Head to Head Comparison: Iginla vs. Sakic

[SeeBass]

Originally Posted by GGG

What is invalid about it? If you want to compare players across different eras in any realistic fashion the least we can do is normalize goal scoring totals based on the average goals per game of that era.

http://www.quanthockey.com/TS/TS_GoalsPerGame.php

It is perfectly valid to assume that if you moved Bossy into an era that had 5.2 goals per game instead of 7 goals per game that his scoring would drop by a corresponding amount.

Actually no it is not, it is just math.

I haven't seen your let's compare era math though.

Please add in amount of teams divided by different rules, subtract by goalie equipment and use the square root of how many Eastern bloc players there are now. Don't forget to add in loss of ice time as one was on a dynasty team there would be a lot of blowouts that would diminish third period ice time.

With math I can prove that the average person on earth has one breast and one testicle too.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

Wow... I can't imagine there are many people, Flames fans or no, that will agree with you on this one.

Well, let's debate it. Get to the meat of the issue.

I won't mention cups if you don't mention 30 goal seasons.

I won't call you a homer if you don't call me a hater.

Good starting points?

[Tinordi]

These are the types of threads where fans from other boards come to laugh at us.

Sakic is an all-time player. Iginla, sadly, is not. The only argument in Iginla's favour is that Iginla played on a worse team. CliffFletcher pretty much nailed why that's not a great argument.

I think Sakic's later career when compared to Iginla's eventual late career numbers will cement this argument in Sakic's favour.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

This notion that Sakic played on stacked teams his whole career has got to die. His first 3-4 seasons in the NHL, the Nordiques were brutal - the worst team in the NHL. And Sakic was still winning the Calder and putting up 100 point seasons. His last 3-4 seasons in the league, the Avalanche were terrible. And Sakic remained among NHL scoring leaders, still played an elite two-way game.

Sakic spent almost half of his career playing on lousy, lousy teams. And he was still an elite player. So we don't have to pose the question What would Sakic have played like on a team as bad as the Flames? We already know the answer - he shone.

I've been meaning to reply to this post, but haven't had the time to go back into the numbers again.

First off, Joe Sakic did not win the Calder trophy, it went to Brian Leetch. In fact, Joe Sakic didn't even make the all-rookie team, whereas Jarome Iginla did.

Anyway, to answer your claim that Sakic's teams in his first years in the League should be comparable (if not worse) than Iginla's teams, here are the stats for each player's top five teammates, during their first five seasons in the NHL:

Season One

• Iginla: G: 108 A: 132 P: 240
• Sakic: G: 125 A: 180 P: 305

Season Two

• Iginla: G: 108 A: 147 P: 255
• Sakic: G: 77 A: 130 P: 207

Season Three

• Iginla: G: 83 A: 152 P: 235
• Sakic: G: 82 A: 131 P: 213

Season Four

• Iginla: G: 87 A: 166 P: 253
• Sakic: G: 130 A: 140 P: 270

Season Five

• Iginla: G: 77 A: 140 P: 217
• Sakic: G: 157 A: 262 P: 419

Totals

• Iginla: G: 463 A: 737 P: 1200
• Sakic: G: 571 A: 843 P: 1414

Averages

• Iginla: G: 93 A: 147 P: 240
• Sakic: G: 114 A: 169 P: 283

Further to those numbers, here's a look at the actual names of the top teammates each player had during those seasons (* marks Hall of Fame player):

Season One

• Iginla
  • Theoren Fleury
  • Dave Gagner
  • German Titov
  • Jonas Hoglund
  • Corey Millen
• Sakic
  • Peter Stastny *
  • Walt Poddubny
  • Michel Goulet *
  • Jeff Brown
  • Iiro Jarvi

Season Two

• Iginla
  • Theoren Fleury
  • Cory Stillman
  • Marty McInnis
  • Andrew Cassels
  • German Titov
• Sakic
  • Peter Stastny *
  • Michel Goulet *
  • Michel Petit
  • Guy Lafleur *
  • Marc Fortier

Season Three

• Iginla
  • Cory Stillman
  • Phil Housley
  • Valeri Bure
  • Andrew Cassels
  • Derek Morris
• Sakic
  • Mats Sundin *
  • Tony Hrkac
  • Stephane Morin
  • Tony McKegney
  • Mike Hough

Season Four

• Iginla
  • Valeri Bure
  • Phil Housley
  • Marc Savard
  • Derek Morris
  • Andrei Nazarov
• Sakic
  • Mats Sundin *
  • Owen Nolan
  • Greg Paslawski
  • Mike Hough
  • Mikhail Tatarinov

Season Five

• Iginla
  • Marc Savard
  • Valeri Bure
  • Dave Lowry
  • Phil Housley
  • Derek Morris
• Sakic
  • Mats Sundin *
  • Steve Duchesne
  • Mike Ricci
  • Owen Nolan
  • Andrei Kovalenko

Also, just for kicks, here's the top five teammates and starting goalie each player had during their best individual seasons:

Iginla (2001-02: Rocket Richard, Art Ross, Lester Pearson)

• Craig Conroy
• Dean McAmmond
• Derek Morris
• Marc Savard
• Toni Lydman
• Roman Turek

Sakic (2000-01: Lady Byng, Lester Pearson, Hart)

• Peter Forsberg
• Milan Hejduk
• Alex Tanguay
• Chris Drury
• Ray Bourque
• Patrick Roy

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

These are the types of threads where fans from other boards come to laugh at us.

Sakic is an all-time player. Iginla, sadly, is not. The only argument in Iginla's favour is that Iginla played on a worse team. CliffFletcher pretty much nailed why that's not a great argument.

I think Sakic's later career when compared to Iginla's eventual late career numbers will cement this argument in Sakic's favour.

Read the thread before you post your one-liners and then cease to reply again.