Westeros is pretty full of terrible people...I think I might be #TeamWhiteWalkers if it means they wipe out the Boltons, Freys, Lannisters, Greyjoys and the dozen other morally unsalvageable houses in the realm.
With the North, at some point the White Walkers will break through. At some point the North will be claimed from the Boltons.
I'm not sure what will happen first. A scene with Ramsay's relatively strong army against the White Walkers could work. John Snow then returns to Winterfell to find a dying Ramsay. That would deny Sansa her revenge though. So instead, you could have the armies of the North unite and reclaim Winterfell then retreat as the White Walkers advance.
Another issue is that we still don't know the White Walkers motivations. They could be good guys and have no intent of taking all of Westeros. Maybe they're trying to stop something even worse.
In the trailers they keep showing a shot of what looks like Tormund and the wildling army surrounded by Bolton men... but you can clearly see house Mormont banners along with others that can't be deciphered among the 'wildling' army. Something tells me they wouldn't unite for Tormund, so someone is there with them. Rickon, Bran, Sansa, a risen John Snow.. somebody is there to unite the north. Maybe they don't do a great job of it cause it looks like that army is about to lose, but that is probably what they want us to think.
__________________ "In brightest day, in blackest night / No evil shall escape my sight / Let those who worship evil's might / Beware my power, Green Lantern's light!"
Yeah, I don't think an army that shows up, slaughters wildlings, and then does that whole dramatic raising the dead to join our undead army while ominously staring at what's left of the wildlings and Knights Watch is very likely to have good intentions.
They're pretty clearly the bad guys.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger
The white walkers being the good guys might be more hilarious than Capn's Star Wars theory about the Empire being the heroes.
Unlike Star Wars, the "good guys" in GoT are all pretty awful. The only truly good guys are lone wolf types like John Snow and Daenarys and then children like Rickon. The rest are a pretty awful bunch. That's a pretty big contrast to the Empire/Rebel dynamic.
Also, before the first men arrived, Westeros seemed like a pretty great place. The humans basically cut the forests down, decimated the pre-existing populations of sentient beings (children of the forest and giants) and turned the island into a giant battlefield.
Like I said before, we really know nothing about the white walkers. Their advancement could be in the best interest of Westeros or even the remaining people who live there. They clearly are extremely intelligent and we've yet to even here them communicate (other than that grin as they raised their army of the dead, which I'll admit seems not so good on its face).
Basically, what I'm trying to say is that we know a lot about the empire and their motivations, but absolutely nothing about the white walkers other than that they are scary monsters.
The characters upon which the story focuses being a bunch of dbags does not make the white walkers any less evil.
I think you're confusing the characters that we see as part of the story and humanity as a whole in Westeros. Just because we don't see a ton of nice family people with morals and ethics, doesn't mean they don't exist. They just aren't interesting enough to write about.
The white walkers are objectively evil. Most of the main characters that the story focuses upon are shades of grey. The latter does not affect the former.
The characters upon which the story focuses being a bunch of dbags does not make the white walkers any less evil.
I think you're confusing the characters that we see as part of the story and humanity as a whole in Westeros. Just because we don't see a ton of nice family people with morals and ethics, doesn't mean they don't exist. They just aren't interesting enough to write about.
The white walkers are objectively evil. Most of the main characters that the story focuses upon are shades of grey. The latter does not affect the former.
Ya I am a book guy, but this is clearly seen in the show:
Spoiler!
GRR is anti war, as shown by all the suffering during the wars in the show and hates following the meta (i.e. hero doesn't make it, etc). Doubt this turns into an epic White Walker vs Human final battle which is considered just, like the typical final fantasy battles.
Well I think it is pretty obvious we aren't going to have a LOTR type ending where all the bad guys line up and the various people of westeros, who were previously enemies, will all band together and hug it out then defeat the bad guys.
But that doesn't mean that it isn't clear that the white walkers are the bad guys.
The one thing I have always liked about GoT is how different all of the characters are. So many shows we see everyone just acts the same, this show is driven by all of the different personas interacting with each other and that is what makes it great.
They follow the old school D&D style of alignment and it works out great. But you can also see characters slipping in and out of each category depending on your opinion or their actions from episode to episode. Jamie started out as Chaotic Evil to many I am sure for throwing a 8 year old boy out of a window, but since then what would you call him?
__________________ "In brightest day, in blackest night / No evil shall escape my sight / Let those who worship evil's might / Beware my power, Green Lantern's light!"
The characters upon which the story focuses being a bunch of dbags does not make the white walkers any less evil.
I think you're confusing the characters that we see as part of the story and humanity as a whole in Westeros. Just because we don't see a ton of nice family people with morals and ethics, doesn't mean they don't exist. They just aren't interesting enough to write about.
The white walkers are objectively evil. Most of the main characters that the story focuses upon are shades of grey. The latter does not affect the former.
My bigger point is just that we don't know anything about the white walkers yet. This is also a world that blurs the line between good and evil (sort of like the real world). I just find it hard to take in that Martin would put so much effort into creating nuanced characters and then just also create a purely one-dimensional force of evil.
We'll see some big reveals about the White Walkers and it'll surprise people.
In the trailers they keep showing a shot of what looks like Tormund and the wildling army surrounded by Bolton men... but you can clearly see house Mormont banners along with others that can't be deciphered among the 'wildling' army. Something tells me they wouldn't unite for Tormund, so someone is there with them. Rickon, Bran, Sansa, a risen John Snow.. somebody is there to unite the north. Maybe they don't do a great job of it cause it looks like that army is about to lose, but that is probably what they want us to think.
The Mormonts are pretty linked in with the Night's Watch and by extension the wildlings. That might not be a full on unification of the North.
I think that is a pretty far reach. Any link between the Nights Watch and the Wildlings died with John Snow. It was the reason he was killed. Northern houses that have spent years dealing with raids from the Wildlings are not just going to ally with them on their own. There needs to be a reason for it, to me that reason has to be John Snow... or perhaps one of his siblings that Tormund agrees to fight WITH, not FOR, they will never bend the Knee remember., out of respect for John.
__________________ "In brightest day, in blackest night / No evil shall escape my sight / Let those who worship evil's might / Beware my power, Green Lantern's light!"
They follow the old school D&D style of alignment and it works out great. But you can also see characters slipping in and out of each category depending on your opinion or their actions from episode to episode. Jamie started out as Chaotic Evil to many I am sure for throwing a 8 year old boy out of a window, but since then what would you call him?
One-handed.
Last edited by Finger Cookin; 04-22-2016 at 01:14 PM.
I think that is a pretty far reach. Any link between the Nights Watch and the Wildlings died with John Snow. It was the reason he was killed. Northern houses that have spent years dealing with raids from the Wildlings are not just going to ally with them on their own. There needs to be a reason for it, to me that reason has to be John Snow... or perhaps one of his siblings that Tormund agrees to fight WITH, not FOR, they will never bend the Knee remember., out of respect for John.
Sorry, maybe I should explain that better. The Wildlings had links with the Night's Watch when Jon Snow and Mormont were both influential in the Night's Watch. It would make sense that the Wildings, now on the south side of the wall, would ally themselves with John Snow (if he comes back) or the Mormonts, as Jeor was a strong proponent of John's camp, who was responsible for bringing the Wildings in.
My point is that a Wildling/Mormont alliance does not mean that the North has become united. It's not as big of a spoiler as you are making it out to be.
Ok I'll take it a step further then.. everything discussed in the bottom spoiler tag has been deduced from the trailers, but if you want to avoid what the internet has figured out from said trailers then don't click it. The spoiler includes picture stills captured from the trailers.
Spoiler!
In this picture you can see the House Mormont crest over Ser Davos (our) right shoulder and notice the chandler over his (our) left:
Now look at this picture of Lady Sansa:
Recognize anything?
The North Remembers!
__________________ "In brightest day, in blackest night / No evil shall escape my sight / Let those who worship evil's might / Beware my power, Green Lantern's light!"
Last edited by GreenLantern; 04-22-2016 at 02:40 PM.
Ok I'll take it a step further then.. everything discussed in the bottom spoiler tag has been deduced from the trailers, but if you want to avoid what the internet has figured out from said trailers then don't click it. The spoiler includes picture stills captured from the trailers.
Spoiler!
In this picture you can see the House Mormont crest over Ser Davos (our) right shoulder and notice the chandler over his (our) left:
Now look at this picture of Lady Sansa:
Recognize anything?
The North Remembers!
My issue is with the order in which events happen. IE Does the North unite first, if at all, to destroy the Boltons before the white walkers cross the wall.
“We are writing the final act now,” David Benioff and D.B. Weiss tell the Hollywood Reporter in a new interview today. The showrunners address the recent talk about the show’s future, and estimate that the series will run for “10-15 more hours beyond season six.”
Quote:
Benioff and Weiss explain, “We’re approaching the finish line. From the outset, our hope was to tell a complete story — beginning, middle and end. We are writing the final act now, and the last thing we want to do is stay on stage after the play is over.”
Not going to post the link as Watchers on the Wall always have a lot of speculation/rumours in their articles and most people are probably trying to steer clear of that. But you can find the full article on their site if you wish.
__________________ "In brightest day, in blackest night / No evil shall escape my sight / Let those who worship evil's might / Beware my power, Green Lantern's light!"
So my wife and I were re-watching some episodes to get back up to speed on where everyone and everything is and we watched the last episode of Season 4 where the creepy old codger in the cave says to Bran:
"You'll never walk again, but you will Fly!"
Now, up to that point it was always three-eyed ravens and crows and owls and all that lame crap, but watching that knowing what we know at the end of season 5 what about Dragons?
Maybe Dany comes to Westeros and Bran just straight up brainjacks her Dragons....
I could envision Hodor riding a dragon into battle!
__________________ The Beatings Shall Continue Until Morale Improves!
This Post Has Been Distilled for the Eradication of Seemingly Incurable Sadness.
If you are flammable and have legs, you are never blocking a Fire Exit. - Mitch Hedberg
