Black teen shot and killed by neighborhood watch in Orlando gated community

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

The fact that Zimmerman's injuries were mostly superficial and all the inconsistencies and blatant lies that are in Zimmerman's story makes me feel that he's guilty.

The injuries are the injuries. And the prosecution has been just as bad in redirecting and on top of that putting witnesses on the stand that contradict the case that they're trying to prove.

Neither side is great.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by T@T

Prosecution comes off it's 2nd degree murder only and asked judge to consider manslaughter and 3rd degree felony murder(child abuse resulting in death)

Judge just told Jurors they can convict him of manslaughter or 2nd degree murder...defense not happy.

That's a judge feeling political pressure to get a conviction.

Certainly opens the grounds on an appeal if convicted.

I have my doubts that they can even get manslaughter in the face of the Self Defense defense.

It all depends on the jury.

[Caged Great]

Another thing I would have argued was what about Travon's right to stand his ground. He is just heading home when this guy just randomly confronts him in an unusual way. Is it not justified for him to defend himself from a threat like that.

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Another thing I would have argued was what about Travon's right to stand his ground. He is just heading home when this guy just randomly confronts him in an unusual way. Is it not justified for him to defend himself from a threat like that.

The prosecution has presented no evidence at all that George Zimmerman approached and confronted Trayvon Martin.

The only eyewitness account is from George Zimmerman who says he was approached and confronted by Trayvon Martin.

But let's for a moment say Zimmerman did approach and confront Martin . . . . .

There's a moment in the Zimmerman trial where defence lawyer O'Mara asks the lead detective in the case a series of questions which, paraphrased, sounded something like this:

O'Mara - "Detective, is it illegal to be suspicious of someone?"

Detective Sorino: "Not to my knowledge sir."

O'Mara - "Detective, is it illegal to follow someone?"

Sorino - "Not to my knowledge."

O'Mara - "Is it illegal to approach someone and talk to them?"

Sorino - "Not to my knowledge sir"

O'Mara - "Is it illegal to follow someone, approach them and ask them what they are doing in your neighbourhood?"

Sorino - "Not to my knowledge sir."

Case in point. I live at the end of a dead-end road on my country acreage. There are two other residences behind me or further up the hill above me and a turn-around for the school-bus. The view is rather fantastic so periodically people will drive up our dead-end road and park for a few minutes, overlooking my house. Hunters also park there in season.

If some teenage males in hoodies in a half ton linger on the turnaround in their vehicle, overlooking my house, am I committing a crime by 1) being suspicious they MIGHT be scoping my house for a later nocturnal visit and 2) have I committed a crime if I were to walk up to their vehicle, knock on their window and ask them why they are parked there?

Yes or no to those two questions.

Again, the prosecution has presented zero evidence confirming George Zimmerman walked up to Trayvon Martin and asked him what he was doing in the neighbourhood. The only confirmation we have is that Zimmerman followed Martin for a while.

The prosecution has also deliberately avoided the use of the term "racial profiling." Both sides concede Zimmerman profiled Martin as a potential thief.

Cowperson

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Another thing I would have argued was what about Travon's right to stand his ground. He is just heading home when this guy just randomly confronts him in an unusual way. Is it not justified for him to defend himself from a threat like that.

That's what at issue in this case.

The stand your ground law allows you to defend your position without the duty to look for or attempt a retreat. If Zimmerman was asking Martin what he was doing or following him, that wouldn't invoke the stand your ground law. If Zimmerman approached him and threatened him, then potentially yes.

If Zimmerman approached him and then retreated, even if he'd threatened or assaulted him first, then the stand your ground law would not apply.

In the end, like Cowperson has alluded to, it's up to the prosecution to prove their case and the standard is Beyond A Reasonable Doubt. In order to prove their case they need to show evidence. They need to prove that Zimmerman was the aggresor all along. The defence doesn't even need to show a stale mate, they just need to cast some reasonable doubt.

That being said, Zimmerman also needs to prove his defence. He did, in fact, kill Martin. It's now up to him to prove he was lawfully entitled to do so. His testimony alone as the "only eye witness", may not hold much weight. It's not as simple as an accussed getting on the stand and saying they didn't do it.

[Minnie]

Friend just said a verdict has been reached.

[jar_e]

CNN confirms that, verdict has been reached, should be read within the next hour.

[Senator Clay Davis]

A verdict in primetime? CNN just came.

[Minnie]

Not guilty

[Senator Clay Davis]

Not guilty...should be an interesting night.

[Caged Great]

Total bs

[Senator Clay Davis]

Civil suit coming no doubt.

[Acey]

Well that's a bit disappointing. Somebody should riot.

[Flabbibulin]

Originally Posted by Acey

Well that's a bit disappointing. Somebody should riot.

Maybe they should riot over the hundreds or thousands of young black men that are murdered every year in the US.

I agree that a man shouldnt be able to just kill an unarmed and innocent individual without facing some form of jail time- regardless of the circumstances.

[taco.vidal]

Correct conclusion by the jury based on the case presented by the prosecution.

Although Trayvon is dead, Zimmerman's life also won't be the same and likely it will be hard for him to return to any sense of normalcy.

[Acey]

Originally Posted by taco.vidal

Although Trayvon is dead, Zimmerman's life also won't be the same and likely it will be hard for him to return to any sense of normalcy.

One of those seems quite a bit worse than the other.

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

Maybe they should riot over the hundreds or thousands of young black men that are murdered every year in the US.

They probably should.

[TurnedTheCorner]

[Oling_Roachinen]

Based on that mockery of a trial anything less than not guilty would be an incredible joke.

Now to go after the prosecutors who broke the law and kept evidence out of the defense hand. Especially despicable that they fired the "whistleblower" who only wanted to follow the law.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Florida cannot find a good prosecutor to save their lives it seems. Bungled prosecution from the beginning.

[Acey]

Lovely jury selection as well. He pretty much had no chance. Too damn hot in Florida to wear a hood anyway, God forbid I ever have to set foot in that state again I'll wear a "not Chris Dorner" shirt and paint my face white.