I'm not worried. This has been rehashed over and over again. Finally a reporter during development camp asked him straight up and he seemed to answer truthfully that he'll be faithful to the Flames.
I believe him.
I'm still hesitant until I see pen to paper. Hopefully it's this season...
I'm not worried. This has been rehashed over and over again. Finally a reporter during development camp asked him straight up and he seemed to answer truthfully that he'll be faithful to the Flames.
I believe him.
It was the subject of basically an entire day's worth of scrums.
I'd be really hesitant to call him ours until he signs.
I know what you mean, right? Like, it was really weird when Colin Wilson, Jordan Schroeder, Kyle Palmieri, Alex Chiasson, Drew Shore, Nick Bjugstad, Brock Nelson, Justin Faulk, Jamie Oleksiak, J.T. Miller, Matthew Nieto, Jacob Trouba, Zegmus Girgensons, Stefan Matteau made the bizarre choice to actually sign with the teams who owned their rights, and totally blew off the chance to play meaningless hockey for an extra year or two in exchange for unrestricted free agency. Look at Justin Schultz, who is totally living the dream!
And how surprised were you when Nick Leddy opted to sign a contract with Chicago, thereby foregoing another two years of college and the chance to choose his destination?
And I can hardly wait for the Flames to pitch offers to T.J. Compher, Ian McCoshen and Michael Matheson in a few years. I mean, why would they ever choose to sign with the team who drafted them, when they could totally wait out a couple of years in college and signs with ANY team they want?
... This is getting stupid.
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Dealing with Everything from Dead Sea Scrolls to Red C Trolls
Quote:
Originally Posted by woob
"...harem warfare? like all your wives dressup and go paintballing?"
I'd be really hesitant to call him ours until he signs.
Do you sit around everyday worrying your GF is going to dump you?
The paranoia around Gaudreau signing is not justified by the history of college players in almost every case signing with the team that drafted them.
In fact there is more legitimate concern and history to support us not being able to sign our first rounder. That has happened once (Tom Erixon) and does happen occasionally with prospects. But even though there is more precedence and history for that happening it is silly to worry about that as well.
The Gaudreau nervous nellies should just keep it to themselves. It is extremely unlikely he doesn't sign here based on his comments, past history and the likelihood of him wanting to leave college after this season.
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The paranoia around Gaudreau signing is not justified by the history of college players in almost every case signing with the team that drafted them.
yup. I looked at that kind of thing in the summer out of interest and it showed that there really was no reason for paranoia. The only other player to "pull a Schultz" was Jason Gregoire ... to quote myself:
Quote:
In an attempt to "estimate the risk" of a college player refusing to sign, I decided to take a look at college-bound players taken in the NHL drafts between 2005 and 2009. This seemed like a good time frame - 2005 marks the beginning of the previous CBA and drafts later than 2009 are irrelevant for this exercise due to the four years of NCAA eligibility. I also decided to limit this exercise to the first three rounds of the drafts - mainly for time reasons, but also due to the fact that the number of busts is a lot higher in the later rounds and high-end players with enough options to forfeit a contract are pretty rare once you hit triple-digits. Excluded from the exercise is Scott Winkler, a Stars 3rd rounder from 2009 who sadly passed away last month. Here are the results:
Spoiler!
2005
1st round # 3 overall - CAR - D Jack Johnson - traded to Kings, signed there in 2007
1st round # 7 overall - CHI - F Jack Skille - signed with Blackhawks in 2007
1st round # 9 overall - OTT - D Brian Lee - signed with Senators in 2007
1st round #14 overall - WSH - D Sasha Pokulok - signed with Capitals in 2006
1st round #24 overall - STL - F T.J. Oshie - signed with Blues in 2008
1st round #25 overall - EDM - F Andrew Cogliano - signed with Oilers in 2007
1st round #27 overall - WSH - D Joe Finley - signed with Capitals in 2009
1st round #28 overall - MIN - D Matt Niskanen - signed with Stars in 2007
2nd round #34 overall - COL - F Ryan Stoa - signed with Avalanche in 2009
2nd round #36 overall - EDM - D Taylor Chorney - signed with Oilers in 2008
2nd round #38 overall - NJD - G Jeff Frazee - signed with Devils in 2008
2nd round #42 overall - DET - F Justin Abdelkader - signed with Red Wings in 2008
2nd round #44 overall - COL - F Paul Stastny - signed with Avalanche in 2006
2nd round #47 overall - COL - F Tom Fritsche - signed with Avalanche in 2008
2nd round #51 overall - VAN - F Mason Raymond - signed with Canucks in 2007
2nd round #53 overall - ATL - F Andrew Kozek - signed with Thrashers in 2009
2nd round #54 overall - CHI - F Dan Bertram - signed with Blackhawks in 2008
2nd round #58 overall - CAR - D Nate Hagemo - bust, never even played in AHL
2nd round #60 overall - LAK - D T.J. Fast - left college, traded to Blues and signed in 2008
2nd round #61 overall - PIT - D Michael Gergen - bust, never even played in AHL
3rd round #63 overall - ANA - F Jason Bailey - left college, signed with Ducks in 2008
3rd round #72 overall - LAK - G Jonathan Quick - signed with Kings in 2007
3rd round #76 overall - NYI - F Shea Guthrie - bust, never even played in AHL
3rd round #85 overall - STL - G Ben Bishop - signed with Blues in 2008
3rd round #86 overall - EDM - F Robby Dee - bust, only 3 AHL games
3rd round #88 overall - COL - F T.J. Hensick - signed with Avalanche in 2007
2006
1st round # 1 overall - STL - D Erik Johnson - signed with Blues in 2007
1st round # 3 overall - CHI - F Jonathan Toews - signed with Blackhawks in 2007
1st round # 5 overall - BOS - F Phil Kessel - signed with Bruins in 2006
1st round # 7 overall - NYI - F Kyle Okposo - signed with Islanders in 2008
1st round #19 overall - ANA - D Mark Mitera - signed with Ducks in 2009
1st round #20 overall - MTL - D David Fischer - bust, only 2 AHL games
1st round #29 overall - PHX - D Chris Summers - signed with Coyotes in 2010
2nd round #32 overall - PIT - D Carl Sneep - signed with Penguins in 2010
2nd round #39 overall - PHI - F Andreas Nodl - signed with Flyers in 2008
2nd round #42 overall - PHI - D Mike Ratchuk - signed with Flyers in 2008
2nd round #45 overall - EDM - D Jeff Petry - signed with Oilers in 2009
2nd round #52 overall - WSH - D Keith Seabrook - left college, traded to Flames and signed in 2009
2nd round #56 overall - NSH - F Blake Geoffrion - signed with Predators in 2010
2nd round #61 overall - CHI - D Simon Danis-Pepin - signed with Blackhawks in 2009
2nd round #63 overall - CAR - D Jamie McBain - signed with Hurricanes in 2009
3rd round #65 overall - PIT - D Brian Strait - signed with Penguins in 2009
3rd round #68 overall - OTT - D Eric Gryba - signed with Senators in 2010
3rd round #74 overall - LAK - G Jeff Zatkoff - signed with Kings in 2008
3rd round #78 overall - TBL - D Kevin Quick - signed with Lightning in 2008
3rd round #79 overall - PHI - F Jonathan Matsumoto - signed with Flyers in 2007
3rd round #80 overall - ATL - F Michael Forney - signed with Thrashers in 2009
3rd round #81 overall - COL - F Mike Carman - signed with Avalanche in 2010
3rd round #89 overall - CGY - F Aaron Marvin - bust, only 5 AHL games
2007
1st round # 2 overall - PHI - F James van Riemsdyk - signed with Flyers in 2009
1st round # 3 overall - PHX - F Kyle Turris - signed with Coyotes in 2008
1st round #12 overall - MTL - D Ryan McDonagh - traded to Rangers and signed in 2010
1st round #14 overall - COL - D Kevin Shattenkirk - signed with Avalanche in 2010
1st round #18 overall - STL - D Ian Cole - signed with Blues in 2010
1st round #21 overall - EDM - F Riley Nash - traded to Hurricanes and signed in 2010
1st round #22 overall - MTL - F Max Pacioretty - signed with Canadiens in 2008
1st round #25 overall - VAN - F Patrick White - bust, never played a pro game in NA
1st round #27 overall - DET - D Brendan Smith - signed with Red Wings in 2010
1st round #28 overall - SJS - D Nick Petrecki - signed with Sharks in 2009
1st round #29 overall - OTT - F Jim O'Brien - left college, signed with Senators in 2009
2nd round #35 overall - BOS - D Tommy Cross - signed with Bruins in 2012
2nd round #38 overall - CHI - F Bill Sweatt - didn't sign with Chicago, latersigned with Canucks in 2010
2nd round #44 overall - STL - F Aaron Palushaj - signed with Blues in 2009
2nd round #45 overall - COL - D Colby Cohen - signed with Avalanche in 2010
2nd round #46 overall - WSH - D Theo Ruth - traded to Blue Jackets and signed in 2010
2nd round #50 overall - DAL - F Nico Sacchetti - bust, never played a pro game in NA
2nd round #53 overall - CBJ - D Will Weber - signed with Blue Jackets in 2012
2nd round #55 overall - COL - F T.J. Galiardi - left college, signed with Avalanche in 2008
2nd round #57 overall - NJD - F Mike Hoeffel - signed with Devils in 2011
3rd round #68 overall - CBJ - F Jake Hansen - signed with Blue Jackets in 2012
3rd round #76 overall - NYI - F Jason Gregoire - used "Schultz loophole", signed with Jets in 2011
3rd round #77 overall - TBL - F Alexander Killorn - signed with Lightning in 2012
3rd round #81 overall - NSH - F Ryan Thang - signed with Predators in 2010
3rd round #84 overall - WSH - F Philip DeSimone - was not signed, is on AHL deals since then
3rd round #87 overall - NJD - D Corbin McPherson - signed with Devils in 2012
3rd round #89 overall - BUF - F Corey Tropp - signed with Sabres in 2010
3rd round #90 overall - OTT - F Louie Caporusso - signed with Senators in 2011 2008
1st round # 7 overall - NSH - F Colin Wilson - signed with Predators in 2009
1st round #16 overall - BOS - F Joe Colborne - signed with Bruins in 2010
1st round #17 overall - ANA - D Jake Gardiner - traded to Maple Leafs and signed in 2011
1st round #29 overall - ATL - F Daultan Leveille - was not signed, is on an AHL deal since then
2nd round #36 overall - NYI - F Corey Trivino - was not signed, is in ECHL since then
2nd round #37 overall - CBJ - D Cody Goloubef - signed with Blue Jackets in 2010
2nd round #40 overall - NYI - D Aaron Ness - signed with Islanders in 2011
2nd round #42 overall - OTT - D Patrick Wiercioch - signed with Senators in 2010
2nd round #43 overall - ANA - D Justin Schultz - used "Schultz loophole", signed with Oilers in 2012
2nd round #45 overall - CAR - F Zac Dalpe - signed with Hurricanes in 2010
2nd round #51 overall - NYR - F Derek Stepan - signed with Rangers in 2010
2nd round #52 overall - NJD - D Brandon Burlon - signed with Devils in 2011
2nd round #56 overall - MTL - F Danny Kristo - signed with Canadiens in 2013
2nd round #60 overall - CHI - F Jimmy Hayes - signed with Blackhawks in 2011
3rd round #62 overall - SJS - F Justin Daniels - bust, never even played in the AHL
3rd round #63 overall - LAK - F Robbie Czarnik - left college, signed with Kings in 2011
3rd round #66 overall - NYI - F David Toews - left college, never signed, only 2 AHL games
3rd round #81 overall - BUF - D Corey Fienhage - left college, signed with Sabres in 2011
3rd round #86 overall - MTL - F Steve Quailer - signed with Canadiens in 2012
3rd round #91 overall - DET - D Max Nicastro - signed with Red Wings in 2012
2009
1st round #16 overall - MIN - D Nick Leddy - traded to Blackhawks and signed in 2010
1st round #18 overall - MTL - F Louis Leblanc - left college, signed with Canadiens in 2011
1st round #19 overall - NYR - F Chris Kreider - signed with Rangers in 2012
1st round #22 overall - VAN - F Jordan Schroeder - signed with Canucks in 2010
1st round #26 overall - ANA - F Kyle Palmieri - signed with Ducks in 2010
1st round #28 overall - CHI - D Dylan Olsen - signed with Blackhawks in 2010
2nd round #36 overall - PHX - F Chris Brown - signed with Coyotes in 2012
2nd round #38 overall - DAL - F Alex Chiasson - signed with Stars in 2012
2nd round #41 overall - NSH - F Zach Budish - signed with Predators in 2013
2nd round #43 overall - SJS - D William Wrenn - left college, never signed
2nd round #44 overall - FLA - F Drew Shore - signed with Panthers in 2012
2nd round #51 overall - CAR - D Brian Dumoulin - signed with Hurricanes in 2012
2nd round #56 overall - CBJ - F Kevin Lynch - not signed yet, deadline August 15
2nd round #61 overall - PIT - D Philip Samuelsson - signed with Penguins in 2011
3rd round #63 overall - PIT - F Ben Hanowski - traded to Calgary and signed in 2013
3rd round #67 overall - FLA - F Josh Birkholz - only signed to AHL deal
3rd round #69 overall - DAL - F Reilly Smith - signed with Stars in 2012
3rd round #79 overall - MTL - D Mac Bennett - goes back to college for his senior year
3rd round #83 overall - VAN - D Kevin Connauton - left college, signed with Canucks in 2010
3rd round #89 overall - CHI - F Daniel Delisle - not signed yet, deadline August 15
3rd round #91 overall - PHX - G Mike Lee - signed with Coyotes in 2012
118 players total
88 players signed an ELC with the team they were drafted by = 74,6 %
9 players were traded and signed an ELC with another NHL team = 7,6 %
3 players are still NCAA eligible/rights until August 15 = 2,5 %
2 players used the "Schultz loophole" = 1,7 %
16 players didn't sign with their original team/"busts" = 13,6 %
As for these 118 players, we can see that 3 out of 4 college prospects signed with the team that drafted them. Please note that except for Bill Sweatt, none of the 16 players that didn't sign or weren't offered an ELC has since signed with an NHL team - most of them have retired, defected to Europe or settled for a journeyman career in the AHL and ECHL.
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actually, that is one thing that you can most definitely teach
Of course you can teach anything but it sure helps if a player has that natural intuition.
In Johnny's case, he's not playing CHL or AHL and you can't deny that he's driving to the net more already than quite a few current Flames roster players.
actually, that is one thing that you can most definitely teach
Flames have had some really bad teachers over the past few years because no one on the Flames can do this regularly.
Monahan is probably the only guy who drives the net consistently and he hasn't really been "taught" by the Flames.
Probably the most frustrating thing for me as a Flames fan, is the reluctance of the forwards to drive the net. The top teams all do it, yet the Flames rarely ever do it. It's all about being tough, and paying the price and taking the punishment that comes with it, and the Flames don't do it, because the players here are not tough enough to do it.
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Calgary Flames, PLEASE GO TO THE NET! AND SHOOT THE PUCK! GENERATING OFFENSE IS NOT DIFFICULT! SKATE HARD, SHOOT HARD, CRASH THE NET HARD!
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It's hard to drive to the net if you're also trying to avoid open ice giveaways by sticking to moving up by the boards. Which is what teams that can't hockey so good tend to do.
Also, being skilled with the puck helps enormously, otherwise you again end up giving the puck away or just losing control of it. (Because there's usually someone trying to stop you from driving to the net.) And having confidence. Which comes with winning more than losing.
Of course it's not the whole reason, but I think it's part of the reason.
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