New Poll on Arena issue

[JiriHrdina]

"If the Flames threatened to move the team out of Calgary, how much public funding would you support the City and Province putting towards a new arena?"

[JiriHrdina]

Thought this was a good approach to the question. Let's keep the broader discussion in the other thread.

[DJones]

Zero direct funding. But land, a loan, and infrastructure are on the table.

Think they had the right idea with the Next funding, they were just foolish to think that the government would pay for the soil clean up immediately.

[ignite09]

If they threaten too leave? Don't let the door hit you on the way out. If they act professional like I fully expect, and both sides remember they're all grown adults? Then $50 million is fair. Though didn't the Flames want to get a loan through the city for the ticket tax portion? I'd support that as well.

[Monahan For Mayor]

All the moneyz. I don't live there so I'm biased haha.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by DJones

Zero direct funding. But land, a loan, and infrastructure are on the table.

Pretty much same. Cap at about $100M if all that including a bit of direct funding.

The bulk of government funding that benefits CSEC should be the fieldhouse/McMahon renovation.

[Moneyhands23]

Like I have stated in other threads. No way the league lets them move. To much money flows in to the revenue sharing from Calgary to allow a move.

That being said 200 million in public funds would be ok with me.

But I do live in Victoria so its not really an amount that effects me directly.

[SOMBRI2]

Without knowing any context behind the scene, I think it would be beneficial for the city and csec to have a candid chat...whether it is mediated or lead by another coucillor. From the news I have gathered so far, it seems the expectations were never met even in principles.

Why csec didn't come up with something grassroot and suggest future usage would benefit general Calgarians rather than sport council members.

Why didn't the city layout a clearer pathway to hint how we can make it work.

It has been a bitching game and I am not a fan of either side.

If the team threatens to leave, I will be disappointed. So much so for Burke saying "giving back to the community is integral". Is the team losing big time money or the team doesn't make enough profit? Give me a break.

On record, I like to have new arena. The question is "how".

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[DJones]

Originally Posted by Joborule

Pretty much same. Cap at about $100M if all that including a bit of direct funding.

The bulk of government funding that benefits CSEC should be the fieldhouse/McMahon renovation.

Ya I was just referring to the Arena. The Fieldhouse if the public get's good use of it for amateur sports is completely different.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Thought this was a good approach to the question. Let's keep the broader discussion in the other thread.

What is the budget for the new arena?

[Kjesse]

This is a better question. I'd say about 20-25% should come from the public, matched by the team, balance from a ticket tax/increased prices.

[kevman]

If they blackmailed the citizens of Calgary!? Not a penny.

I'm generally opposed to public money being spent on arenas but if a well thought out argument was presented I would listen. If their tactic was threatening to move I'd be more than happy to show them the door. This pro sports garbage of demanding a new stadium or moving the team has to stop.

[CaptainCrunch]

I voted for an area of the 50 million but its dependant

I think the city can come up with the land and design the transit around it and then provide direct money that can be paid back to the city through a ticket tax.

Frankly sitting there and saying we should give them nothing if there is a threat to move is a fools game.

Beyond that we need new facilities, the Dome is pretty much on the bottom rung now as an NHL building and at some point there needs to be a new building.

The Flames have been a very good citizen to this city. How much money has this team provided through its charitable ventures for example. How much has the city benefited over the years for example in terms of taxes and transit revenues and employment?

As much as we say that the NHL won't let the Flames leave Calgary because of revenue streams, the building here will become a contentious issue because its at the end of being able to create new revenue streams.

As well, the Flames have to look at the deals that other cities and provinces gave for new rinks and feel like there has to be something there for their team. We know there's no deal like that on the table, but the city is going to have to act like a good partner, and the Flames like a good corporate partner and figure this out.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

What is the budget for the new arena?

I would expect that any facility is going to be in the $400 to 500 million dollar range. But the longer we delay, the more expensive it becomes.

[troutman]

How Rogers Place in Edmonton was funded:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rogers_Place

The arena building was initially estimated to cost $450 million. The City of Edmonton was to pay $125 million, the Katz Group of Companies was to contribute $100 million, and $125 million was to come from a user-paid facility fee.[12] The remaining money was expected to come from the province or federal agencies.[13] Estimated cost then increased substantially during continued discussions to a current estimated price of $480 million for the arena, and $604.5 million for the entire project.[14]

On October 26, 2011, the Edmonton City Council approved a funding framework for the arena by a vote of 10 to 3.[15] However a year later, with costs escalating and the Katz Group making increasing demands, the city passed a motion to end negotiations with the Katz Group and to seek out a new deal or find other options but would still be open to communicating with Daryl Katz for future talks.[16][17]

On May 15, 2013, the Edmonton City Council passed a deal that saw the City of Edmonton, and Oilers owner Daryl Katz each put in more money to offset the $55 million shortfall needed to build the new downtown arena. Katz chipped in an additional $15 million through the Edmonton Arena Corporation and another $15 million came from the Community Revitalization Levy (CRL).[18] On December 3, 2013, Rogers Communications announced a 10-year naming rights deal for the new arena, henceforth known as Rogers Place.[19] Rogers Place is one of four Rogers-branded sporting facilities in Canada, alongside Rogers Centre in Toronto, Rogers K-Rock Centre in Kingston, and Rogers Arena in Vancouver.

The arena was funded by the following sources:[20]

• $279 million from the Community Revitalization Levy (CRL) and other incremental revenues (increased parking revenue, reallocation of existing subsidy paid to Northlands and new taxes from business in the arena)
• $125 million from ticket surcharge on all events in the new arena
• $137.81 million from lease revenue for the Arena
• $23.68 million in cash from Edmonton Arena Corporation
• $25 million from other government sources

[cam_wmh]

"If they threatened to move"

Can we not look at this as so contentious, with CSEC going nuclear in negotiations is the only way for the City to provide funding.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

"If they threatened to move"

Can we not look at this as so contentious, with CSEC going nuclear in negotiations is the only way for the City to provide funding.

The point of the question is to establish how firm people are in their thinking about how much funding should be provided, and how much they care about that relative to the risk of losing the team.

[Roughneck]

I put $50M but would probably go up to $100M. Bunk outlined a model I'd find palatable in the other thread.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Not a cent. I want to see Calgarians cheering for the Alberta Oilers and make the 3 hour drive to see a live NHL game.

[kevman]

Originally Posted by troutman

The arena was funded by the following sources:[20]

• $279 million from the Community Revitalization Levy (CRL) and other incremental revenues (increased parking revenue, reallocation of existing subsidy paid to Northlands and new taxes from business in the arena)
• $125 million from ticket surcharge on all events in the new arena
• $137.81 million from lease revenue for the Arena
  
• $23.68 million in cash from Edmonton Arena Corporation
• $25 million from other government sources

So Katz chipped in $23.68 million or 4% of the total cost. The rest came from government sources or user fees. Great deal for the city!