems a little odd though to make up a story where you admit outright you were an idiot and in the wrong and are not saying the other alleged wrongdoing offers an excuse.

I don't hate police at all. I do think police should follow and respect the law the same as the rest of us. And I do not have the same difficulty as you in being able to believe an officer could behave this way.

I had a client acquitted at trial on a charge of causing a public disturbance. We proved it was the CPS officer who caused the disturbance and then when the citizen reacted he was arrested. In that case the judge actually found that if my client was not Asian he didn't think the officer would have ever even approached him let alone provoked him into a bad reaction.

I represented a client successfully who was dragged out of his vehicle at a traffic stop and beaten and maced by the officer for no reason. That is not my opinion but the findings of the solicitor general's official review. And in that case the officer deliberately deleted my client's recording of the incident. Wonder why he did that?

I could go on but then I suppose my listing of facts would support your contention I am a blind police hater. Incidentally, the current Minister of Justice, the chair of the Calgary Police Commission the current CPS Chief and at least two Deputy Chiefs disagree with you on that.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Face it, even if we take at face value that you were brake checked, that only is an admission you were following too close or tailgating. The lesson I am taking from your little story is that you are a dangerous a-hole who should not be on the road.

Well if you take it at face value, you have to admit that the cop was also a dangerous a-hole who should not be on the road.

Like everyone else reading this, I don't know what happened because I wasn't there, but I know this: cops can be dicks too. This is proven time and time again.

Then we hear a story about one of them being a dick and the pat response is "I don't believe a cop would do that".

We know that, just like everyone else, since they are like everyone else, cops can be dicks. We know this. Now maybe this cop wasn't being a dick and the OPs story is simply made up, but it sure as hell could have happened, yet some people don't even accept it as a possibility.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Oh, please do.

Face it, even if we take at face value that you were brake checked, that only is an admission you were following too close or tailgating. The lesson I am taking from your little story is that you are a dangerous a-hole who should not be on the road.

Cops certainly can be dicks, but I think you're just making excuses to rationalize your behaviour.

This is a classic example of what MBates what talking about. Blind love and support for the Calgary police which is part of the problem. Congrats, resolute.

And apparently you never read any of my posts, I admitted what I did, said it was stupid and took responsibility without saying it was the officers fault I did what I did. Does that mean what the cop did was right? Nope.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

This is a classic example of what MBates what talking about. Blind love and support for the Calgary police which is part of the problem. Congrats, resolute.

And apparently you never read any of my posts, I admitted what I did, said it was stupid and took responsibility without saying it was the officers fault I did what I did. Does that mean what the cop did was right? Nope.

I wouldn't really say you took responsibility of it. Yeah you said you were stupid and did it, followed up with a "but".

Yeah mom I punched my brother, but he was annoying me.

I don't really comprehend how some drivers feel the need to get revenge when they feel wronged. What good comes of cutting someone off? Worst case scenario you cause an accident and people die, it just doesn't seem worth it.

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Let's talk about how I was just brake checked by an undercover unit on Deerfoot in the right lane and then pulled over and given a $543 careless driving ticket. I swear he was baiting me to cut him off as he was doing 80 in the right lane. Stupid me did cut him off but that definitely felt like he was baiting cars.

[MBates]

Originally Posted by llwhiteoutll

I don't see how he would claim entrapment when he is trying to defend cutting another vehicle off.

If he can prove that he was brake checked, then he should file a complaint for sure. But the cop going slower than the limit and CB deciding to cut him off isn't entrapment. The police dashcam might show some evidence of a brake check, but that isn't a defense to what CB got ticketed for.

Entrapment is not a traditional 'defence' in the sense of it being a justification or excuse. Entrapment is a policy based refusal to allow the state to essentially make people commit offences. You are otherwise guilty of the offence you committed but if you establish the abuse of process then a stay of proceedings is entered. On its face police brake checking a guy (illegal careless driving act) provoking him to commit a retaliatory driving offence and then charging him for that is plainly capable of being entrapment.

This link looks like a pretty good summary:

http://criminalnotebook.ca/index.php/Entrapment

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

This is a classic example of what MBates what talking about. Blind love and support for the Calgary police which is part of the problem. Congrats, resolute.

And apparently you never read any of my posts, I admitted what I did, said it was stupid and took responsibility without saying it was the officers fault I did what I did. Does that mean what the cop did was right? Nope.

Wait, aren't you going to court to fight the ticket? That's not exactly taking responsibility even if it's the smart thing to do.

[MBates]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Wait, aren't you going to court to fight the ticket? That's not exactly taking responsibility even if it's the smart thing to do.

See my post on entrapment / abuse of process. He can show up and plead guilty and then argue the case should be thrown out. He can take responsibility for his actions but also ask the court to address the misconduct of the state by staying the proceeding.

One can argue that paying the fine and taking the demerits is the only pure form of taking full responsibility but being baited by police into committing an offence you were not otherwise going to commit is seen in our system of justice as diminishing your true responsibility.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

This is a classic example of what MBates what talking about. Blind love and support for the Calgary police which is part of the problem. Congrats, resolute.

And apparently you never read any of my posts, I admitted what I did, said it was stupid and took responsibility without saying it was the officers fault I did what I did. Does that mean what the cop did was right? Nope.

If my choice is "blind love and support" for a police officer whose story has not been told or blind love and support for someone who has admitted to risking the lives of other drivers on the highway, then yeah, my support will default to the party who is not an admitted ahole.

But by all means, send me that dashcam footage when you get it. Because at this point, you word alone simply is not believable.

[RW99]

I'm seeing photo radar SUVs a lot more recently, on Deerfoot and Glenmore. I think I got one for going about 12 km/h over. My first ticket!

[Coys1882]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Let's talk about how I was just brake checked by an undercover unit on Deerfoot in the right lane and then pulled over and given a $543 careless driving ticket. I swear he was baiting me to cut him off as he was doing 80 in the right lane. Stupid me did cut him off but that definitely felt like he was baiting cars.

I'm skimming the thread so I may have missed it but is it possible that the police officer legitimately braked quickly and you were just too close?

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

If my choice is "blind love and support" for a police officer whose story has not been told or blind love and support for someone who has admitted to risking the lives of other drivers on the highway, then yeah, my support will default to the party who is not an admitted ahole.

But by all means, send me that dashcam footage when you get it. Because at this point, you word alone simply is not believable.

If there's anything I've learned over the years it's that if I had to choose between the word of an officer and an angry internet poster it's a pretty easy decision. I realize that officers can be dicks and like everyone they are not perfect and make mistakes on their job but Calgary drivers are terrible and plenty can't accept getting ticketed even if they are at fault. Don't get me wrong that I hate getting a ticket like everyone else but I learned a long time ago to be cordial and never argue with the officer and it's amazing how many people argue about clearly defined offenses like speeding. I'm not saying CB is lying but IMO he put himself in a situation to be ticketed and if he wants to fight it that's fine but I really don't see any controversy here as I've been arrested and ticketed probably more than most people here and I can't recall a single time where I wasn't responsible even if there were times where the officer twisted the knife a little more than he/she had to.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by MBates

This is the kind of blind police worship I just cannot comprehend. You are prepared to excuse the deliberate careless driving of a police officer in this scenario on the speculation of "maybe you were tailgating to begin with".

If he was tailgating, why pray-tell would the officer not enforce the law, conduct a traffic stop in an orderly and safe manner and issue a ticket for following too close along with some well advised education on why that is unsafe?

Instead, he slams on his brakes which is itself road-rage type careless driving and you find no fault in that? Astonishing.

Calgaryblood should file a complaint against the officer for endangering lives on the road (what if he was tailgating and not paying enough attention and slammed into the rear of the police car during the brilliant and totally illegal 'brake check' maneuver?) and then defend the ticket on the basis of entrapment and abuse of process.

The phrase "two wrongs don't make a right" applies and all, but he never claimed he was in the "right" and still people are prepared to criticize only one of the "wrongs" since one of them was done by a police officer. Why?!

you mean if what he says is true, he should file a complaint. don't go off on the police and myself when you don't know the story. none of us do.
not saying I refuse to ever find fault in the actions of police, but to be blunt I don't feel the OP is telling the whole truth. (not that he has to, on a hockey message board)

how do you know the OP was telling the complete truth? maybe he was bending the story a bit to make himself the victim. maybe it is the unvarnished truth.

all we know is the OP admits to driving like a jerk and cutting the cop off. anything else is idle speculation. from you and me. I think you're way off the mark in this case of accusing me of blind devotion to the police.