I liked the finished product but I'm still curious af.
the urban and beach guerrilla warfare theme was entertaining enough, though with the movie being about stealing secret plans, would anyone else have liked to see a Mission Impossible: Star Wars Edition? as in, more infiltration/espionage stuff where they work as a team to sneak into the base, fool imperials with disguises, break into vaults that have overly-elaborate security measures? laser motion sensors that Jyn has to contort herself through?
I know they probably don't have enough confidence yet to really do stuff without stormtroopers, x-wings and lightsabers, but I hope it happens eventually.
Possible recuts aside, I don't think it is such a bad thing either. Some of that footage probably worked better as exposition in the trailer but would have been redundant in the movie.
I almost feel like movies definitely should shoot special trailer footage that helps tell a 90s teaser to give us the set up without ruining the movie by using too much actual footage.
I would be curious to find out if there was a different direction intended and it was changed after that trailer was released or if it is kinda along my speculation and they realized some of that footage worked for a trailer but not for the movie.
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I'd like to point out that they made Jin (Jyn? Gin?) to be a real heroine without making her costume slutty or sexy. TFA did the same thing with Rey and I think that is good.
There's so much pressure on girls these days about beauty expectations, so it's cool how both JJ Abrams and Edwards just made a bad ass girl hero, plain and simple. I'm no SJW, but it's important to have these kinds of heroes for girls these days.
For the record, I like Carrie Fisher in her prison outfit.
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Here's my conflict, both my girls have seen all the other Star Wars movies. They are 7 and 4 years old. The 7 year old asked me yesterday before I went to the movie what the new girls name is. I know they'll both love the movie but I'm not sure how they'll take everyone dying.
Here's my conflict, both my girls have seen all the other Star Wars movies. They are 7 and 4 years old. The 7 year old asked me yesterday before I went to the movie what the new girls name is. I know they'll both love the movie but I'm not sure how they'll take everyone dying.
It's war. People die in war, and it's a terrible thing. But great heroes will sacrifice themselves for a greater cause, and that is an amazing thing.
I'm not a parent, but I wouldn't shelter them from the fact of death. However, this movie is no more gruesome than the other movies so they don't actually witness anything more violent than previous movies.
Like I said I have no problem with all the war, I'm worried about completely bumming out my kids as they get excited about this new badass girl in the universe only to have her die at the end. On the flip side it does serve as a good counter to all the happy ending stuff they are used to getting.
Go to an early show and then watch a New Hope right after.
Will make the ending not as sad for the kids because then they can see the rest of the people and can use the whole "Those people died so that all of these characters that you love could survive" angle.
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the urban and beach guerrilla warfare theme was entertaining enough, though with the movie being about stealing secret plans, would anyone else have liked to see a Mission Impossible: Star Wars Edition? as in, more infiltration/espionage stuff where they work as a team to sneak into the base, fool imperials with disguises, break into vaults that have overly-elaborate security measures? laser motion sensors that Jyn has to contort herself through?
I know they probably don't have enough confidence yet to really do stuff without stormtroopers, x-wings and lightsabers, but I hope it happens eventually.
Yeah I'd like to see that. To have stealth and strategy be used more as opposed to blaster fights and clashing of ships would be refreshing for the series.
Though something I wish a new film would resurrect from the old movies is chases on/with vehicles. The endor bike chase from VI and the asteroid belt chase in V were really entertaining and fun to watch. They were filming a snow speeder chase of some sort on starkiller base for TFA as seen in the deleted scenes but it was ultimately scrapped (unfortunately). I hope the next film has more chases.
It would have been great for them to host a double header of Rogue One and New Hope (original release) back to back. I know I immediately watched the beginning of New Hope when I got home so I could see how they matched up.
Last edited by KTrain; 12-21-2016 at 06:35 PM.
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So after reading this thread I decided to watch The Force Awakens again to see how it compares to Rogue One. It's not even close. It's more engaging in the first 10 minutes than Rogue One was through the first hour. A masterful job by Oscar Isaac and John Boyega to play instantly likable characters. Plus, Kylo Ren's first scene is just as strong as any appearance by Darth Vader in R1 (last scene in the hallway notwithstanding). 25 minutes into the film and I'm already cheering and rooting for the characters. THAT is how you engage an audience.
It just has such a different tone. The film is meant to entertain first and foremost, and that's where I felt R1 fell short. I wasn't really that entertained. Intrigued? Sure, but that quickly moved into the realm of boredom when they failed to deliver anything to continue being intrigued by.
However, with all the commentary in this thread, I'm willing to watch it again from a different perspective. That of telling the story of forgotten soldiers in a larger war, with all it's brutish reality. Perhaps I'll come to appreciate it for it's own merits, and try and forget the fact that it feels so radically different than the other Star Wars films.
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So after reading this thread I decided to watch The Force Awakens again to see how it compares to Rogue One. It's not even close. It's more engaging in the first 10 minutes than Rogue One was through the first hour. A masterful job by Oscar Isaac and John Boyega to play instantly likable characters. Plus, Kylo Ren's first scene is just as strong as any appearance by Darth Vader in R1 (last scene in the hallway notwithstanding). 25 minutes into the film and I'm already cheering and rooting for the characters. THAT is how you engage an audience.
It just has such a different tone. The film is meant to entertain first and foremost, and that's where I felt R1 fell short. I wasn't really that entertained. Intrigued? Sure, but that quickly moved into the realm of boredom when they failed to deliver anything to continue being intrigued by.
However, with all the commentary in this thread, I'm willing to watch it again from a different perspective. That of telling the story of forgotten soldiers in a larger war, with all it's brutish reality. Perhaps I'll come to appreciate it for it's own merits, and try and forget the fact that it feels so radically different than the other Star Wars films.
Yeah I'd also say TFA is the better film, and contrary to what some have claimed, I'd say it stands on it's own much better than Rogue One. TFA is a good high adventure film, even for people who have no nostalgia for the originals. (At least based on comments of people like that that I've met.) The interwoven stories of Rey and Kylo are interesting on their own.
Rogue One felt like a fan service film. It's intriguing because it shows things we don't normally see about the Star Wars universe, but on it's own what we see isn't really that engaging, and it's quite mediocre as a war/action film. The plans for the Death Star are never that interesting, and without the context that ANH gives the story, the whole "I designed a flaw into the Death Star, but I won't tell you what it is" isn't very interesting. Many have mentioned that the characters are much more interesting if you've read some backstory book which most people haven't read. (Catalyst. I haven't read it either.)
If you need a whole other movie to give meaning to the plans that were stolen, and a book to flesh out the characters, it's a pretty big sign that the film doesn't stand on it's own. Oh, and the best scene in the film is given to Darth Vader, a character that has zero relevance to this film.
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I have to agree characters in TFA were more engaging but a few points. TFA was as much or more a fan service film. Heck the whole plot was a retread and it relied way more on fan endearment of familiar characters.
Also Cali, I had to laugh at you saying Kylo, a main character, had better scenes than Vader, who basically had a cameo, except for Vader's hallway scene. Which is funny because Vader literally only had one other 40 second appearance. So yeah, if you discount 50% of Vader's scenes, which together total about 90s, the then i guess you could say his scenes weren't as strong.
But R1 had a far superior story than TFA.
And let's be honest, talk about one or the other not standing well enough on its own or without use of iconic characters is silly. Of course neither movie would stand alone completely. Otherwise Vader's usage in R1 would be almost nonsensical. Someone totally unfmiliar with the universe would be like who the eff is this guy? Same with Solo, Leia, Luke, etc in TFA.
If somehow we got a super movie with TFA's characterization and R1's plot and storytelling, we'd be set.
Also, I've not hear anyone say that reading any books are needed to enjoy R1. That's news to me.
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Honestly the only similarity between TFA and ANH that I noticed right away was the Deathstar/Starkiller Base thing. I did think that was a bit redundant but it wasn't enough to ruin the film. There were some other smaller similarities but they weren't overly apparent until I thought about it later or had them pointed out to me. I really don't think it's a total rehash of a story. TFA was awesome in my opinion, but it was a main series movie so I expected it to be.
Cecil's posts have nailed about every thought I've had about TFA vs R1.
TFA wasn't some revelation. It was ANH 2.0, you can't even beat around that fact. And while the newbies were great, genuine and relatable characters, basically the only thing that redeemed the overly simplistic plot with next to no originality and underwhelming climax was the distraction of how likeable the old character are to watch and interact with one another.
Nostalgia saved JJ Abrams' attempt from heavy criticism, and I'm honestly shocked that so many people are still able to look past the flaws of the movie because of it. At the same time, I almost don't blame them. I see Han Solo and Chewy come on screen and automatically I am glued, even if they say or do nothing very meaningful. It's still fun to watch because you love the characters just so damn much.
With that in mind can you blame people for being equally unenthusiastic about R1's characters? Take out the nostalgia crutch and people will suddenly start picking everything apart with a fine tooth comb.
I'd like to point out that they made Jin (Jyn? Gin?) to be a real heroine without making her costume slutty or sexy. TFA did the same thing with Rey and I think that is good.
There's so much pressure on girls these days about beauty expectations, so it's cool how both JJ Abrams and Edwards just made a bad ass girl hero, plain and simple. I'm no SJW, but it's important to have these kinds of heroes for girls these days.
For the record, I like Carrie Fisher in her prison outfit.
Yes.. but both are still gorgeous. It will be interesting to see when they cast their first ugly fat female lead.
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