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View Poll Results: Do you feel not using public funds is worth the Flames moving?
Yes 160 33.33%
No 320 66.67%
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Old 02-08-2017, 11:33 AM   #41
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I hope thats what they name it.

"Plan B Arena"
Anything that keeps CalgaryNEXT from being born sounds about right.
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Old 02-08-2017, 11:48 AM   #42
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What is a "Youth Campus" exactly?
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Old 02-08-2017, 11:50 AM   #43
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What is a "Youth Campus" exactly?
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Old 02-08-2017, 11:53 AM   #44
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Here's my refreshed updated plan:



Closest precedent would be the Petco Park (San Diego) district:

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Old 02-08-2017, 11:59 AM   #45
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What is a "Youth Campus" exactly?
http://corporate.calgarystampede.com...t/youth-campus
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:00 PM   #46
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Size of an NHL ice surface is 200 feet (61 m) × 85 feet (26 m).

Size of a CFL field is 150 yards (137 m) long and 65 yards (59 m) wide. More than twice the length and twice the width.

There's a reason why the sightlines were horrible when they had the Heritage Classic at McMahon...
I was aware of the size differences but based on some stuff we are seeing out of new stadiums I assumed some sort of retractable seats would be possible. Not to mention the worst sightlines in a football stadium are the seats near field level.
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:03 PM   #47
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Remove the Youth Campus and put in a new Stadium.
Guys - Stadium has to be north of 12th Ave to get it out of Stampede Lands.
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:05 PM   #48
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Guys - Stadium has to be north of 12th Ave to get it out of Stampede Lands.
No, I am almost certain it will be on Stampede because the City can give them that land. All the land north of 12th (except the bus barns) is privately held and is very, very unlikely to be used for an arena.
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:10 PM   #49
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No, I am almost certain it will be on Stampede because the City can give them that land. All the land north of 12th (except the bus barns) is privately held and is very, very unlikely to be used for an arena.
Well OK - as long as CSE owns the lands eventually, fine. But they will not lease land from the Stampede again like they do now for the Saddledome. But we'll just have to see the full CMLC plan once they release it - should be interesting.

As a side note - here's the youth campus you refer to in your diagram:

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Old 02-08-2017, 12:13 PM   #50
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It'd almost be a miss to have two ctrain stations in close but no cigar range. I'm sure we're all veterans of that odd walk from Victoria Park Station to the Saddledome and it never fails to make me chuckle what an oddity it is. Outside, inside, outside, overwalk that does nothing but create a wind tunnel.

Just some random thoughts. Getting the Greenline LRT and the new Stadium to sync is a must IMO.
It's the LRT signature... close to everything, but not actually AT anything. Chinook Centre, University, Saddledome...
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:15 PM   #51
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Oh - and also there is talk of a 17th ave crossing being part of their plan - so that has to be accounted for in any diagrams. Here's the current bullet points from CMLC site:

The improvements we intend to tackle include (among others):
  • Extension of 17th Avenue SE into Stampede Park, providing a pedestrian and vehicular link to increase connectivity and create an attractive right of way for new retail and commercial development
  • Extension of RiverWalk, our much-celebrated riverside promenade
  • Planning, design and a development strategy for the ‘Stampede Trail’ retail and public realm program along 4th Street SE
  • Associated streetscape interfaces for the new Green Line LRT line
  • Extensions of Cycle Tracks program
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:16 PM   #52
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Well OK - as long as CSE owns the lands eventually, fine. But they will not lease land from the Stampede again like they do now for the Saddledome. But we'll just have to see the full CMLC plan once they release it - should be interesting.

As a side note - here's the youth campus you refer to in your diagram:

Lots of construction work being done currently on Youth Campus part at 14th Avenue and 6th Street SE, https://www.google.ca/maps/@51.03931...2!8i6656?hl=en
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:18 PM   #53
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I was aware of the size differences but based on some stuff we are seeing out of new stadiums I assumed some sort of retractable seats would be possible. Not to mention the worst sightlines in a football stadium are the seats near field level.
Even with retractable seats, I don't think the geometry would work out.

Someone mentioned Syracuse University -- they basically have a football stadium but cut it in half to do basketball games:



Given that the priority is on hockey (versus football), I can't see it working with all of the luxury boxes and premium seating you would lose.
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:19 PM   #54
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In all seriousness - this is all great news. So much potential to build this area into something awesome. CMLC is also highly capable of pulling this off really well.

I'd like to see a district anchored by the arena and a large farmer's market (fits with Stampede's mandate and helps make it a year round denstination) - supported by retail, restaurants and bars, improved streets and public spaces, high density residential as well as the Green Line LRT.
Adding a farmers' market is such a good idea. Make it huge. That would make the area so much better and as you've said provide year around use.

Even something similar to what's happening near Cross-Iron Mills with the asian market concept (ownership issues aside, you would only lease) would be a great location for small vendors to congregate and offer goods.
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:22 PM   #55
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It's the LRT signature... close to everything, but not actually AT anything. Chinook Centre, University, Saddledome...
And stretches to each end of the city. Cost effective but slightly less efficient. But the proof is in the per capita usage numbers which are world class.
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:22 PM   #56
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Remove the Youth Campus and put in a new Stadium.
It's already under construction irl.
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:30 PM   #57
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Oh - and also there is talk of a 17th ave crossing being part of their plan - so that has to be accounted for in any diagrams.
Here's two diagrams I found that show 17th ave potential crossing:

2009 BKDI Plan:



2009 Stampede Master Plan:

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Old 02-08-2017, 12:32 PM   #58
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It's the LRT signature... close to everything, but not actually AT anything. Chinook Centre, University, Saddledome...
They put all their efforts into SAIT/Acad/Jubilee station apparently.
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Old 02-08-2017, 12:51 PM   #59
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The 17th Avenue extension across the LRT tracks is a horrible idea. 25th Avenue is already a disaster, why create another level crossing where a bunch of dummies are going to get hit and killed?
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Old 02-08-2017, 01:05 PM   #60
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Whatever design they choose I just hope the new arena has an LRT station that's actually close. The current walk from the dome to Victoria station is a joke. I think Vancouver has a skytrain station/Costco right next to their arena, not sure about Edmonton's new arena
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