Notes: Ken King (Iginla, New Building)

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by JayP

So you're basically saying that Ken King was offered the GM job and turned it down? Or that when it was available before Feaster was promoted if he King told Edwards he wanted to be GM he would've got the job over Feaster?

Just want to confirm because, if true, the Flames are in worse shape than we all think.

What I was trying to say was if he, as President, wanted the GM job, he, as President, would have taken it, but he, as President, does not want it, as it is not what he knows how to do, and ownership knows that was never an option or issue with or for him, so was never concerned...

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

The way I read it was that the Flames would never offer King the job, nor would King ever want or ask for it.

Thanks Jiri. Precisely.

[JayP]

EDIT: Clarified.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Rocky Raccoon

Based on some of the posts you make, my assumption is that you know him personally.

If so, would you be so kind as to tell us something we don't know, or at least something the majority of us are missing the boat on?

I hope this has been answered by both Jiri and by me. Let me know if not.
Happy to chat offline, too.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by BEANZ

KK is a business man and apparently a decent one. He is far from GM material and him taking that role would make him and this team the laughing stock of the NHL!

Actually I think a businessman who acts like a businessman is exactly the type of GM I'd like the Flames to have (more accurately I'd like an economist). Unfortunately I think Ken King, if he were to make himself GM, would probably surround himself with "hockey guys" and listen to them to much.

[EddyBeers]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Agree, at this point we are no better or no worse with Iginla on or off the team.

Who cares about this point the question should be "Will trading Iginla make us better in 5 years". At this point the Flames are not a playoff team and will not be a playoff team this year. They will not be a playoff team next year. Management should be asking themselves "How can we become a playoff team again and what is the quickest and most efficient way to accomplish that goal". Trading Iginla (amongst others) is the answer to that riddle.

[killer_carlson]

I dont agree that trading Iginla is the answer to the team's problems.

I think it might have been 4 years ago, but it isnt today.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

I dont agree that trading Iginla is the answer to the team's problems.

I think it might have been 4 years ago, but it isnt today.

No one says it's the answer, but it's part of the solution.

Iggy is more use to us bringing in something(s) that can help us in the future, than he would be in Flames uniform now and later years.

[killer_carlson]

The post directly above mine says it is the answer.

This team is in a better position to develop talent and attract or retain talent with Iginla around than if he is not, in my opinion.

Moving the big name talent of Iginla on this team will put us in the same position we were in during the years after we moved Fleury - an afterthought market.

[Barnes]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

The new arena is going to be the most transformative thing to hit Calgary in 40 years, even more transformative than light rail transit don't ya know.

"We have had several architectural looks created for our new building, we have been in contact with several major architectural and construction firms in Calgary," says Ken King, the president of the hockey club.

King also says they are considering a second location but he won't divulge many details. "We think this should be an urban building, we think it should be downtown, most of our fans feel the same way."

http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/new-flames...#ixzz2LYkF3CHi

-September, 2009

It's pretty obvious (I hope) that the plans have changed drastically. A report was commissioned back in 2007 to be completed in 2008 that essentially narrowed down two possible locations. I think that the original idea was to go where the Big Four currently sits. It's clear that the Stampede Trail extension and Big Four replacement won't be happening any time soon so the Flames looked at the area north of Stampede Park as well as Fire Park.

Now that they have purchased the Stampeders, I think anything done prior to the purchase has been thrown out as they are now looking at four sites rather than just the two.

If this is truly to be a development more for Calgary than just a new arena talk about it or don't say anything at all until there is something. We've heard the same thing since 2007. If the Calgary Flames arena plans were a person, that person would be in Grade 1.

After all this time, this ends up Stampitecture arena with a Toby Keith's I Love this Bar and Grill attached, I swear to god...

[EddyBeers]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

The post directly above mine says it is the answer.

This team is in a better position to develop talent and attract or retain talent with Iginla around than if he is not, in my opinion.

Moving the big name talent of Iginla on this team will put us in the same position we were in during the years after we moved Fleury - an afterthought market.

Not in a cap world. In a cap world where you are going into an offseason where there are a lot of teams with serious cap problems, moving out 23 million in cap space, buying your team an additional 15.5 million or so in cap space, making it so you are on of the few teams with copious amounts of cap space (roughly 30 million to sign 10 players) makes you an automatic player in the free agent market.

As a comparable, right now http://capgeek.com/payrolls/?charts_year=2013
virtually every team with large amounts of cap space to use next year are not cap teams, they are unlikely to be spending that money anyway. The Flames could go and get some quality UFA's in the offseason, or they could pick up some quality players from teams in cap trouble. It is a different world than in the Fleury era.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

Who cares about this point the question should be "Will trading Iginla make us better in 5 years".

But the answer to that question is "probably not".

I don't know what you think the trade value of a goalslumping twilight years Iginla with no years left on his contract is but I'm pretty sure that in terms of future assets it's probably a coin toss to make the NHL as depth player and a lottery ticket to make it as an impact player.

That's not to say that I wouldn't trade him anyways. After all a coin flip for something and a lottery ticket for impact are better then nothing so if Iginla is either unwilling to resign before the trade deadline (indicating that he wants out) or is amiable to resigning as a free agent this summer (and the Flames are realistically out of it by the trade deadline) I'd trade him. But I'd keep him in all other instances, since I preceive his present and near present value to exceed his return as a portable asset.

[killer_carlson]

I think it comes down to three things:

1) most important, what is Iginla's cap hit in the new contract
2) how much value, if any, does a fan put on Iginla's lead by example style and what effect that will have on young players we look to introduce ( i put a lot of value on this, personally)
3) whether fans believe iginla can contribute like Selanne or Alfredsson, or whether they think he will fade away.

I want to keep Iginla but think most of the other parts can be moved.

[Bane]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

I think it comes down to three things:

1) most important, what is Iginla's cap hit in the new contract
2) how much value, if any, does a fan put on Iginla's lead by example style and what effect that will have on young players we look to introduce ( i put a lot of value on this, personally)
3) whether fans believe iginla can contribute like Selanne or Alfredsson, or whether they think he will fade away.

I want to keep Iginla but think most of the other parts can be moved.

I see this (bolded) as a big negative. Iginla has undermined every coach since Darryl. His slow starts have always been a result of him not buying into the coach's system. He fights it and fights it, and then once he relents and buys in he finally takes off.

And his influence on guys like Tanguay, Cammy, Bourque, and other top 6 forwards we have had only made the situation worse. That's where the whole "country club" atmosphere came from.

Once Iggy is gone, the team will be way more balanced. Tanguay and Cammy can focus on the team game rather than just trying to pass to Iginla.

Time for Iggy to go.

[Ace]

^i'd be curious to see what cap hit people would switch from keeping iginla to trading him. (certainly there are people that want him gone just to change the culture however)

5.0 million too high?, I think at 3.5 million for 3 years, you'd get a lot of people on board with keeping him. At 2.0 million probably most would agree that he is a keeper.

Does a hometown discount exist?

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Ace

^i'd be curious to see what cap hit people would switch from keeping iginla to trading him. (certainly there are people that want him gone just to change the culture however)

5.0 million too high?, I think at 3.5 million for 3 years, you'd get a lot of people on board with keeping him. At 2.0 million probably most would agree that he is a keeper.

Does a hometown discount exist?

I'd probably keep Iginla around under 3 million.

Under 3, though.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Ace

^i'd be curious to see what cap hit people would switch from keeping iginla to trading him. (certainly there are people that want him gone just to change the culture however)

5.0 million too high?, I think at 3.5 million for 3 years, you'd get a lot of people on board with keeping him. At 2.0 million probably most would agree that he is a keeper.

Does a hometown discount exist?

The main reason I want Iginla gone is for the culture change. As long as he remains a Flame things won't as far as the teams identity of being inconsistent and hard to coach. I'm at the point where I don't care if he leaves as a free agent and the Flames get zero return for him. He's too interwined into the way this team plays and now that he's no longer a difference maker it's becoming counterproductive for this team to have him as captain and top player.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by Ace

^i'd be curious to see what cap hit people would switch from keeping iginla to trading him. (certainly there are people that want him gone just to change the culture however).

What about term? He'll be a +35 contract (or that get axed in the CBA?) so extra years means extra risk means less dollars.

Off-hand I'd say no more then 4.5 per. Second line money + a bit extra for icon status in the general pop (ticket sales) and the extra responsibilities he takes on as captain. That sounds about right for what he provides on the ice.

[killer_carlson]

Well sleanne and alfredsson are in the 4.5 to 5 range, which i think is fair.

Doan is over 5, which i think is high.

3 million,you are dreaming.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

The main reason I want Iginla gone is for the culture change. As long as he remains a Flame things won't as far as the teams identity of being inconsistent and hard to coach. I'm at the point where I don't care if he leaves as a free agent and the Flames get zero return for him. He's too interwined into the way this team plays and now that he's no longer a difference maker it's becoming counterproductive for this team to have him as captain and top player.

The problem is, he still is arguably the top player. In order to make Iginla dispensible as a player and a leader, someone else has to step up. Who on the team is ready to do that? Somebody should have been able to do that even with Iginla on the team. He was still our leading producer last season.

With or without Iginla the franchise needs a younger leadership group to emerge, and as of now I have no idea who that would be.

So sure, we get rid of Iginla. Be prepared to see an even more leaderless team step on the ice for a few seasons.