Tim Hortons a Flop in the US

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Is it wrong that I think Swiss Chalet is horrible?

It's just as bad as KFC.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Nice.

Yeah I must be some poorly educated sycophant with ridiculous friends because I think that patriotism fuels Tim Hortons commercial success...that must be it, and you would know, wouldn't you?

I actual fact, that is not really the argument I am making. I have no doubt that the vast majority of Canadians patron Tim Hortons not out of some sort of patriotic duty; they do so because they are convinced that Tim Hortons is the best coffee, sandwich and donut purveyor on the market. This is the conscious motivation, but DO NOT underestimate the enormous power of mass media and the effect that it can have on a culture that believes in some instinctive sense of patriotism. Tim Hortons ingeniously capitalised on these collective feelings in Canadians in the 90ies, and they used all that cheap social capital and common good will to sell their products—which as I have already noted are NOTHING SPECIAL, and NOT IN ANY WAY DISTINCTLY CANADIAN.

People may not remember or even realise why they think Tim Hortons is great, but I believe it is a mistake to fail to recognise the critical impact that their aggressively patriotic ad campaigns from the 90ies had on the success that they experience today.

Did I hurt your feelings? Sorry if my post was blatantly obtuse, I was just reciprocating yours. How you can possibly think that any more than a small percentage of people go to Tims out of a feeling of patriotism is beyond me. But now that you've gone and changed your opinion to say that now people go there because they think it is the bestest, I still have to disagree.

How about this: it's convenient, and it's good enough. There is no special feeling behind it. It's good enough, and it's right around the corner.

You're over analyzing things.

And way to slip in the word 'sycophant', big brain.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by 4X4

How you can possibly think that any more than a small percentage of people go to Tims out of a feeling of patriotism is beyond me.

Eh, I dunno... Tim's marketing does wrap itself in all manner of Canadiana. There is definetely a nationalistic bend to their advertising so while I agree that likely very few folk buy coffee deliberately out of a sense of Canadian patriotism I think more then a few are influenced (conciously or unconciously) by their marketing which plays heavily into that.

Personally I think I like Tim's because it generally hits the sweet spot of taste (Not bad coffee + hot food), convienence (lot's of them + one located on my way to work), and affordability (Cheaper then Starbucks/Second Cup).

[hwy19man]

"Tim Hortons closed the doors of its U.S. headquarters earlier this week as it shifts responsibilities ahead of a global expansion."

http://www.msn.com/en-ca/money/topstories/tim-hortons-closes-doors-to-us-headquarters/ar-BBk0ueu?ocid=mailsignoutmd

[Jordan!]

There is virtually no difference between Dunkin and Tim's in my opinion.

Tim's is only popular because it is a cultural symbol for Canada

[Bill Bumface]

^Totally agree.

[Jordan!]

I'd also add, that the Soup/Sandwich's at Tim's is enjoyable.. but even that isn't amazing. Duncan's "food" is complete garbage though.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Bouw N Arrow

There is virtually no difference between Dunkin and Tim's in my opinion.

Tim's is only popular because it is a cultural symbol for Canada

Tim's is popular because:

• Convenience - I've worked at three places where the closest coffee/sandwich place was Tim's. They are Tim's locations in industrial parks and commercial zones where there is almost nothing else.
  
• Price - It's cheaper than Stabucks/Second Cup. A lot of people won't spend $4 on a coffee.
  
• Quality at its Price Point - The breakfast and lunch fare is a notch up from McDonalds/Subway. And again, often more convenient than the alternatives (there are no McDonald's in food courts or strip malls).

For people who want cheap and convenient, what are the better alternatives?

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Tim's is popular because:

• Convenience - I've worked at three places where the closest coffee/sandwich place was Tim's. They are Tim's locations in industrial parks and commercial zones where there is almost nothing else.
  
• Price - It's cheaper than Stabucks/Second Cup. A lot of people won't spend $4 on a coffee.
  
• Quality at its Price Point - The breakfast and lunch fare is a notch up from McDonalds/Subway. And again, often more convenient than the alternatives (there are no McDonald's in food courts or strip malls).

For people who want cheap and convenient, what are the better alternatives?

McDonalds breakfast is far superior to Timmies.

[polak]

And it's far quicker.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Tim's is popular because:

• Convenience - I've worked at three places where the closest coffee/sandwich place was Tim's. They are Tim's locations in industrial parks and commercial zones where there is almost nothing else.
  
• Price - It's cheaper than Stabucks/Second Cup. A lot of people won't spend $4 on a coffee.
  
• Quality at its Price Point - The breakfast and lunch fare is a notch up from McDonalds/Subway. And again, often more convenient than the alternatives (there are no McDonald's in food courts or strip malls).

For people who want cheap and convenient, what are the better alternatives?

I agree with you but this is just flat out not true. There are many places I would choose to eat breakfast before I consume a foam patty from Tims.

[Hack&Lube]

Originally Posted by hwy19man

"Tim Hortons closed the doors of its U.S. headquarters earlier this week as it shifts responsibilities ahead of a global expansion."

http://www.msn.com/en-ca/money/topstories/tim-hortons-closes-doors-to-us-headquarters/ar-BBk0ueu?ocid=mailsignoutmd

This makes sense as the Tim Hortons and Burger King (now 3rd largest fast food operator in the world) merger placed their global HQ in Oakville.

I wonder if it would be a good move to sell Tim's coffee in Burger King restaurants in the US or if that would dilute/damage the brand.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

This makes sense as the Tim Hortons and Burger King (now 3rd largest fast food operator in the world) merger placed their global HQ in Oakville.

I wonder if it would be a good move to sell Tim's coffee in Burger King restaurants in the US or if that would dilute/damage the brand.

I think they will make that move to compete against McDonalds' successful coffee move.

I remember reading an article a few years back stating that Timmies was installing coffee dispensers in gas stations (kind of like the Timothy's or Seattle's Best style) to grow the brand in the NE states (Dunkin' country).

They are willing to do so in the US, but I doubt we would be getting Timmies at BK in Canada.

[Weitz]

Since when is Tim Hortons food a notch up from complete crap?

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

I wonder if it would be a good move to sell Tim's coffee in Burger King restaurants in the US or if that would dilute/damage the brand.

Considering that Tim Hortons has virtually zero brand equity in most of the US (apart from a few pockets along the border), I think anything they do to get their product out in front of more eyeballs is a good thing.

At the end of the day though, there's nothing about Tim Hortons that's unique, so I'm not surprised they are having issues getting a foothold. They are not bringing anything new to the table food/drink wise, and the stuff that they are bringing is average at best (sorry, calling themselves a bake shop, and then selling par-baked goods, won't cut it). And nobody gives a crap about the hockey or faux-Canadiana angle in the US, so they can't mask their deficiencies with marketing stories.

Dunkin Donuts does exactly what they do, and that group of consumers is loyal to them as they are to Tim Hortons is in Canada (and the ones who aren't go to 7-11). Tim Hortons, unless they do something drastic, will always be an also-ran....if they are lucky to even stay in the market.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Tim's is popular because:

• Convenience - I've worked at three places where the closest coffee/sandwich place was Tim's. They are Tim's locations in industrial parks and commercial zones where there is almost nothing else.
• Price - It's cheaper than Stabucks/Second Cup. A lot of people won't spend $4 on a coffee.
• Quality at its Price Point - The breakfast and lunch fare is a notch up from McDonalds/Subway. And again, often more convenient than the alternatives (there are no McDonald's in food courts or strip malls).

For people who want cheap and convenient, what are the better alternatives?

Convenient, sure... but only because they used marketing and patriotism to shut down the competition. I'd take Robin's, Coffee Time or Country Style any time over Tim Horton's.

Tim's basically out competed them with terrific marketing and then made themselves the "cheaper" option to Starbuck's and the like by cornering the cheap niche.

I agree, their food is fine, but not something I would go out of my way for. I've definitely never had a hankering for anything on their menu, but if I happen to be there, I won't not eat there.

[saillias]

A&W breakfast > McDonald's breakfast > Tim Horton's breakfast > Burger King breakfast

[nik-]

One bracket doesn't do it justice. A&W and McDonald's breakfasts are significantly better than Tim Horton's.

[GreenLantern]

When I am on a fishing trip we usually leave around 6 AM, we stop at Tims on the way out for coffee and breakfast sandwiches. Nobody is allowed to eat their breakfast sandwich until we are within 15 minutes of our fishing destination as it is essentially the worlds strongest laxative.

Their food is hot garbage, but it is convenient and cheap..

[DownhillGoat]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

[*]Price - It's cheaper than Stabucks/Second Cup. A lot of people won't spend $4 on a coffee.

How is this argument still trotted out again and again and again? At what Starbucks do you spend $4 on a coffee?

You want some specialty drink sure, you can spend upwards of $4. You want just a coffee? The same size that runs me $1.90 at Tims is about $2.15 at Starbucks.

You also missed the number one reason: marketing.