Future of Panthers in Miami

[troutman]

Panthers’ record-low attendance clouds hockey’s future in South Florida

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nh...le3073133.html

By the time the game ended — the Panthers lost 1-0 — the team had confirmed everyone’s suspicions: The number of tickets sold (7,311) was the fewest in franchise history, shattering the old record by 2,752. And the number of people actually in attendance was 1,000 or so fewer than that, according to estimates.

For the first time, the Panthers have stopped distributing free and discounted tickets to games, a strategy that boosted attendance significantly in past years but also, according to the owners, devalued the product and angered season-ticket holders.

That means small crowds could become the norm.

The sharp drop in fans — only 11,419 attended the home opener on a Saturday night against New Jersey — comes at the same time the Panthers have asked the Broward County Commission to give them a $78.4 million bailout — a break the team says it needs to curtail losses of $100,000 a day.

“We are not moving. We have no plans or intentions to move the team anywhere,” Panthers co-owner Doug Cifu said last week.

County Mayor Barbara Sharief said the team’s arena lease — which runs for another 14 seasons — does not include an “out” clause. But Commissioner Martin Kiar said the Panthers could leave at any time if they agree to cover their remaining debt payments, currently $63 million.


Florida Panthers’ owners vow to not move team (9/18/14)

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nh...le2147935.html

[troutman]

NHL Attendance:

http://espn.go.com/nhl/attendance

Wow, Ducks averaging only 7,843 for first two home games. AZ not included in rankings?

[Cali Panthers Fan]

They aren't going anywhere right now, you can be sure of that. Could it happen in the future? Very possibly.

The fans are tired of watching a losing team, that's all. Honestly, in my experiences talking with people, there's enough support there if they just iced a team that was competitive year in and year out. Having 1 year in the playoffs in nearly 20 years is not good enough. No fan base can survive those kinds of results. This is why teams like Atlanta moved away, but Nashville is going strong. If Tampa Bay can be successful in Florida, why can't the Panthers? Results matter, and it's hard to convince people to spend not only their money on games, but their time and effort. There are lots of things to do in South Florida all throughout the winter, and hockey is just another entertainment option. The owners realize they're in a competitive market and are trying to ice a better team, but as we all know it's hard to turn around a bottom 3 team overnight.

The finances will work themselves out if the fans just start showing up. The freebies are gone and the ownership is sticking to that. Good, because all it does is devalue the product if you can get it for free, or very nearly free. There are enough fans from those years of freebies that if the Panthers get the on-ice product worked out they'll come back and willingly pay to support the team.

However, I will say, that the team can use the awful attendance optics to justify moving the team if it never improves. That's the one thing I worry about.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by troutman

NHL Attendance:

http://espn.go.com/nhl/attendance

Wow, Ducks averaging only 7,843 for first two home games. AZ not included in rankings?

ESPN has that screwed up far more than usual. The Ducks posted attendance figures of 17,306 for their home opener (sellout) and 15,687 for game 2. Their average is actually 16,498.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

The fans are tired of watching a losing team, that's all.

I doubt it is that simple. Miami is not supporting any of its teams, and hockey is not a deeply-rooted sport.

Marlins 27th in MLB:

http://espn.go.com/mlb/attendance

[Resolute 14]

^In defence of Miami fans, the Marlins situation is about 4.8x more effed up than the Panthers. I certainly wouldn't support the carpetbagger Loria if he owned the Flames.

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

However, I will say, that the team can use the awful attendance optics to justify moving the team if it never improves. That's the one thing I worry about.

Approves

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally Posted by troutman

I doubt it is that simple. Miami is not supporting any of its teams, and hockey is not a deeply-rooted sport.

Marlins 27th in MLB:

http://espn.go.com/mlb/attendance

I have a lot of family in Flordia and they tell me that the only thing folks care about is going to the beach.

Florida is a bad sports market.

[Ozy_Flame]

... And yet two MLS teams are going in to Florida in the next 2-3 years (Orlando and Miami).

I hope Beckham has a good chunk of bail-out money on hand.

[troutman]

MLS could do well in FLA with the Hispanic community.

Miami 70% Hispanic:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami

[sureLoss]

Elliott Friedman touched on the topic in his last 30 thoughts.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/3...-wrong-reason/

He said that the Panthers have stopped giving away free tickets and crazy cheap ticket promotions.

[Puppet Guy]

obligatory "Edmonton deserves an NHL team" post.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by troutman

MLS could do well in FLA with the Hispanic community.

Worked for Chivas USA.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by troutman

MLS could do well in FLA with the Hispanic community.

Miami 70% Hispanic:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami

If the Dolphins and Marlins are having dismal attendance numbers, I don't see any positive sign that soccer is going to fare much better.

[polak]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

... And yet two MLS teams are going in to Florida in the next 2-3 years (Orlando and Miami).

I hope Beckham has a good chunk of bail-out money on hand.

Immigrant population will take care of that. MLS tickets will be cheaper as well.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Miami is either tied with or slightly ahead of Los Angeles in terms on frontrunning sports towns. In both towns only 1 team actually matters (the Lakers and Dolphins, respectively), and even then those teams only matter when good. Unfortunately those cities and cities like that have beautiful weather all year, so they have a plethora of free or cheap activities in the sun. Why spend time in a dark arena watching a loser?

[devo22]

Originally Posted by troutman

I doubt it is that simple.

personally I do think it's that simple. Just take a look at the Lightning attendance:

http://www.hockeydb.com/nhl-attendan...h.php?tmi=8385

attendance exploded up to 20k after their SC win, then dropped back to 15k after two years without playoffs, then went back to 18-19k after their deep playoff run in 2011. I think the formula to survive in non-traditional hockey markets is nothing more than icing a good product - that's why Tampa and the California teams have survived and teams like Atlanta didn't.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Worked for Chivas USA.

Chivas is an interesting case. Basically a subsidiary of a Mexican pro team. Attendance is poor, but they may only be of interest to Mexican-Americans?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chivas_USA

LA Galaxy is better attended:

http://mlsattendance.blogspot.ca/

[Ozy_Flame]

Chivas is a 2nd-tier team of C.D. Guadalajara, originally designed to provide feeder support to one of the most popular teams in Liga MX. It has a distinctly Mexican flavour for a market that is targeted Hispanic/Mexican Californians. Many of their supporters are sattelite supporters of C.D. Guadalajara.

I don't think the same relationship exists for either of the new Florida franchises. However, bringing in a guy like Kaka is probably a good start to attract the Hispanic / South American crowds.

[Ozy_Flame]

By the way, Chivas USA is expected to cease operations and go dormant for two years.

"Perennially last in attendance and outside the playoff picture, Chivas USA could never shake the reputation of the second banana. Starting play in 2004 as an MLS outpost of C.D. Guadalajara, it never found the success nor the fanbase of its Mexican parent club, nor the attention from owner Jorge Vergara. It was a distant second in popularity to the Galaxy in Los Angeles and even in its own arena."

http://screamer.deadspin.com/report-...usa-1640473643

[the_only_turek_fan]

....