Ongoing Calgarians complaining about pedestrian bridges thread

[nik-]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

I guarantee many more cars would pass over and under an overpass than people would walk that bridge on a daily basis. Especially over the deerfoot or another highway where the majority of overpasses are constructed.

I'd be curious to know where you're getting the usage numbers to "guarantee" something like this. Because I just looked and I can't find them.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by Table 5

What? How can you say that something that is in downtown (a place where most Calgarians visit frequently) will be used less then something that is used by some community in the deep south that, at best, only 5-10% of the city ever visits?

How many citizens/visitors are in Prince's Island Park every day? How many people ride to work downtown and can use this bridge to do so? This could be the world's ugliest bridge, and in the end it would still be used by more people than the most spectacular bridge in the deep south. There are valid arguments against this bridge, but yours is not one of them.

The valid arguement is simply against the added expense of hiring Calatrava over local or more cost-effective options. My opinion now is that since the bridge has already been designed we might as well finish it as a good chunk of the frivolous expenditure has already been spent. Then it can stand as an example of either:

A) How improving the design quality of architecture can capture the imagination of Calgarians and push future projects to be more creative and thus improve the look and feel of Calgary and its residents.

OR

B) A colossal ugly waste of money that reminds Calgarians everyday as they drive, walk, or take the C-Train to work downtown of what happens when you elect people into municipal government who are both out of touch with the people of the city and can't work with numbers.

My bet is that the ultimate answer is that this project's legacy will be both A and B depending on where you're coming from.

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by nik-

I'd be curious to know where you're getting the usage numbers to "guarantee" something like this. Because I just looked and I can't find them.

Since we're arguing common sense knowledge I'm not going to spend all day finding statistics for the edge of the city. But heres some for Glenmore and Deerfoot. http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/glengp.htm

130,000 vehicles use that overpass everyday. Using an average of 1.2 people per car. Thats 155,000 people a day.

[Bobblehead]

I'm actually more put out by the city building their own health club. At least this has some public utility; the health club in city hall is nothing more than a perk.

If this perk actually convinces better candidates to run in the next election then it will be worth it, but I cannot see this being a huge incentive.

I've softened my stance against the bridge, but I still think the optics are horrible.

[Nufy]

It will still be over budget by the time its finished....

[nik-]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Since we're arguing common sense knowledge I'm not going to spend all day finding statistics for the edge of the city. But heres some for Glenmore and Deerfoot. http://www.transportation.alberta.ca/glengp.htm

130,000 vehicles use that overpass everyday. Using an average of 1.2 people per car. Thats 155,000 people a day.

Glenmore and Deerfoot is not the type of interchange that was being referred to. But, I guess since it's common sense knowledge and all ...

Thanks for being a dick though, since I was just asking where to find this information.

[nik-]

double post

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by Table 5

What? How can you say that something that is in downtown (a place where most Calgarians visit frequently) will be used less then something that is used by some community in the deep south that, at best, only 5-10% of the city ever visits?

Where do you get your numbers to back up your generalizations?

Speaking of my family in particular, we've been in both the far north (where the Deerfoot / Stoney overpass will be) and far south many more times in the last 5 years than we've been downtown... especially walking downtown, and that's happened even more than walking across the river. We haven't been to Prince's Island, we haven't been to TD Square, etc. We just have no reason to go there.

Stoney trail (north) is going to tremendously help traffic in the middle of the city. It's going to divert traffic from McKnight/John Laurie, and probably from 16th too. The impact of the road will be felt all over the city. The same cannot be said for that one pedestrian bridge.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by calculoso

The impact of the road will be felt all over the city. The same cannot be said for that one pedestrian bridge.

perhaps why the road construction costs billions and the bridge is 22 million?

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by calculoso

Where do you get your numbers to back up your generalizations?

Speaking of my family in particular, we've been in both the far north (where the Deerfoot / Stoney overpass will be) and far south many more times in the last 5 years than we've been downtown... especially walking downtown, and that's happened even more than walking across the river. We haven't been to Prince's Island, we haven't been to TD Square, etc. We just have no reason to go there.

Stoney trail (north) is going to tremendously help traffic in the middle of the city. It's going to divert traffic from McKnight/John Laurie, and probably from 16th too. The impact of the road will be felt all over the city. The same cannot be said for that one pedestrian bridge.

Stoney Trail north also costs nearly 100 times as much. Some comparison.

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by nik-

Glenmore and Deerfoot is not the type of interchange that was being referred to. But, I guess since it's common sense knowledge and all ...

Thanks for being a dick though, since I was just asking where to find this information.

I apologize for being a dink.

I can understand where fotze's coming from, I just think you folks also reaped the benefits of rising housing prices during the boom more than suburbanites. Also most major infrastucture projects are paid in majority by the province.

[Jedi Ninja]

The residents of Hillhurst-Sunnyside believe that everyone should live in the Inner City. Just so long as they don't try moving to Hillhurst or Sunnyside.

I'm all for this bridge if they agree to put up a dozen or so highrises on the North End of it.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Also most major infrastucture projects are paid in majority by the province.

This pedestrian bridge is also being paid for by the province. Every penny for its construction is coming out of a fund that the province gave to the city to build infrastructure.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

Stoney Trail north also costs nearly 100 times as much. Some comparison.

Wasn't my comparison... but slam me for it anyway.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

This pedestrian bridge is also being paid for by the province. Every penny for its construction is coming out of a fund that the province gave to the city to build infrastructure.

Gee.. so it comes out of my "Provincial Tax" pocket instead of the "City Tax pocket"?

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by calculoso

Wasn't my comparison... but slam me for it anyway.

Not slamming you, just slamming the comparison.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by Jedi Ninja

The residents of Hillhurst-Sunnyside believe that everyone should live in the Inner City. Just so long as they don't try moving to Hillhurst or Sunnyside.

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Status quo for them; death to the rest! Oh, except for the houses they rent out. Those are awesome no matter where.

I'm all for this bridge if they agree to put up a dozen or so highrises on the North End of it.

No, see, a bunch of houses near "the core" is okay. Everywhere else it's bad.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by calculoso

Gee.. so it comes out of my "Provincial Tax" pocket instead of the "City Tax pocket"?

Sure, but if you'd rather have that the province didn't give that money to the city... We wouldn't have this pedestrian bridge, the West LRT, plus a whole bunch of other road interchanges.

[Pastiche]

Automobile infrastructure dwarfs any inner city pedestrian or cycling friendly infrastructure by an entire order of magnitude.

As such is sadly the case, the entitlement to infrastructure that allows one to live 45 kms from the city is all-too-often considered a right by suburban dwellers. I would much rather the entire cost of their habitation decisions was theirs to bear. That means toll highways, paying for the marginal cost of sewage and power lines instead of average cost pricing that hurts inner city dwellers disproportionately.

Infuriating sense of entitlement. rant...

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by Pastiche

Automobile infrastructure dwarfs any inner city pedestrian or cycling friendly infrastructure by an entire order of magnitude.

As such is sadly the case, the entitlement to infrastructure that allows one to live 45 kms from the city is all-too-often considered a right by suburban dwellers. I would much rather the entire cost of their habitation decisions was theirs to bear. That means toll highways, paying for the marginal cost of sewage and power lines instead of average cost pricing that hurts inner city dwellers disproportionately.

Infuriating sense of entitlement. rant...

Spoken like a true inner-city resident.