Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi - Discussion Thread

[icecube]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

the weird thing is that it wasn't necessary for Tarkin...they could have easily cast someone similar looking and the film wouldn't have missed a beat...

the end scene needed a cgi leia, but it was one line...

not sure why its controversial to some people.... pretty minor in the scheme of things

See how Danny Boyle did the young Renton and friends in Trainspotting 2. That's how you do it.

[photon]

A trailer that doesn't reveal the whole movie, yay!

[Itse]

I worry they're going to go "soft reboot" on the whole trilogy. I'm okay with TFA copying a lot of beats from ANH, but I want the rest to be more of it's own thing.

[FireGilbert]

Unlike a lot of modern teaser trailers which are full trailers this one is definitely a tease. It didn't really show me anything I wasn't expecting but still got me super excited for the film.

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by Itse

I worry they're going to go "soft reboot" on the whole trilogy. I'm okay with TFA copying a lot of beats from ANH, but I want the rest to be more of it's own thing.

Could be misremembering but I'm nearly positive I read that the first movie was done like that on purpose but the last two they plan on going in a different direction so I doubt it will be an Empire clone.

[djsFlames]

Well as long as there isn't an AT-AT led assault on a resistance base, a chase sequence, a jedi training storyline with some force lifting and running around which ends in the trainee needing to go save friends, then some sort of trap set up by the first order where a lead (Finn or Poe) is captured, then we'll be okay.

[Max Cow Disease]

It's going to be weird as hell watching Mark Hamill play Luke Skywalker in a full movie with dialogue and all the rest of it. It was a little like that with Carrie and Harrison in TFA, but it'll be amplified with Luke for some reason. I mean, he's the Jedi in this whole thing, and it's a title he made famous before I was even born. I've watched the originals countless times, and all of these years it's been the same parts, the same young Luke, the same events. Should be neat.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Well as long as there isn't an AT-AT led assault on a resistance base, a chase sequence, a jedi training storyline with some force lifting and running around which ends in the trainee needing to go save friends, then some sort of trap set up by the first order where a lead (Finn or Poe) is captured, then we'll be okay.

Well we do know one thing

Spoiler!

There will be a super star destroyer, that makes the superstar destroyer in Empire look like a normal star destroyer and it serves as the mobile base for Snoke.

[djsFlames]

I just hope Rey isn't suddenly more powerful than Luke 10 minutes in.

I don't even really sympathize with her character much so far. She needs to suffer through more (any) adversity. And don't tell me Han was a huge loss, as she only knew him for mere hours.

Was easier to get behind Luke after the aunt/uncle kabobs, dead mentor and severed arm.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

I just hope Rey isn't suddenly more powerful than Luke 10 minutes in.

I don't even really sympathize with her character much so far. She needs to suffer through more (any) adversity. And don't tell me Han was a huge loss, as she only knew him for mere hours.

Was easier to get behind Luke after the aunt/uncle kabobs, dead mentor and severed arm.

Yeah seeing his harmless looking old man mentor hacking off a guys arm in a bar is pretty traumatic.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

I don't even really sympathize with her character much so far. She needs to suffer through more (any) adversity. And don't tell me Han was a huge loss, as she only knew him for mere hours.

I suppose that whole abandoned upbringing in the desert wasn't much for suffering.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Mazrim

I suppose that whole abandoned upbringing in the desert wasn't much for suffering.

To be fair very little of it is shown in the movie.

(Realistically of course, an attractive young female growing up without parents on what seems to be a community ruled by gangsters is not likely to be a very nice story. Certainly much worse than a young man growing on a farm with adopted parents.)

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Itse

To be fair very little of it is shown in the movie.

(Realistically of course, an attractive young female growing up without parents on what seems to be a community ruled by gangsters is not likely to be a very nice story. Certainly much worse than a young man growing on a farm with adopted parents.)

We don't need much though, do we? And they did a good job with what they showed us.

She's counting the days, she thinks her family is coming back to her, she barely gets enough empire scraps trade for food, she helps protect those who need it, she's loyal, she's tough and doesn't want/need help etc.

Each one is something we saw in the movie and helps us piece together her background without having to actually see her upbringing.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

We don't need much though, do we? And hey did a good job with what they showed us.

She's counting the days, she thinks her family is coming back to her, she barely gets enough empire scraps trade for food, she helps protect those who need it, she's loyal, she's tough and doesn't want/need help etc.

Each one is something we saw in the movie and helps us piece together her background without having to actually see her upbringing.

While this is also how I see it, I get that it's not the same as seeing it.

Of course personally I'm not that into suffering heroes anyway.

[Inglewood Jack]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

We don't need much though, do we? And hey did a good job with what they showed us.

She's counting the days, she thinks her family is coming back to her, she barely gets enough empire scraps trade for food, she helps protect those who need it, she's loyal, she's tough and doesn't want/need help etc.

Each one is something we saw in the movie and helps us piece together her background without having to actually see her upbringing.

among other things, this is the one biggest reason why I'm in the minority that likes TFA more than R1. I feel like I know who Rey is and how she'll react to various situations just based on the short time spent on Jakku.

on the other hand I can barely remember a damn thing notable about Jyn, her Mexi friend or the rest of R1 team except for the snarky robot.

[djsFlames]

You can't have a good story without a conflict/struggle, though.

It's just a law of storytelling. Rey has picked up everything so fast and handed Kylo's rear end to him despite having no lightsaber battle experience. Wasn't much of a struggle, which is part of why the ending of 7 felt so underwhelming. The base stuff too. Poe just flew in and made it look like leisurely practice shooting. Went relatively unchallenged. Just felt too easy.

Luke had to watch his aunt/uncle die, mentor/guardian get it from Vader and loses his hand, is forced to face the ####y truth that he's the offspring of a man who represents everything he hates, and has his friend kidnapped. Also everyone tells him throughout that he is no Jedi, is not ready and cannot beat Vader. Makes for a more satisfying end to the trilogy when he redeems himself.

In order for this new trilogy to elevate its story, Rey needs to take some lumps the same way Luke did.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

You can't have a good story without a conflict/struggle, though.

It's just a law of storytelling. Rey has picked up everything so fast and handed Kylo's rear end to him despite having no lightsaber battle experience. Wasn't much of a struggle, which is part of why the ending of 7 felt so underwhelming. The base stuff too. Poe just flew in and made it look like leisurely practice shooting. Went relatively unchallenged. Just felt too easy.

Luke had to watch his aunt/uncle die, mentor/guardian get it from Vader and loses his hand, is forced to face the ####y truth that he's the offspring of a man who represents everything he hates, and has his friend kidnapped. Also everyone tells him throughout that he is no Jedi, is not ready and cannot beat Vader. Makes for a more satisfying end to the trilogy when he redeems himself.

In order for this new trilogy to elevate its story, Rey needs to take some lumps the same way Luke did.

But your comparing three movies of Luke set backs to one of Rey.


If you look at the first movies of both franchises

Rey is abandoned by her parents and is basically a slave and treated like garbage. Even the only person that was around for her, the junk dealer backstabs her and sends his men to steal her new friend in BB-8.

Luke's Aunt and Uncle are killed by the Empire.

Rey finds a father figure in Han Solo who treats her with kindness and even looks out for her and offers her a job. Then he has his kidney's removed and falls to his death in front of her.

Luke's father figure takes him to the bar and then chops a guys hand off to save Luke. Later he gets into a sword fight and in front of Luke sacrifices himself and vanishes, but we find out later in that same movie that he's not really dead and helps Luke shoot up the Death Star.

Luke kisses his sister and doesn't know.

Luke's best friend growing up Biggs is blown into Atoms by Vader, Luke doesn't even mourn him probably because Biggs never took him to Toche Station (If you watched the unreleased clips of ANH)

Rey witnesses her best friend get cut open like a cheap can of tuna in front of her and remains in a coma at the end of the movie.

Now the whole rewarded without effort thing.

Rey channels the forces and fights Kylo Ren, and beats him. Its clear that she's incredibly powerful but untrained in the force and uses her instincts.


Luke flying an unfamiliar high performance fighter having previously flown a lightly armed T-16 back home with a slightly psychotic hobby of shooting whomp rats who don't fire back, channels the force and shots a high yield torpedo into a 8 foot hole while flying at maximum velocity without using any kind of aiming device. His only help is Obi-Wan mumbling things like use the force and let go.

Further setback, Rey flys across the galaxy to meet up with the galaxy's greatest hero and most powerful jedi knight. When she finally meets him he looks like he just came back from dumpster diving for empty blue milk bottles.

Meanwhile Luke gets a medal from a hot princess while hanging out with his two best friends neither of whom basically had their spine removed.

[fanman]

I understand people thinking the ending lightsaber battle was a little suspect, but Kylo was exactly operating at 100% either.

He'd just killed his father while staring him in the eyes, took a shot to the gut from Chewie's bowcaster (which is notoriously powerful), then chased them down through a forest while bleeding heavily. Anyone who has lost that much blood isn't going to be able to maintain their stamina, force or not.

I think Rey took enough lumps, basically everyday from the junkyard crew on Jakku. Left behind by her family on a pretty desolate and sh**** planet for reasons unknown to her. And as CaptainCrunch said, the only people she's ever considered friends in her life who she just met basically, were brutally cut down in front of her. I'd consider that tough times. I'm pretty sure she's not gonna have a smooth ride either in Episode 8, as the middle movie is always a downer.

Totally agree with the Poe part though. I thought he was a bit over the top with his piloting skills. They could have toned his flying performance down a bit and still showed that he's the top gun in the resistance. More along the lines of Wedge in the originals would have been fine.

[CaptainCrunch]

Also if I go by my own theory that Snoke is a bit of a fraudster, I tend to think that Ren isn't that well trained and certainly hasn't had the benefit of really going sword to sword with well trained Jedi Knights.

He's powerful but rough.

[Inglewood Jack]

given what we know about strong force sensitives, I didn't find anything about Rey's duel to be a stretch. we already knows she has melee weapon skills from fending off junkyard a-holes. Kylo by that point was already stumbling around from the bowcaster shot and battle with Finn.

and it's not like Rey was flipping all over the place like some coked up Yoda. both of them were more or less whaling away at each other, and she still almost lost until refocusing and hitting level 2 force awareness. taking down a heavily injured and tired Sith apprentice still isn't as impressive as single handedly blowing up the Death Star while being chased by your dad who is the greatest pilot in the galaxy.