Sorry for this thread. I hope nobody will jump on me for this. A significant proportion of Canadians (25%) will experience Mental Health problems some time in their life. There is still a big stigma over these issues.
If you have depression or anxiety issues in particular, I just want to emphasize what works for me:
-eat right
-don't drink or do drugs
-exercise
-socialize with friends or family
-fight the negative thoughts in your head, remember you must believe in yourself. Don't let negative thinking get in the way
-meditate
-see a doctor, therapist, or eastern/native/non-traditional healing
-be easy on yourself
Just remember, things will get better, as long as you force yourself to get out and enjoy life. It may be hard at first, but it will pass.
Just remember that you are loved, and everyone is unique in their own way. Don't give up, and life is short. Enjoy it.
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Can I ask a question that comes from a good place? It's a place of wanting to understand mental health issues.
Backstory:
When I was 22 I was in an auto accident and lost my first wife. I was obviously sad and upset. I remember family, friend, and tons of doctors asking about my mental state and If I has suicidal thoughts. I just never had any of those thoughts.
Fast Forward to now. I have had some friends attempt suicide and some friends commit suicide.
I find it extremely hard to empathize with them because I never had these thoughts. Even in , what I perceive as, the hardest part of my life I never suffered depression or suicidal thoughts.
I feel ####ty because I think I might have downplayed other's issues because I can't understand the place their struggle came from. I know mental health issues are real. Is there anything I can do to become more educated on the issues?
Can I ask a question that comes from a good place? It's a place of wanting to understand mental health issues.
Backstory:
When I was 22 I was in an auto accident and lost my first wife. I was obviously sad and upset. I remember family, friend, and tons of doctors asking about my mental state and If I has suicidal thoughts. I just never had any of those thoughts.
Fast Forward to now. I have some friends attempt suicide and some friend commit suicide.
I find it extremely hard to empathize with them because I never had these thoughts. Even in , what I perceive as, the hardest part of my life I never suffered depression or suicidal thoughts.
I feel ####ty because I think I might have downplayed other's issues because I can't understand the place their struggle came from. I know mental health issues are real. Is there anything I can do to become more educated on the issues?
Suicide specifically, is almost always impulsive and due to severe psychological pain. It's often patients suffering from depression, but also schizophrenia, bipolar, post traumatic stress disorder and others.
The reason it's hard to empathize, is that it's not the result of logical thought. It's similar to finding it hard to empathize with an addict who chooses to get drugs/alcohol etc while sober. We cannot understand it logically because it doesn't make sense logically.
To many, it's an impulse arising from severe acute psychological pain. Think of it like someone plunging from a burning building from the top floor. There's no chance of being saved if you jump, but you cannot handle the current environment.
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Can I ask a question that comes from a good place? It's a place of wanting to understand mental health issues.
Backstory:
When I was 22 I was in an auto accident and lost my first wife. I was obviously sad and upset. I remember family, friend, and tons of doctors asking about my mental state and If I has suicidal thoughts. I just never had any of those thoughts.
Fast Forward to now. I have some friends attempt suicide and some friend commit suicide.
I find it extremely hard to empathize with them because I never had these thoughts. Even in , what I perceive as, the hardest part of my life I never suffered depression or suicidal thoughts.
I feel ####ty because I think I might have downplayed other's issues because I can't understand the place their struggle came from. I know mental health issues are real. Is there anything I can do to become more educated on the issues?
This isn't unusual.
I watched my only sibling die at at 23 when I was 21, and her son whom we adopted was lost to suicide 17 years later at the age of 22. Forgive me if my GAF-o-meter is broken when you are bawling your eyes out because you couldn't get approved for a credit card, or your girlfriend/boyfriend was seen dancing with someone else at a club or your car was vandalised.
When you've experienced traumatic, close loss, your perspective changes immensely. Both in how you perceive others problems, and how you are impacted by challenges in life. After going through those two close deaths, and another serious issue I had to deal with as a kid, it's pretty much got to be the worst of the worst now, to make me upset or emotional.
You just get numbed to emotional pain as your emotional pain-o-meter has already been cranked to 11 a few times in your life. And things just don't hurt as much anymore. Sometimes it makes you come off as cold to others, when in reality, you've experienced emotional trauma most people will never feel in 3 lifetimes. It doesn't make it right to be flippant, but you just kid of come across that way.
Some people go the other way, and spiral into depression and get worse. Although I have struggled with depression at points in my life, I find the best way to snap myself out of it, is to remind myself of those absolute darkest days, and where I am sitting at that moment in time, and how much better it is than then.
I've tried therapy, and all therapists seem to be interested in is how much you beat your meat, and what your sexual fetishes are. I'm of the opinion a large percentage of them are extremely damaged and predatory individuals themselves. The types of people that like slow down for car wrecks and snap photos of the carnage. The last psychologist I was with, I saw through all of her BS, when she suggested it was OK to wank it in her office in front of her if I felt comfortable. Like out of nowhere. She was simply a dirty old lady.
It was the last straw with mental health professionals for me, as I was also treated as a child by a somewhat 'infamous' local shrink that made the news for 'impropriety'. He would spend sessions asking me what I thought body parts and organs tasted like, and would describe to me what he thought it tasted like. I was 8 at the time, and nobody believed me. Thank god he finally got thrown in jail.
After the wanker lady, I walked out, never went back to one. I've just learned to deal with things internally, and I find my contrasting technique to be the most effective thing I have found at any price. I just can trust any mental health professionals anymore. It is very difficult to trust someone who leverages your abuse, into a form of abuse. And unfortunately I have learned this is not uncommon with psychologist and therapists.
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A lot of people don't talk due to stigma and it is costing us all. I just got a Austism Spectrum Disorder diagnosis in March and I am still figuring that out; how does that affect 32 year old me?
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Location: A simple man leading a complicated life....
Exp:
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickerjones
Can I ask a question that comes from a good place? It's a place of wanting to understand mental health issues.
Backstory:
When I was 22 I was in an auto accident and lost my first wife. I was obviously sad and upset. I remember family, friend, and tons of doctors asking about my mental state and If I has suicidal thoughts. I just never had any of those thoughts.
Fast Forward to now. I have had some friends attempt suicide and some friends commit suicide.
I find it extremely hard to empathize with them because I never had these thoughts. Even in , what I perceive as, the hardest part of my life I never suffered depression or suicidal thoughts.
I feel ####ty because I think I might have downplayed other's issues because I can't understand the place their struggle came from. I know mental health issues are real. Is there anything I can do to become more educated on the issues?
Imagine being in a dark tunnel where all the darkness that surrounds you represents the emotional pain in your life. At the end of that tunnel is a light representing hope for future possibilities. You try different methods or means to battle this pain with hopes of reaching the light at the end.
In some cases the light gets dimmer as each attempt fails. If the battle goes on too long the light disappears and all hope is gone. The emotion pain becomes too hard to handle as the person feels there is no end. Sucide becomes an attractive option as it offers an end to the emotional pain a person is suffering from with many falling victim to this cruel disease.
There are many websites devoted to explaining suicide. They might be of some benefit to you. Alternatively, you could make it known that you are willing to listen to people if they have suicidal thoughts...friends or acquaintances may come forward. If that is the case, be genuine and listen. Obviously, suicide is very personal and what one feels will not be shared by the next person.
I was diagnosed with PTSD after working for years on native reserves. For the past several months, my days have swung from hours of intense anger to hours of suicidal thoughts. I have two people that have shown a genuine interest in listening to me and wanting to help/understand. Despite their receptiveness, I have a hard time talking to these 2 friends as I don't want my pain to impact them. In my experience, most people say they will listen but don't know how to or truly aren't able to broach the subject.
My counsellor has been somewhat helpful when speaking about suicide in that she listens to my explanation. My GP has not been very helpful in the listening department; she is supportive but it is mostly about meds. It has been somewhat frustrating.
All of this being said, I don't think I will actually follow through on suicide. My PTSD experience has evolved into a constant anguish or pain which is tough for me to explain. Trying to force myself into doing activities I used to enjoy is exhausting. Combatting the negative feelings and thoughts is also exhausting. I used to think of suicide as a selfish act. I no longer hold that view; suicide is out of desperation. Like Dion said above, the experience of being in a dark tunnel and trying to reach the light is a huge battle. In my last conversation with my counsellor, I told her that I was weary and exhausted. It is tiring trying to overcome something that one does not truly understand. She understood what I meant but most people I share my story with can't relate.
Last edited by wwkayaker; 05-20-2017 at 05:50 PM.
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Can I ask a question that comes from a good place? It's a place of wanting to understand mental health issues.
Backstory:
When I was 22 I was in an auto accident and lost my first wife. I was obviously sad and upset. I remember family, friend, and tons of doctors asking about my mental state and If I has suicidal thoughts. I just never had any of those thoughts.
Fast Forward to now. I have had some friends attempt suicide and some friends commit suicide.
I find it extremely hard to empathize with them because I never had these thoughts. Even in , what I perceive as, the hardest part of my life I never suffered depression or suicidal thoughts.
I feel ####ty because I think I might have downplayed other's issues because I can't understand the place their struggle came from. I know mental health issues are real. Is there anything I can do to become more educated on the issues?
I won't get into the hard details, but in the spirit of de-tabooifying the topic, I suffer from anxiety and panic attacks, as well as some phobias. I have been a regular user of clonazepam and lorazepam for more than 10 years now. I hate those medications though as they turned me into a zombie and gave me blackouts. I am constantly either going through becoming addicted or going through withdrawal because I hate being addicted. I have been completely of benzos for almost a month now and had 2 panic attacks that I was able to suffer through.
I have also been taking escitalopram which has helped with my depression a lot, almost to the point that it is not existent. And the best thing is, I don't seem to have any of the negative side effects that other people can get from it. It doesn't help much with anxiety for me though. The doctor warned me that suicide is risk with this medication though and to be aware that it can play tricks with you mind.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
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Backstory:
When I was 22 I was in an auto accident and lost my first wife. I was obviously sad and upset. I remember family, friend, and tons of doctors asking about my mental state and If I has suicidal thoughts. I just never had any of those thoughts.
Fast Forward to now. I have had some friends attempt suicide and some friends commit suicide.
I find it extremely hard to empathize with them because I never had these thoughts. Even in , what I perceive as, the hardest part of my life I never suffered depression or suicidal thoughts.
The problem you're having is that you are thinking about two different things as if they're the same thing - that is, emotional trauma stemming from an event that can produce suicidal thoughts, and depression as an illness. The former is event-driven, the latter is a state of the brain that causes it to function differently from most peoples' brains.
In other words, some peoples' brains work differently than yours, and probably have for so long that it's hard for them to communicate the differences because they have no frame of reference. What living through a day feels like to you and what it feels like to them may be quite different things. Try describing the colour green to someone who's colourblind.
This is one reason why it would be nice if people stopped using the word "depressed" as a synonym for various degrees of "sad" or "upset". They are not the same thing. Depression involves persistent imbalances of neurotransmitters in the brain. in that sense, it is an ongoing condition. Feeling sad, even devastated, over an unfortunate life event generally does not denote any persistent problem in brain chemistry.
This is somewhat complicated by the fact that bouts of depression symptoms can be brought on or exacerbated by real world events, but usually it's not something like a death or losing a relationship, it's something that seems totally unrelated, like the sound of someone turning a key in a lock, or the sensation of driving. This is analogous to PTSD or the onset of symptoms of an anxiety disorder. Brains are weird, the reactions do not flow logically, trying to understand these disorders through what seems to make sense is just going to mislead you.
__________________ "The great promise of the Internet was that more information would automatically yield better decisions. The great disappointment is that more information actually yields more possibilities to confirm what you already believed anyway." - Brian Eno
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This is exactly it for me. How do I listen? ... and how do I react/handle/cope/deal with what they have told me?
It can be tricky I think. Personally, I have been open with my diagnosis. One afternoon, while sitting with a group of friends, one asked me how I was doing. My response was "Aside from the anger and suicidal thoughts, I am doing good." I wasn't looking for attention nor trying to shock anyone. I was genuine. At the moment, nothing was said. The next day my friend showed up at my house unannounced and asked to talk. He was blunt and just started with asking how I was doing. He was transparent and I knew he was interested so I talked. We talked for two hours. This guy is the exception as he had a close friend hang himself. During our chat, his eyes teared up and he said he couldn't go through losing another friend to suicide. He was motivated as he knew the pain, I guess.
As well, I think I test people out too. I might say something about my situation to see what kind of a reaction I get. I'm hoping my friends and family pursue the conversation because I do want support. However, if the person doesn't respond, I will likely never try to open up with them again. Sometimes I'm subtle. Other times I am just open and honest because mental health has a stigma that needs to disappear.
I guess I'm trying to say getting the conversation started can be tricky. It seems like I'm describing dating...does she like me, did I pick up that clue properly, should I be bold or hang back, etc.
Once you get the conversation started, try to hold back suggestions and just simply let the person talk. Even with my counsellor, I often have trouble explaining what I'm feeling. She asks questions to clarify. The conversations also seem to ramble on or take a tangent frequently as different things pop into my memory. When someone listens to me, I know they likely don't have the answer but the fact that they are willing to listen and show compassion and empathy are the meaningful parts. Mental health is a very lonely illness for me and having someone listen takes away some of that loneliness.
Does this make sense? How to listen and how to get a conversation started are difficult questions.
It can be tricky I think. Personally, I have been open with my diagnosis. One afternoon, while sitting with a group of friends, one asked me how I was doing. My response was "Aside from the anger and suicidal thoughts, I am doing good." I wasn't looking for attention nor trying to shock anyone. I was genuine. At the moment, nothing was said. The next day my friend showed up at my house unannounced and asked to talk. He was blunt and just started with asking how I was doing. He was transparent and I knew he was interested so I talked. We talked for two hours. This guy is the exception as he had a close friend hang himself. During our chat, his eyes teared up and he said he couldn't go through losing another friend to suicide. He was motivated as he knew the pain, I guess.
As well, I think I test people out too. I might say something about my situation to see what kind of a reaction I get. I'm hoping my friends and family pursue the conversation because I do want support. However, if the person doesn't respond, I will likely never try to open up with them again. Sometimes I'm subtle. Other times I am just open and honest because mental health has a stigma that needs to disappear.
I guess I'm trying to say getting the conversation started can be tricky. It seems like I'm describing dating...does she like me, did I pick up that clue properly, should I be bold or hang back, etc.
Once you get the conversation started, try to hold back suggestions and just simply let the person talk. Even with my counsellor, I often have trouble explaining what I'm feeling. She asks questions to clarify. The conversations also seem to ramble on or take a tangent frequently as different things pop into my memory. When someone listens to me, I know they likely don't have the answer but the fact that they are willing to listen and show compassion and empathy are the meaningful parts. Mental health is a very lonely illness for me and having someone listen takes away some of that loneliness.
Does this make sense? How to listen and how to get a conversation started are difficult questions.
I know that feeling all too well. Difficult to open up to people, especially when it's in a clinical setting. Family has a history of depression/anxiety and were raised to "tough it out." So when things get bad, I've had the bad sense of not letting anyone on to how I am until I'm in deep trouble.
Can I ask a question that comes from a good place? It's a place of wanting to understand mental health issues.
Backstory:
When I was 22 I was in an auto accident and lost my first wife. I was obviously sad and upset. I remember family, friend, and tons of doctors asking about my mental state and If I has suicidal thoughts. I just never had any of those thoughts.
Fast Forward to now. I have had some friends attempt suicide and some friends commit suicide.
I find it extremely hard to empathize with them because I never had these thoughts. Even in , what I perceive as, the hardest part of my life I never suffered depression or suicidal thoughts.
I feel ####ty because I think I might have downplayed other's issues because I can't understand the place their struggle came from. I know mental health issues are real. Is there anything I can do to become more educated on the issues?
These are two good videos on the topic to understand it a bit more.
The worst thing about depression is that it doesn't need to follow any other negative things in a person's life. Just like you can get a cold when lots of things are going well, so can depression set in without any seemingly rational cause of distress or sadness.
__________________
"If stupidity got us into this mess, then why can't it get us out?"
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Get out and enjoy life. Its hard, but it's a cycle. Once you break the cycle you won't feel isolated or helpless. I can't ask for help, I have an irrational fear of being a burden on someone. So I know how it feels to suffer in silence. If you need to talk about anything and everything I'm a pm away.
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There are many websites devoted to explaining suicide. They might be of some benefit to you. Alternatively, you could make it known that you are willing to listen to people if they have suicidal thoughts...friends or acquaintances may come forward. If that is the case, be genuine and listen. Obviously, suicide is very personal and what one feels will not be shared by the next person.
I was diagnosed with PTSD after working for years on native reserves. For the past several months, my days have swung from hours of intense anger to hours of suicidal thoughts. I have two people that have shown a genuine interest in listening to me and wanting to help/understand. Despite their receptiveness, I have a hard time talking to these 2 friends as I don't want my pain to impact them. In my experience, most people say they will listen but don't know how to or truly aren't able to broach the subject.
My counsellor has been somewhat helpful when speaking about suicide in that she listens to my explanation. My GP has not been very helpful in the listening department; she is supportive but it is mostly about meds. It has been somewhat frustrating.
All of this being said, I don't think I will actually follow through on suicide. My PTSD experience has evolved into a constant anguish or pain which is tough for me to explain. Trying to force myself into doing activities I used to enjoy is exhausting. Combatting the negative feelings and thoughts is also exhausting. I used to think of suicide as a selfish act. I no longer hold that view; suicide is out of desperation. Like Dion said above, the experience of being in a dark tunnel and trying to reach the light is a huge battle. In my last conversation with my counsellor, I told her that I was weary and exhausted. It is tiring trying to overcome something that one does not truly understand. She understood what I meant but most people I share my story with can't relate.
I recently completed 12 years as a subject in a ptsd study at the Mayo clinic. If you haven't tried it yet, give EMDR therapy a try. It was one of the clear winners for me and my war vet buddies. The first choice for therapy though...dogs. Second choice...horses. Third...anything not involving another human.
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The problem you're having is that you are thinking about two different things as if they're the same thing - that is, emotional trauma stemming from an event that can produce suicidal thoughts, and depression as an illness. The former is event-driven, the latter is a state of the brain that causes it to function differently from most peoples' brains.
In other words, some peoples' brains work differently than yours, and probably have for so long that it's hard for them to communicate the differences because they have no frame of reference. What living through a day feels like to you and what it feels like to them may be quite different things. Try describing the colour green to someone who's colourblind.
This is the biggest thing people need to learn, your brain is your experience to this world, how you sense, feel, view and experience your life is not others experience, and I find this lack of understanding this fact is why people are so judgmental and cruel to people in this world, be it how people view those with mental health issues, to drug addicts, obese, religious, non religious, etc..
Great post dude.
__________________ Allskonar fyrir Aumingja!!
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Depression/Anxiety and other Mental Health Issues
