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Old 05-19-2017, 10:26 AM   #541
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Old 05-19-2017, 04:31 PM   #542
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Boeing Co. on Friday rushed to fix a gamble that looks to have gone wrong, with the defense unit of the U.S. plane maker seeking to fend off a Canadian threat to scrap the purchase of 18 Super Hornet jets, a source familiar with the matter told Reuters.

That move follows Canada’s threat on Thursday that it could ditch its plans to buy the jets if the United States backed Boeing’s claims that Canadian plane maker Bombardier Inc. dumped jetliners in the U.S. market.

Political insiders say the Liberal government of Prime Minister Justin Trudeau is furious about Boeing’s allegations, which comes at a time when trade relations between the United States and Canada are at a low.

“Boeing made the calculation that taking this action was worth the risk,” the source said, requesting anonymity due to the sensitivity of the situation. “However, Boeing military sales division is concerned and is seeking to communicate with Canadian government decision-makers to mitigate the possible impact to their Super Hornet sale.”

Boeing said the firm hoped there would be no impact on the proposed Super Hornet sale but made clear it had no regrets about challenging Bombardier.

“This action is being taken against Bombardier’s pricing practices which are illegal and aggressive. It is a very clear case of dumping,” spokesman Charlie Miller said.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...ticle35057293/
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Old 05-19-2017, 06:02 PM   #543
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cancel the Superhornet purchase, not because of this dispute, but because its stupid.
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Old 05-23-2017, 09:18 AM   #544
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As an addon, the German's have requested a classified briefing on the F35 as part of the requirement for nations that were not part of the development consortium. It looks like the Germans are looking at replacing their Tornado's with the F35.

http://www.defensenews.com/articles/...35-fighter-jet

With the Boeing fiasco ongoing, and the F-35's comeback story its likely that the Liberals are going to have to break their election promise about not buying the F-35.

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/ca...chase-in-limbo
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Old 05-23-2017, 10:29 AM   #545
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Probably exactly what they wanted to begin with.

Because of the Boeing issue they are seen as protecting a Canadian company.
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Old 05-23-2017, 10:36 AM   #546
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Probably exactly what they wanted to begin with.

Because of the Boeing issue they are seen as protecting a Canadian company.
Probably.

Even though it always seem with Bombardier more like brushing fly's off of a corpse then protecting a Canadian Company.
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Old 05-23-2017, 11:06 AM   #547
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At this point I hope they just order an entire fleet of F-35's and be done with it. I was a huge propenent of the Rafale but that ship has sailed and if Canada is going to buy American Lockheed's option is superior. Just no more "interim fleet" talk please.
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Old 05-23-2017, 11:30 AM   #548
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At this point I hope they just order an entire fleet of F-35's and be done with it. I was a huge propenent of the Rafale but that ship has sailed and if Canada is going to buy American Lockheed's option is superior. Just no more "interim fleet" talk please.
Using the India purchase of the Rafale as an example it becomes more expensive then the F-35 at about $244 million per plane. the fly away cost of an airframe is about 70 million US, but because of the maintenance requirements and logistical requirements the price sky rockets, if Canada is looking at 65 planes, the Rafale cost if based on the India purchase would be $15.8 billion for the fleet.

However in terms of the Superhornet. The so called initial price of 2 billion per plane for 18 planes is $111 per plane, however the Feds have been pretty secretive as the costs are expected to be closer to about $6 billion for 18 planes so about $333 million per plane

The F-35 would now be about $16 billion dollars with lowering cost due to the way the costs of parting and global infrastructure would work.
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Old 05-23-2017, 11:50 AM   #549
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From what I recall, the India price sky rocketed due to India's insistance that Dassault build factories, provide the tech and training for planes to be built in India. Dassault initially said no because the planes would be built in India but Dassault would be on the hook for repairs, they couldn't ensure quality control of the planes built there so it was a non-starter. For Canada Dassault simply needed to provide the blue prints and source codes, then they would be built under licence in Canada (Dassault appeared more confident in our abilities as we already manufacture aircraft).

I don't believe we'll be getting 65 F35 for 16 billion, not with exchange anyway.
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Old 05-23-2017, 11:58 AM   #550
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Possibly, but building the infrastructure and assembly lines to build planes is going to cost a small fortune, It would be basically starting from scratch, and likely done by Bombardier and we see how great they are in terms of on time and on budget.

There would also still be the cost of setting up the logistics and spare parts and servicing of the planes.

I think that the 244 million per copy for a limited production run of 65 would be fairly close to the marker. and exchange is kind of relevant except that I converted both of the planes to US Dollars (Rafale and F-35).

To me the idea of us building our own for a run of 65 craft for example makes no sense.

I doubt that the French are going to let us keep building and selling the rafale.
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