City of Calgary converting all school zones into playground zones

[Ashartus]

I've heard several municipalities, especially in Ontario, have been lowering their residential speed limits across the board to 40 or even 30 kph, and there's a group pushing for it in Calgary - I'm guessing no one posting in this thread is part of that movement.

[Five-hole]

Originally Posted by Locke

The City should make some money by selling 'Playground Zone Exemption Passes.'

It could be a really shiny pass that you hang on your mirror so everyone can see it and then you could blow through Playground Zones with impunity!

Isn't that exactly what a speeding ticket is? Except you only have to pay for it occasionally?

I think of photo radar tickets as "inconsistently applied fees for the ability to drive faster than everyone else". Makes me less pissed when I get two in the same fricking place a few weeks apart.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Five-hole

Isn't that exactly what a speeding ticket is? Except you only have to pay for it occasionally?

I think of photo radar tickets as "inconsistently applied fees for the ability to drive faster than everyone else". Makes me less pissed when I get two in the same fricking place a few weeks apart.

Yep. I refer to the occasional speeding ticket I get as my "go fast tax".

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by Ashartus

I've heard several municipalities, especially in Ontario, have been lowering their residential speed limits across the board to 40 or even 30 kph, and there's a group pushing for it in Calgary - I'm guessing no one posting in this thread is part of that movement.

Is there any studies on whether this works? I find I need more concentration on the speedometer to keep a car at 30 or 40 km/h than it is to keep it at 50 km/h. It's so slow that you have to consciously try to keep it that low. Seems kind of counter productive to me IMO.

[Drummer]

Originally Posted by Ashartus

I've heard several municipalities, especially in Ontario, have been lowering their residential speed limits across the board to 40 or even 30 kph, and there's a group pushing for it in Calgary - I'm guessing no one posting in this thread is part of that movement.

Banff lowered the speed limit from 50 to 40 about two years ago.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

Is there any studies on whether this works? I find I need more concentration on the speedometer to keep a car at 30 or 40 km/h than it is to keep it at 50 km/h. It's so slow that you have to consciously try to keep it that low. Seems kind of counter productive to me IMO.

Depends on the street. 50 may feel comfortable on the broad boulevards. But on most residential streets, with cars parked on either side, I rarely do over 40 or so anyway. And let's be honest - 40 would mean 50 in practice. Just as 50 means lots of people are doing 60 in residential areas already.

[GGG]

I haven't seen studi s that show reduced collisions but there are many studies that show reduced harm from collisions. There is an inflection point on the injury curve at 30k where the seriousness and rate of fatalities increases greatly. So speed limit at 30 people drive 40 and hit kids at 30 and kids live.

I prefer real traffic calming that doesn't rely on compliance to work like boulevards and narrow streets as and this is speculation that inattentive people are more likely to ignore speed changes and also the group more likely to hit kids

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by GGG

I haven't seen studi s that show reduced collisions but there are many studies that show reduced harm from collisions. There is an inflection point on the injury curve at 30k where the seriousness and rate of fatalities increases greatly. So speed limit at 30 people drive 40 and hit kids at 30 and kids live.

I prefer real traffic calming that doesn't rely on compliance to work like boulevards and narrow streets as and this is speculation that inattentive people are more likely to ignore speed changes and also the group more likely to hit kids

100% agreed. Put whatever you want on the sign, people will drive what they're comfortable with. There's plenty of neighborhood roads that are 50 that many never exceed 30 on, and vice versa. Design the roads properly and you wouldn't need to implement half assed measures like this

[Addick]

I have to agree, proper design over new signs.

[WhiteTiger]

This was posted to the CPS FB page a bit earlier. They clarified in the comments that it was from about 3-4 school zones that they were specifically watching, but that it doesn't cover ALL tickets issued today in relation to school zones.

[KelVarnsen]

Any CP members get busted today?

[zamler]

I am not a fan of the cash grab policy but 67 in a 30 in unforgivable.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by btimbit

100% agreed. Put whatever you want on the sign, people will drive what they're comfortable with. There's plenty of neighborhood roads that are 50 that many never exceed 30 on, and vice versa. Design the roads properly and you wouldn't need to implement half assed measures like this

The problem with what people think they can drive comfortably with is not always accurate.
EDIT: ^^^I'm leaving this here but holy hell is that a poorly worded sentence. Quite possibly the most poorly constructed sentence in my life - which is why I'm keeping it there.

Honestly this shaves mere moments off your drive. I don't see the big deal.

[4X4]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Honestly this shaves mere moments off your drive. I don't see the big deal.

As a fan of playground zones, this might be the wrong thread to point this out, but "mere moments" isn't the whole picture. Uselessly wasting my time annoys me. Whether it's a really stupid playground zone (there's no playground here...Why the zone?), or some spaced out texter at a green light, the mere moments are a piss off.

It's the principle of the whole thing, Smokey. It's principalities.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

The problem with what people think they can drive comfortably with is not always accurate.
EDIT: ^^^I'm leaving this here but holy hell is that a poorly worded sentence. Quite possibly the most poorly constructed sentence in my life - which is why I'm keeping it there.

Honestly this shaves mere moments off your drive. I don't see the big deal.

For sure, it's definitely not an absolute, there's always going to be people with poor judgement.

My issue isn't with needing to go 30 for 15 seconds. I'd be perfectly willing to go 15km/hr in these zones, if they could justify it. My issue isn't the speed, it's that I think this change was completely unnecessary and a waste of money. Over a million dollars has gone into thsee changes. I don't agree with using playground zones as a traffic calming measure when it should be a last resort. I don't agree with the amount of needless zones in the city. I don't agree with them needing to go until 9:00 in the winter. But most of all, I don't agree with doing it in the name of safety when all it is is a feel good activity that doesn't actually make anything safer. It's a waste of time and money.

[Flabbibulin]

My work starting hours recently changed to 730am, meaning I'm on the road around 710 or 715. Drive through 3 zones on the way to work and it is amazing how many people go 30 in the zones at this time. It doesn't matter how they change the laws- plenty of people will have no clue what is going on.

[undercoverbrother]

I have no idea if this is posted before or the sources used to create it.

Spoiler!

[CliffFletcher]

The difference in pedestrian survival rates at 30k versus 50k is the clincher. How comfortable people feel driving on the road isn't the issue. It's a matter of physics, and whether a child (or anyone) will live or die after being struck at that speed.

I'm teaching my kids pedestrian safety right now (they just turned eight). How to stop and wait at a crosswalk or intersection. When to proceed. How to communicate with the driver. I want to be able to let them walk around our neighbourhood and cross streets without me, just as I did when I was their age. Most drivers are great. It's the 1 in 20 or so who is an impatient guy (sorry, but it's always a guy) in a big hurry who I worry about. The ones who consider cars big vroom-vroom toys and seem to suffer genuine physical pain when they have to apply their foot to their brakes. I'd be a lot more confident letting my kids walk around alone if there were fewer of those guys in my neighbourhood.

[blueski]

In all my 30 years of driving, I've never had a kid or pedestrian run into the road while I'm driving. But yeah we should all do 30km/hr everywhere because it might happen in today's helicoptered parenting world.

Edit: I'm a bit frustrated about this today. Got a photo radar for 41 in a playground zone right around Sunalta LRT station. I looked at the pic and matched it up with google's streetview. The guy got me right at the end of the playground zone, pic was about 5 feet before the sign says the zone ended. Now here's the thing, the place to go slow was at least 300 feet back right around the station. I understand this. I think everyone sees the sign that the zone has ended and hits the gas so that was an easy spot to rake in the cash.

Anyone know of any apps that track your speed in real time and warn you if you are going to fast? I don't even know if they would work in this case. I tried waze a couple of years ago and couldn't stand it because it was always warning me about stuff that didn't seem worthy of my attention.

What a pain in the a$$. I'm getting nickled and dimed (all 10-11km over) by photo radar 3 times over the last year and I am not a speeder. ie, I don't drive with the intent to speed, I go with the flow and am very patient and I very carefully note the playground zones and slow down through them. I know about the sunalta one, I drive it several days a week and for sure I was only speeding up at the very end of it.

I am tempted to start a protest movement that will drive 5% under the speed limit everywhere. Who wants to join!!

[CubicleGeek]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

This was posted to the CPS FB page a bit earlier. They clarified in the comments that it was from about 3-4 school zones that they were specifically watching, but that it doesn't cover ALL tickets issued today in relation to school zones.

That infographic is ambiguous. Was the teacher quoted speeding, impaired, or both?