[Rumour] Friedman: Ducks really like Sam Bennett

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

It's not anyone else's responsibility to make the connections that you've made in your own head. State them explicitly or expect to be wrong.

Edit: Nylander has technically played two seasons, or at least enough to knock off two years of his ELC.

Lol

You're obviously not interested in discussing anything.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

No the deal would have to be after the expansion draft. Or we would need confirmation Ferland and Lazar would be safe if we went 4-4-1

That's the problem with any trade discussion. The Flames could only make a trade after the expansion draft, but the only reason the Ducks are likely to trade one of their d-men is to get value for a player they'll otherwise lose in the expansion draft for nothing. There's no reason for the Ducks to make a trade after the expansion draft.

[killer_carlson]

Anyone howling about Bennett's production best look at what he was saddled with for wingers all year.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Lol

You're obviously not interested in discussing anything.

You're obviously not interested in discussing anything either. If you were, you would probably try to say what you mean, instead of blaming everybody else for hearing what you actually said.

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Nylander is getting the Bennett treatment. He is a center playing as a winger. But much better than Bennett.

You are not getting Lindholm for Bennett. As bad as it sounds you are likely not getting Vatanen for Bennett.

By you I mean the Flames or anyone else in the Pacific if they had Bennett. Vatanen will go east.

I agree with Lindholm but your off your rocker if you actually believe the bolded.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Nylander is getting the Bennett treatment. He is a center playing as a winger. But much better than Bennett.

You are not getting Lindholm for Bennett. As bad as it sounds you are likely not getting Vatanen for Bennett.

By you I mean the Flames or anyone else in the Pacific if they had Bennett. Vatanen will go east.

The Ducks would give us Vatanen for Bennett in a heartbeat

[savemedrzaius]

Originally Posted by theslymonkey

It's not anyone else's responsibility to make the connections that you've made in your own head. State them explicitly or expect to be wrong.

Edit: Nylander has technically played two seasons, or at least enough to knock off two years of his ELC.

So Bennett has "technically" played three seasons.

It makes perfect sense to me what Weitz was saying. In their first full NHL season the players both played wing.

Second season Bennett played C and we will see about Nylander. Leafs management has been saying he will stay at wing but will have to see what happens to Bozak. I think ideally the Leafs want it to be me Matthews, Nylander and Kadri as the Top 3 centres.

[EldrickOnIce]

Makes perfect sense to anyone who knows anything about players not on the Flames.
Nylander is perfectly comparable, assuming the Leafs do move him to center this season.
I think the Flames did it the right way with Bennett.
Played wing mostly with Backlund in first full NHL season. Check
Brought in what they thought was a great 2 way winger to help Bennett's transition to center. Check
Only problem was that winger was Brouwer, who drug Bennet under instead of propping him up. It will take a lot for Vegas to erase that blunder. Here is hoping Treliving understands the magnitude of that mistake and pays up accordingly.
Bennett deserved better last season. Can't make him do it again this season.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

You're obviously not interested in discussing anything either. If you were, you would probably try to say what you mean, instead of blaming everybody else for hearing what you actually said.

Nylander and Bennett were drafted as centers. They both played wing in their first NHL year. Hence, Nylander getting the Bennett treatement.

How is this hard to comprehend?

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Nylander and Bennett were drafted as centers. They both played wing in their first NHL year. Hence, Nylander getting the Bennett treatement.

How is this hard to comprehend?

If you had stated the underlined when you started this argument, you wouldn't have had a problem. Surely someone with your vast comprehensive skills understands how significantly this modifies the statement.

Just admit you forgot Bennett played centre this year and gracefully move on.

[GranteedEV]

The biggest hole in "Nylander is getting the Bennett treatment" is this: Nylander spent his Draft+1 and Draft+2 playing huge minutes at center in the AHL. Bennett did not pay center as a professional until the last few months of his Draft+2. And honestly even his junior career at center is a writeoff as Conroy pretty clearly pointed out regarding how he was instructed to deal with certain situations.

Nylander played wing in his Draft+3 despite two years pro experience at center.
Bennett played center in his Draft+3 despite less than a year pro experience at center.

So basically we have no semblance of "Nylander is getting the Bennett treatment". Their development paths have been as opposite as it gets.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

The biggest hole in "Nylander is getting the Bennett treatment" is this: Nylander spent his Draft+1 and Draft+2 playing huge minutes at center in the AHL. Bennett did not pay center as a professional until the last few months of his Draft+2. And honestly even his junior career at center is a writeoff as Conroy pretty clearly pointed out regarding how he was instructed to deal with certain situations.

I don't recall this, can you remind me what was said? Thanks

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Toonage

I don't recall this, can you remind me what was said? Thanks

cross-post from an old STH thread in 2015:

Originally Posted by getbak

Conroy also talked about Bennett. He doesn't think he's ready to be into games quite yet. He said that they sat together at the game on Saturday and Conroy would quiz Sam on what to do in certain situations. One time, he asked what to do if you lose a draw in your own zone, and Sam said he'd attack the defence, but Conroy told him to drop back and cover his man and let the winger take care of the defence. On another play, the Oilers were cycling in the Flames' zone and Conroy asked Sam what he'd do if he was Monahan, and Sam said to swarm the puck carrier. Conroy said "I don't know what they do in Kingston, but in Calgary, we don't swarm."

It's pretty clear even learning Hartley's relatively open system as a winger was a huge learning curve for Bennett out of Junior, compared to Nylander who jumped right in to playing pro systems and philosophies in the AHL, never mind that one guy is the son of a former NHLer and the other... not so much. It doesn't seem Kingston was a great place for Bennett to develop (nor was playing in the NHL so early) whereas Nylander's development path is how you would probably script it out on draft day.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

It's pretty clear even learning Hartley's relatively open system as a winger was a huge learning curve for Bennett out of Junior, compared to Nylander who jumped right in to playing pro systems and philosophies in the AHL, never mind that one guy is the son of a former NHLer and the other... not so much. It doesn't seem Kingston was a great place for Bennett to develop (nor was playing in the NHL so early) whereas Nylander's development path is how you would probably script it out on draft day.

It makes me wonder why the Flames are so insistent on developing Bennett as a centre. He doesn't have great vision distributing the puck, and he didn't come out of junior with especially good defensive acumen either. Letting him play more instinctively as a winger might prove to be the better approach.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

It makes me wonder why the Flames are so insistent on developing Bennett as a centre.

Because as a center his potential is higher than Gaudreau, or Tkachuk, or Monahan, or Backlund. As a winger his potential probably isn't much higher than Ferland. Sucking up some rough development years to develop a #1 center is absolutely the right decision for Bennett. It's not a case of he "can't" play center, it's a case of "he hasn't yet played it enough". You don't get experience by cutting corners.

[Strange Brew]

As a winger, his highest potential is Ferland.

But as a center, his potential is higher than Monahan?

Sorry but I don't follow.

[savemedrzaius]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

As a winger, his highest potential is Ferland.

But as a center, his potential is higher than Monahan?

Sorry but I don't follow.

Players gain more XP when playing centre. Easier to level up down the road.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

It makes me wonder why the Flames are so insistent on developing Bennett as a centre. He doesn't have great vision distributing the puck, and he didn't come out of junior with especially good defensive acumen either. Letting him play more instinctively as a winger might prove to be the better approach.

Because center depth is extremely important and if you draft a center top 5 you expect him to play as a center. It's so important that you see teams like the Blue Jackets spending 3rd overall picks on guys like Pierre-Luc Dubois who they HOPE can convert to a center. Flames didn't rush Mark Jankowski so I don't understand why posters like yourself want to just pull the pin at the age of 20 and convert him to a winger. Fans simply don't have enough patience to see prospect development through and fortunately most organizations are smarter than this.

[savemedrzaius]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Because center depth is extremely important and if you draft a center top 5 you expect him to play as a center. It's so important that you see teams like the Blue Jackets spending 3rd overall picks on guys like Pierre-Luc Dubois who they HOPE can convert to a center. Flames didn't rush Mark Jankowski so I don't understand why posters like yourself want to just pull the pin at the age of 20 and convert him to a winger. Fans simply don't have enough patience to see prospect development through and fortunately most organizations are smarter than this.

I think after a while you have to worry about it destroying a player's confidence. Some players just can't make the jump to NHL centre and are better suited as wingers.

This was only Bennett's first season playing centre so no big deal yet. But what happens if he continues to struggle next season? Do you continue to force it?

[Toonage]

He'll be a fine center for the Ducks.