Alberta business livid with energy savings program contract going to Ontario company

[taco.vidal]

http://globalnews.ca/news/3324997/al...tario-company/

The Alberta government is getting set to launch a residential energy savings plan next month, but local contractors and suppliers claim they’ve been shut out.

Here’s how the Residential No-Charge Energy Savings Program will work: Albertans can sign up online, and then an energy adviser will come to their home and give advice on how to make it more energy-efficient.

Light bulbs will be replaced with LED products, power bars and thermostats replaced with more efficient and programmable versions, and even shower heads will be changed out for ones that conserve water — all for free, because the program is being funded by the provincial carbon tax.

The province said the contract went to Ontario-based Ecofitt because it offered the best price for Albertans.

“This company was chosen out of a competitive tender so they were the lowest cost provider, so we can get more products in the hands of Albertans,” Environment Minister Shannon Phillips said.

Program link here: https://www.efficiencyalberta.ca/residential-no-charge/







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[burn_this_city]

We'd be mad if they didn't get the best price, now we're mad they didn't give it to an Alberta supplier because unemployment.

[Fuzz]

For these types of contracts, I would hope they look at more than just the dollar value. By employing Albertans, that keeps tax dollars in the province. That should play into it, no?

[Jason14h]

If Alberta has low employment, no Alberta company could bid for this job and hire the unemployed cheaper then using an Ontario company?

It's not like this is skilled labor.

There is no excuse for Alberta companies not being able to match or beat the bid.

[Resolute 14]

The only question I have is how much has Ecofitt donated to the NDP. Because there is no excuse for Notley to be going out of province except to reward party friends.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

For these types of contracts, I would hope they look at more than just the dollar value. By employing Albertans, that keeps tax dollars in the province. That should play into it, no?

It also sounds like an unfair RFP process too...

“It was pretty clear from the start that RFP that was put out was targeted towards the one company that won it. We know that because in order to find some of the do-dads that they wanted, that company’s name kept coming up as the supplier,” he explained.

So you have to buy your stuff from the one company that ended up winning the bid. No kidding that company came in lower than all the others. Duh.

It's a much different story when you hire a company from Ontario to build a road or bridge or whatever. There are lots of roads and bridges to build. Swapping light bulbs is a 100% monopoly. All these other existing Alberta businesses might as well wrap it up and do something else cause their business is 100% gone. That's the difference between a healthy inter provincial trade and screwing your local business community.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

There is no excuse for Alberta companies not being able to match or beat the bid.

Except the rigged bidding process.

[CaptainCrunch]

It doesn't pass the smell test to be honest, especially when Ecofitt is the exclusive supplier of the parts, they can jimmy win their bid process to win because they sell the products to themselves probably at break even or even a small loss.

The other bidding companies are also right in that it will hurt their businesses because the NDP is giving away products for free that they market, that's the worst part of this whole program. Instead of a logical rebate program that allows people for example to go to a local company, they've created a virtual monopoly. Why would I even need to buy a light bulb or thermostat or whatever. It also effectively shuts out companies that would do energy audits because according to the government release these people will come out to your house or whatever and do that as part of the service. This is a program now that's actually hurting green initiative companies in this province.

Its pretty much a harebrained scheme by a government that's the king of harebrained schemes. I would expect that the opposition parties are going to grill the NDP, and Hoffman will typically say something stupid and try to deflect.

[belsarius]

What a non-starter of a complain story. Did everyone just gloss over the part where they are starting up a Calgary warehouse and hiring 70 people? Do you think that they are going to ship all these people from Ontario in to do the job and send them home on the weekends?

Yes it is an Ontario based company, but there are tonnes of companies headquartered in other places operating in Alberta. They won the RFP, they had the "do-dads" and they could do it at the lowest price and will employ Albertans and they will lease a building in Alberta to do it.

Seriously, just yelling at clouds again.

[temple5]

In this case I assume Alberta still receives the tax dollars, however any income above tax is likely invested outside the province.

I have no problem with this. Alberta contractors are still pricing as if oil was $100 and if they cant price lower than a company 1000s of km away from the target consumer, they deserve to lose out on the bid. Most likely they saw the bid was for the government so they added the +20% add-on discount for government prices.

This of course assumes that Ecofitt has no prior or financial relationship with anyone within government or anyone else associated with government. And that they had no inside information on the bidding process so their blind bid was legit.

Now, if in 6 months Ecofitt finds that its lower bid doesnt cover its costs, then its a different story and the government who accepted the bid will then have to be held accountable for their decision.

I didnt realize this was part of the carbon tax. I wonder how this will apply to rented units, do homeowners have to schedule someone to come over or is this like a door to door sales person?

**This post in now way is an endorsement by Temple5 of the NDP Cabon Tax hiding as sales tax. The ultimate insult would be if people who also are rebated the full amount also get this service. One assumes if you are rebated the money, that you rent vs owning and I assume renters cannot change things in their units without landlord permission.

[Kjesse]

While I love to dump on the NDP, and this program is a great example of the NDP's stupidity, doing a competitive bid process was probably mandatory.

[puckedoff]

I don't care where they are from, as long as Albertans get the best value for paying someone to come in and change lightbulbs.

Paying someone to come in and change lightbulbs.

[Tinordi]

In an alternate universe taco.vidal starts up a thread complaining about high program costs for an energy efficiency program because the NDP circumvented standard RFP procedures to play favourites with local business rather than go with the most competitive firm in Ontario.

We still get to complain about the NDP and that's what matters!

[Resolute 14]

Shame there is no alternate reality where the mods finally put a stop to Tinordi's hit and run trolling.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by temple5

In this case I assume Alberta still receives the tax dollars, however any income above tax is likely invested outside the province.

I have no problem with this. Alberta contractors are still pricing as if oil was $100 and if they cant price lower than a company 1000s of km away from the target consumer, they deserve to lose out on the bid. Most likely they saw the bid was for the government so they added the +20% add-on discount for government prices.

This of course assumes that Ecofitt has no prior or financial relationship with anyone within government or anyone else associated with government. And that they had no inside information on the bidding process so their blind bid was legit.

Now, if in 6 months Ecofitt finds that its lower bid doesnt cover its costs, then its a different story and the government who accepted the bid will then have to be held accountable for their decision.

I didnt realize this was part of the carbon tax. I wonder how this will apply to rented units, do homeowners have to schedule someone to come over or is this like a door to door sales person?

**This post in now way is an endorsement by Temple5 of the NDP Cabon Tax hiding as sales tax. The ultimate insult would be if people who also are rebated the full amount also get this service. One assumes if you are rebated the money, that you rent vs owning and I assume renters cannot change things in their units without landlord permission.

How are there any kind of corporate tax dollars on this? There's literally no revenue for this company that can be taxed in Alberta. The Government is sending them a check, in Ontario, I think the Ontario government will get the tax revenue.

They'll receive some income tax in Alberta, but the assumption is that this isn't long term employment, once they finish the mandate the company will probably close up shop and get rid of everyone.

Like I said, my biggest concern is exactly what the owners of the other companies talked about. That it hurts their business because what they're selling the government is now giving away for free.

[jwslam]

Originally Posted by belsarius

What a non-starter of a complain story. Did everyone just gloss over the part where they are starting up a Calgary warehouse and hiring 70 people? Do you think that they are going to ship all these people from Ontario in to do the job and send them home on the weekends?

Yes it is an Ontario based company, but there are tonnes of companies headquartered in other places operating in Alberta. They won the RFP, they had the "do-dads" and they could do it at the lowest price and will employ Albertans and they will lease a building in Alberta to do it.

Seriously, just yelling at clouds again.

And where will the corporate taxes go when Ecofitt has to pay them? NOT Alberta.
What are local companies supposed to do with the inventory that's now dormant because people are getting free stuff?
What do local companies do with their staff now that they are unable to make sales?

[OMG!WTF!]

Would the tax issue depend on whether Ecofit opens up a business in Alberta to do this? They could easily start an Alberta Co. and pay our provincial tax rates. No doubt however the profits will be used in Ontario.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

Would the tax issue depend on whether Ecofit opens up a business in Alberta to do this? They could easily start an Alberta Co. and pay our provincial tax rates. No doubt however the profits will be used in Ontario.

why would they? This isn't a permanent business by any stretch. Its a limited term contract. They're going to come in and hire some workers, pound through this contract as quickly and cheaply as possible and pray they didn't under bid. And then when its done, they'll fire everyone, close up shop and leave.

There's no real long term business plan here, and no real reason to open full time.

The only reason why they'll stay if when the contract expires is if another one is offered, but I doubt they open a business here its a unnecessary cost.

[Erick Estrada]

It appears Ecofitt has their own bulbs which are likely rebranded bulbs from a mass maker like GE. Would be easy to rig the bidding process and force all companies to supply Ecofitt branded bulbs to which they would mark up to the Alberta companies to the point where they couldn't be competitive seeing the sheer amount of bulbs required. What should have been done by the NDP is to spec the wattage of bulbs, color, and ensure that energy star certified, etc and let the companies bid whatever they can offer as there's no good reason the bulbs or any other items would have to be from Ecofitt.

There is no doubt that this was done with one company in mind and IMO that's not right given the economical climate in this province. Again I didn't vote for these clowns so if there are Albertans complaining that voted NDP then I hope you learned your lesson.

[OMG!WTF!]

Yeah, assuming they're a large business the Ontario tax rate looks like it's a half point less than Alberta. So why indeed would they pay our provincial tax? Silly moi. I'm just so used to having a tax advantage I don't really know how to function any more. I wonder if that tax income was taken into account when figuring out who had the best bid.