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Old 06-16-2017, 12:11 AM   #21
TheAlpineOracle
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What a load of crap. Completing ignoring te fact that Kings are old and slow, their management doesn't see an issue with the fact that a 40 year old transplant had to fight the battles of 28 year old d man who isn't man enough to settle the score with a 19 year old rookie themselves?

Should probably resign Iggy, and go after Chris Neil and Shane Doan in free agency. That will get them right back in it!

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Old 06-16-2017, 12:41 AM   #22
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Kings sold their souls to win 2 cups. Any team would do that, including the Flames. They don't have a farm system like the Hawks to keep it going though. And for those 2 cups, they had to pay the guys who got them there. Brown, Kopitar, Gaborik, etc. All on huge ugly contracts which are ''reward'' contracts. Toews and Kane got the same. Nasty deals, but you reward your core for bringing you the Cup. You sell your soul for ultimate glory, and now the Kings are paying the price.
Exactly. The Kings exchanged a lot of long-term pain for short-term gain. And won two Cups. Mission accomplished. Now they`re paying the price.
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Old 06-16-2017, 01:13 AM   #23
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I do think that the reasoning outlined surely contributed to their lack of success, but there were probably other underlying reasons as well. Yes, I would agree that Jarome definitely brought an element to that team that was missing, but that team probably suffered more from a lack of skill and speed overall (they had both before) and were a team with too many over-priced players.

In the cap era, your team is only as good as how they play to the cap. Over-priced teams don't play up to their cap hits, great teams exceed them. They simply didn't have enough depth with the departure of guys like Richards, Williams, Voynov, etc., and became an older, slower and less skilled team overall. Leadership can only help so much.

Flames had a much younger and better player in Iginla for a while, and say what you will about his leadership, but he was recognized for that leadership and he was not able to take the Flames anywhere after the 2004 run. The Flames had an old, slow and not skilled enough team either during those missed years in 2010. No amount of leadership could get those teams over the hump, and I would say the Flames didn't suffer for leadership with guys like Regehr, Iginla, Langkow, etc.

The Kings this past season didn't have that 'moxie' or swagger that they had in the past, but I think it was lost just as much from a lack of skill and belief in themselves as a lack of leadership.
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Old 06-16-2017, 02:05 AM   #24
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Kings sold their souls to win 2 cups. Any team would do that, including the Flames. They don't have a farm system like the Hawks to keep it going though. And for those 2 cups, they had to pay the guys who got them there. Brown, Kopitar, Gaborik, etc. All on huge ugly contracts which are ''reward'' contracts. Toews and Kane got the same. Nasty deals, but you reward your core for bringing you the Cup. You sell your soul for ultimate glory, and now the Kings are paying the price.
Nailed it. But what are the Hawks doing on the farm that nobody else can seem to replicate?
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Old 06-16-2017, 03:53 AM   #25
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Nailed it. But what are the Hawks doing on the farm that nobody else can seem to replicate?
I think they just got luckier for the most part.

It's not like the Hawks have drafted a bunch of stars recently. Nearly all the main players for them were drafted before they started winning Cups. Their draft years 2002-2005 really set them up flush with assets before they hit lottery on Kane and Toews.

Since 2007, the best player they have drafted is Saad. He's a good player, but his career high is 53 points. Shaw and Kruger are just depth guys. Is Teravainen going to break out? Hard to say.

The thing that sustained the Hawks the most is that their core all aged gracefully. None of their big 6 suffered premature drops in play.

This meant that the Hawks never had to scramble to fill any major holes. They traded off all of the minor talent and ended up drafting more often than a lot of rebuilding teams in the top rounds of the draft.The year they won their first Cup they had 4 second round picks. Ridiculous.

Compare that to LA.

Brown signed a big contract at the age of 26. coming off like 4-5 50+ point seasons. His production just completely tanked over the next two seasons.

Mike Richards was done in the NHL at 29.

Voynov got kicked out of the country for being a garbage human being.

Three big parts of LA's core just bit the dust one after another. Who could have predicted any of that?

That's some bad luck IMO.
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Old 06-16-2017, 07:43 AM   #26
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It's one of many problems the Kings have/had.

Maybe not the most important one though.

I said at the time, why is Iginla doing this? Ridiculous.
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Old 06-16-2017, 08:18 AM   #27
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Bring back Richards!??
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Old 06-16-2017, 08:30 AM   #28
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Great post Oil Stain.

I would also add that the Hawks supporting cast, which has turned over significantly between the cup years, was always much better than that of the Kings.
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Old 06-16-2017, 10:40 AM   #29
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All I take away from this is that they're still trying to find an answer for Matthew Tkachuk
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Old 06-16-2017, 12:09 PM   #30
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Let's see, King's way to Stanley Cup is to just barely make it into the playoffs. Then, there's that McDavid Sweepstakes and I truly believe that a whole bunch of teams are thinking the same thing. And basically, they played the usual Sutter defensive game through the whole season to just sneak into the playoffs where they're pretty much guaranteed to make it through to at least the 3rd round of the playoffs. Heck, that's better than what the Flames had done since 2013. So, what're they complaining about when they've won 2 championships in the last 6 years?
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Old 06-16-2017, 11:38 PM   #31
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I'd say if Richards had not been a druggy and kept playing, he would be a sureshot hall of famer. The guy's resume is actually so insane, few players will ever match it.

-- Memorial Cup winner
-- OHL champ
-- AHL champ
-- WJC champ
-- Olympic Gold
-- 2X Lord Stanley
-- 136 NHL post season games
-- 750 NHL games (scoring at a 0.65 ppg clip)
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Old 06-17-2017, 12:09 AM   #32
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I'd say if Richards had not been a druggy and kept playing, he would be a sureshot hall of famer. The guy's resume is actually so insane, few players will ever match it.

-- Memorial Cup winner
-- OHL champ
-- AHL champ
-- WJC champ
-- Olympic Gold
-- 2X Lord Stanley
-- 136 NHL post season games
-- 750 NHL games (scoring at a 0.65 ppg clip)
I don't think he would have finishes anywhere near the point requirements to make the hall of fame even if his play didn't fall off a cliff.
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Old 06-17-2017, 09:58 AM   #33
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I agree with Oil Stain that the Kings have had some serious bad luck since the last cup.

But if we're comparing the Hawks, we have to include the fact that they have been able to entice outside-the-NHL free agents to join their team on what seems like an annual basis. Over the last half dozen years or so, Chicago has attracted more players - in both quantity and quality - than the rest of the league combines, it seems.

Being able to do that regularly has been like having an additional first round pick every year.

The other thing that it has done for them is that the additional players coming in has allowed them to trade away older players that would have been more expensive. This has enabled them to be able to avoid the cap troubles that the Kings, and every great team, have faced.
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Old 06-17-2017, 10:01 AM   #34
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Toffoli for Brouwer E5!
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Old 06-17-2017, 08:07 PM   #35
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Slava Voynov.
Isn't he guy who got charged for domestic violence against his wife? He was actually a good solid defenseman. Too bad he's got an anger problem.
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Old 06-19-2017, 11:37 AM   #36
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Lots of love for Richards and Stoll. Makes me think flames fans underappreciate Matt Stajan.
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Old 06-19-2017, 12:01 PM   #37
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LA Kings take 3 years to identify problems.

Ken King takes +10 years.
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