Keenan blasts young Oilers; same could be said for the Flames

[Five-hole]

Keenan rips the Oilers during their game against the Wild last night

“You can’t go every single night and rely on skill. You’ve got to go to a different package from time to time. You’re not winning games at home? Find a way to win. Get involved emotionally. I watch this game and it’s as flat as can be. You can have all the skill, or talk about all these kids with super skills, they’re listening too much with all the super skills they’ve got, because they’re not executing. Get the job done. Get a little bit of grit into your game.

“We had super skilled players in Edmonton, (Glenn) Anderson, (Mark) Messier, (Jari) Kurri, Gretz wasn’t of that ilk, but Kevin Lowe, their president he was as fierce a competitor as I’ve ever coached (with Cup-winning Rangers team) and I don’t see it in this team. They got no personality.”

“I’m a results oriented guy and I don’t see any results.”

David Staples, writing the story, goes on to agree. It would be tough not to.

Unfortunately, perhaps minus the "super skills" bit, the same could be said for the Flames. They are not winning games at home. They lack toughness, lack grit, and appear to lack determination (though a few comebacks this season have shown a hint of spark).

As we all know, Jarome used to be that straw stirring the drink, but outside of the game where he fought, he's looked as passive as I've ever seen him. In the first few games of the season he seemed at least engaged in the play, but certainly not fiery or passionate as he's been throughout much of his career. Since that time, though, I can't say as though I've seen much of anything.

The fourth line provides some energy and grit but there's only so much guys getting 5-8 of ice per game can do for you.

Hartley discussed the lack of pushback against the Kings after Trevor Lewis ran Joey Mac. He said pushback doesn't have to be facewashes and dropping the gloves necessarily; it could be getting in the face of the other goalie or scoring on the powerplay. None of the above happened.

Is a personnel move necessary or are the answers "in the room"?

[Northendzone]

Were the same as the Oilers, with the exception of winning with skill.

[Phanuthier]

LOL Keenan is the last person to talk about this stuff. Relying only on skill? Biggest culpreit of that I have ever seen. The Flames exclusively on skill to bail their lazy asses out and make the playoffs. We had emotion for maybe 5-10 minutes a game, we would just ring off 3 goals in that and get some half assed 5-4 win.

[JiriHrdina]

I don't think what Keenan outlines is the true problem with the Oil. Rather I think they have too many guys of the same type. It is a team built like a fantasy team not an NHL team.

Plus you don't win with goofs like Yakupov.

[foshizzle11]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

Were the same as the Oilers, with the exception of winning with skill.

We aren't the same. There are generalizations about both teams that are similar yes. But the same, no. Teams who aren't winning generating have things in common. Like a lack of passion and compete.

[vektor]

I think the key here is you need a team built with players of multiple different skillsets. An entire team of playmakers or snipers is a losing team; you need power forwards, shut down d-men, agitators, grinders, playmakers, snipers all on one team to win. Edmonton has a bunch of playmakers/snipers and nothing else, just like us. We have no Lucic on our team, we have no Byfuglien, the opposing teams wake up and are happy that it's the Flames and not Boston they are playing against. Our biggest agitator is Jackman that has been useless this season and our power forward is relegated to weak boardplay and shots from the perimeter.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I don't think what Keenan outlines is the true problem with the Oil. Rather I think they have too many guys of the same type. It is a team built like a fantasy team not an NHL team.

Plus you don't win with goofs like Yakupov.

Absolutely agree, there's no balance to that team whatsoever, and I think this is a shockingly obvious failure of management and planning. You just draft 4 superstar gifted skill guys and make a couple iffy trades and hope for the best?

Shuffle the deck a bit and trade one of these guys for a collection of assets.

[Vinny01]

Are the Flames a Brandon Prust away from being hard to play against? I know the Flames wanted him badly but that 4th line hasn't been nearly as hard to play against this year as they were last. Sarich should be sticking around in the lineup just to ensure we have that toughness on the backend.

[Buff]

I think there are some answers in the room for this grit, but not enough. I've said this for several years now, the Flames are missing a pest. In 2004 they had a pest in Nieminen. Pests can get your team going by going out and getting in the face of the other teams. Another key ingredient to that team was toughness. A guy like Simon could play, and make people think twice about going after your players. Simon wasn't the end of it either. Oliwa was also on the team. Then you also had guys who could and would take care of themselves.

This year, the Flames have much more talent than the team I'm talking about, but they desperately lack grit and toughness. Perhaps a guy like Aliu may provide some spark, but there isn't enough team toughness to compliment a pest like Aliu (who isn't a proven NHL player yet either).

[Phanuthier]

Its not just addign 1 or 2 guys, or a guy that has good zings. We lack TEAM toughness, not individual toughness. This is the butter soft (Butlersoft) team, easiest team to play against. I had to laugh at the comment in the LA game, easiest way to clear the puck out of the zone? Just push the man holding the puck out of the zone. Run the goalie and your D doesn't even try and make eye contact with the culprit. Easiest team to play against in the NHL.

[Bertuzzied]

"I didn't fire you. The owners did!"

[EddyBeers]

I am surprised how horrible the Oilers are offensively 5 on 5. I really thought they would be better this year, but it appears like they are destined for another top five pick.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Honestly if the oilers bottom 2 lines and bottom 5 defenceman didn't suck the issue would be much less acute.

12-15 guys on their roster stink. They can play as tough as they want, they still stink.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by EddyBeers

I am surprised how horrible the Oilers are offensively 5 on 5. I really thought they would be better this year, but it appears like they are destined for another top five pick.

ummm you could tell how they were going to do from their AHL stint. Terrible drafting and an even worse management

[Locke]

Yeah, theres no balance, but theres also no bag of tricks.

Teams have to find a way to win. There are various ways to win and you have to find different ways against different opposition.

The Oilers are a one-trick pony. If skill alone doesnt get it done theres no 'Plan B.'

[Dienasty]

I agree with the assessment that they have a ton of skill and not a ton of size. However size is easy to find, elite skill...isn't. If you compare them to good teams it seems they have the Datsyuk/Zetterberg in skill but are lacking Franzen/Holmstrom/Cleary from the Wings elite days. (I know there are plenty of other differences on D and goaltending too.)

Imagine the Oilers Drafting Seguin over Hall, and taking Landeskog over Nuge.

Imagine Eberle-Seguin-Landeskog first line.. With the same second line... (Yak/Gagner/Hemmer)

They would be a lot scarier in that scenario. (They also shouldn't have wasted early second picks on Moroz+Pitlick lol)

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Dienasty

I agree with the assessment that they have a ton of skill and not a ton of size. However size is easy to find, elite skill...isn't. If you compare them to good teams it seems they have the Datsyuk/Zetterberg in skill but are lacking Franzen/Holmstrom/Cleary from the Wings elite days. (I know there are plenty of other differences on D and goaltending too.)

Imagine the Oilers Drafting Seguin over Hall, and taking Landeskog over Nuge.

Imagine Eberle-Seguin-Landeskog first line.. With the same second line... (Yak/Gagner/Hemmer)

They would be a lot scarier in that scenario. (They also shouldn't have wasted early second picks on Moroz+Pitlick lol)

Theres more to winning than just combining skill and size. Sure that helps, but I think Keenan was referring more to an ability to adapt or alter tactics to generate a winning strategy.

And thats rich, coming from Keenan, hardly a tactician himself.

But thats how I see it.

If your skill guys arent getting it done is your goaltender going to steal a game? Can you grind out a win? Can you sustain pressure and capitalize on the powerplay or a counter-attack? If you cant maintain presssure or puck-control can you find another way to win?

The Oilers cant. If the skill guys arent getting it done then thats that. Pack it up and call it a day.

[Badgers Nose]

Typing hemmer = typing hemsky.

Added bonus of not sounding like a greaser on a flames board.

Also lol on hall v clutterbuck.

[Badgers Nose]

Keenan made Iggy softer, no?

[HPLovecraft]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I don't think what Keenan outlines is the true problem with the Oil. Rather I think they have too many guys of the same type. It is a team built like a fantasy team not an NHL team.

Plus you don't win with goofs like Yakupov.

I think you're agreeing, at least in part, with what Keenan said.

You can’t go every single night and rely on skill. You’ve got to go to a different package from time to time.