Craig Conroy and "The Dallas Model"

[Fan69]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

Exactly. Monahan's injuries and Bennett not panning out are what did this team in.

Losing Johnny for no assets. Dube for no assets. Topi lost asset. Think their was one or two more but we bled assets and lost a good one to injury. Now still no excuse for the trade.

Thats on top of the other things.

[Redrum]

Just hit on all our draft picks. Why didn't I think of that?!

[CalgaryFan1988]

Originally Posted by Fan69

Losing Johnny for no assets. Dube for no assets. Topi lost asset. Think their was one or two more but we bled assets and lost a good one to injury. Now still no excuse for the trade.

Thats on top of the other things.

Dube wasn't a loss, he didn't pan out. Also Mangiapane not taking that next step didn't help.

[GranteedEV]

Dallas Model?

What Stanley Cups does Dallas have in this millemium?

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

After the Tkachuk trade though, it was the Huberdeau contract that did it.

With more playoff success over the past 10 years, the series of events that leads to the Huby trade probably doesn't happen...

[Ped]

Boston got Kessel, Lucic, and Marchand in 2006
St Louis got Federko, Liut, and Brian Sutter in 76

[DJones]

Ya I've been happy with our drafting. It's the asset management that has been brutal.

Need to hit on the draft and also hit on a couple players on the team already. Miro being a legit top 4 guy or Zary/Corronato turning into a first liner would be huge.

[browna]

Bottom line is that this team isn't paying lip service to the talk of making the playoffs next year.
Decks have been cleared after this year. Conroy has been given the ability to make whatever decisions this years but the results of those decisions have to take hold as soon as next year.

There will be acquisitions and decisions based on the shorter term, including trading away acquired picks, to the dismay of a segment of people here.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Dallas Model?

What Stanley Cups does Dallas have in this millemium?

It fits the Edward's model of thinking.

Perennial playoffs/playoff revenue is the ultimate goal.

Cup/cups? Ehh.. 2-5 home dates are the real prize here.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by browna

Bottom line is that this team isn't paying lip service to the talk of making the playoffs next year.
Decks have been cleared after this year. Conroy has been given the ability to make whatever decisions this years but the results of those decisions have to take hold as soon as next year.

There will be acquisitions and decisions based on the shorter term, including trading away acquired picks, to the dismay of a segment of people here.

If they do that, it should be to the dismay of all Flames fans - because the Flames will continue to suck if they go down that path.

[1qqaaz]

If you’re going to follow the Dallas model, you can’t be making Honzek like picks in the first round. Or even Ronni/Strongrem type picks in the second round.
You can’t be hiring guys like Gulutzan as coach. You need to draft those with sky high ceilings. Compare Robertsons D-1 stats with Stromgren’s. Which screams “high ceiling”? Or compare Stromgren with Stankoven, who was taken just picks later.

Dallas has an easier time with extensions because of taxes. And it has an easier time with free agents for other reasons. Calgary can’t rely on ultra value Pavelski and Duchene type signings. Calgary is just too different to model after Dallas. Rather, Winnipeg is probably the more realistic model to follow. Even Carolina’s style of asset management is more realistic.
And with that said, Dallas, Winnipeg and Carolina have all picked in the top 3 within the past decade, which is something Calgary has never done.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

And with that said, Dallas, Winnipeg and Carolina have all picked in the top 3 within the past decade, which is something Calgary has never done.

All three did so because they won in the draft lottery and moved up into those spots.

[dino7c]

There is no one model...be smart and make good moves, don't lose QUALITY players for nothing, ever!

[traptor]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I find it hard to predict what the Flames will do next season.

They have a lot of players who are total wild cards, and will also have cap space to utilize for maybe some show me contracts.

Is Kuzmenko a 40 goal 70 point player next year who vaults the Flames PP up the rankings?
Does Huberdeau continue with his 60-70 point pace from the last half?
How much drop off do we see from Sharangovich, Coleman, Weegar after career years?
Do Miromanov and Kylington have another gear as top 4 Dmen?
How much will Coronato, Zary, Pospisil and Pelletier grow?
How will Vladar be when he's finally healthy?
Wolf has elite abilities, will they translate?
What if they sign a guy like Duclair and he scores 30 with Huby again?
Mangiapane is another guy capable of scoring 20-30+ goals too, does he bounce back in a contract year?

This roster isn't devoid of talent. They seem to play well under Huska too, and they seemed to get better all year with his system up until the roster was gutted, and they kind of built back up again as they went on.

Your right they're not devoid of talent and that they have alot of wildcards.
This scares me because it screams middling team in a year we cannot afford to be middling.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

It fits the Edward's model of thinking.

Perennial playoffs/playoff revenue is the ultimate goal.

Cup/cups? Ehh.. 2-5 home dates are the real prize here.

It’s hilarious that people still cling to the make playofff mentality narrative . Edwards is worth 3.5 BILLION . You think he cares about 2-3 games of playoff revenue ?? Seriously ? That’s a rounding error for him

His fault is he demands winners and success . And ends up employing people who will “execute” on a vision of success .

Hopefully he trusts Conroy , and Conroy has enough courage to explain where this team really is in their competitive cycle

To put it in perspective - at a 10% YoY ROI Edwards increases his net worth by 1 million a day

You think he cares / his goal is to make playoffs for the 2-3 game revenue ?

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Think it's 4 1st rounders that are high impact.

Heiskanen (4th OV)
Harley (18)
Johnston (23)
Oettinger (26)

And then 3 second rounders that look to be high impact

Robertson (39)
Hintz (49)
Stankoven (47)

Moral of the story is you need to draft well in the top 50 of drafts when you have those picks, and you need to try to accumulate more of those top 50 picks.

Flames recent top 50 picks:

Honzek (16)
Morin (48)
Coronato (13)
Stromgren (45)
Zary (24)
Kuznetsov (50)
Pelletier (26)

And they added Grushnikov (48) in the trade from Dallas.

I agree though and have long stated that the people that focus on "Needing top 5 picks to win a cup" are focusing on the wrong thing. You need to have some high picks, but you don't need to tear it down to the studs. You need to draft well at all positions of the draft and that is how you succeed.

You also need:

A good owner
Good coaching
A GM that makes good deals and negotiates well
A scouting department that finds gems
Great player development
Leaders
Toughness
Team chemistry
Good training habits in and out of season

There’s a lot that goes into being a championship team.

[Jason14h]

And Dallas isn’t a championship team yet / hasn’t been that close

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

My take away from what Conroy said wasn't necessarily about replicating their line-up, but just not needing to fully bottom out for top draft picks. Just make sure you have a decent number of good picks, and hit on them.

Sounds great in theory, but if it was that easy, every team would do it.

The draft is a crap shoot. You can’t solely rely on the draft

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

And Dallas isn’t a championship team yet / hasn’t been that close

Dallas made the final in 2020 and the WCF last year, they've come close

[Philly06Cup]

Instead of the Dallas Model, how about the Florida model. Trade for or sign undervalued players on other teams.

Montour: Under-appreciated, Pending UFA, acquired for peanuts.
Verhaeghe: League wide waiver fodder.
Forsling: League wide waiver fodder.
Bennett: 4th liner, healthy scratch, acquired for peanuts.
Reinhart: relative underachiever in Buffalo
Rodrigues: cheap FA
Mikkola: cheap FA

Huberdeau/Tkachuk was/is a huge part of the core. But good news, the Flames already have Huberdeau!

Barkov is another big piece. But everyone knows Barkov = Monahan, and the Flames already have that, kinda sorta.


Jokes aside, there are so many instances of hidden potential. It's also how the inaugural Vegas team was able to be so good.

William Karlsson, Marchessault, Tuch, McNabb, Perron, Shea Theodore, Reilly Smith, were all guys that just had more to give. It's possible that another team's third liner could turn out to be a first liner with the right opportunity.

Very possible to find core pieces in the recycle bin.