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Old 11-04-2016, 08:34 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Monahan For Mayor View Post
We mite be thanking the Oilers as well. From what I've seen so far, Tkachuk is a better nhler today than Puljujarvi. That could change very easily but for now it looks that way.
Puljujärvi was the consensus #3 pick. I know everyone here was bummed when the Blue Jackets picked Dubois and the Flames could not do a trade up, and him landing in the Oilers hands.

We will never truly know if Treliving was truthful in saying that Tkachuk was going to be their pick all along, I highly doubt it.

if Tkachuk end up being the better player years down the road all the better for us.

Now compare this to what the Canucks did. Whether he plays to his potential or not, Juolevi wasn't even the consensus top Defenseman in the draft.



It's also made worse for the Canucks in that Chychrun is already in the Coyotes' Top 4.

Not like Tkachuk would have made a difference for them, but Tkachuk has more points than anyone else on the Canucks. The Canucks needed a young offensive Defenceman, but they kind of need everything except a goalie as can be seen by their goal scoring issues.

Their picking for need instead of BPA has already cost them Nylander in favour of Virtanen, and it may come back to bite them in the butt with this year's pick.
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Old 11-04-2016, 08:34 AM   #22
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I was a huge fan of his dad back in the day. I always traded for him on the PS.

It still seems weird to see that name on a Flames jersey for real. Hopefully it's there for a long time.
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Old 11-04-2016, 08:41 AM   #23
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Old 11-04-2016, 08:43 AM   #24
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4th year in the rebuild and we have been spoiled with a great rookie forward every year. Glad Tkachuk is still with the team. He had a boost of confidence playing last night knowing he is likely here for another 30 games at least. I still prefer to see him on a line with Bennett but he does look really good with Backs and Frolik
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Old 11-04-2016, 08:45 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by devo22 View Post
to be fair, those were really easy picks. Each one of those were gifted to the Flames on a silver tablet.
And yet the teams in front of us didn't take them.

It is not as easy as some people like to suggest - it isn't as simple as: rate the players now, you're betting on who is going to be the best player 5 years from now. And then there are team factors to consider as well.

Carolina chose Lindholm
Edmonton chose Draisaitl
Vancouver chose Juolevi

The Flames could very easily have made different choices as well.
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Old 11-04-2016, 08:47 AM   #26
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Old 11-04-2016, 08:51 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Enoch Root View Post
And yet the teams in front of us didn't take them.

It is not as easy as some people like to suggest - it isn't as simple as: rate the players now, you're betting on who is going to be the best player 5 years from now. And then there are team factors to consider as well.

Carolina chose Lindholm
Edmonton chose Draisaitl
Vancouver chose Juolevi

The Flames could very easily have made different choices as well.
Disagree. The Flames received easy choices in all 3 years. 2013 the debate was Lindholm or Monahan there was not a 3rd player in that tier. Carolina had the tough choice to make. Based on their first 3 years in the league the Canes made the wrong call. In 2014 it was considered 4 players at the top and then a steep drop off. Calgary was getting whoever of Bennett, Draisaitl, Reinhart were left (no way Ekblad would have slipped to us). Again Bennett was the easy
Choice. 2016 also was an easy choice unless the Flames believed that Keller or Nylander was the better player. I felt the top 5 was pretty set until the Canucks decided they wanted a Dman over a winger. Made the choice simple for the Flames.

I am no scout but I easily make the same 3 picks Calgary did in those drafts as each player was the no brainer pick
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Old 11-04-2016, 09:05 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Enoch Root View Post
And yet the teams in front of us didn't take them.

It is not as easy as some people like to suggest - it isn't as simple as: rate the players now, you're betting on who is going to be the best player 5 years from now. And then there are team factors to consider as well.

Carolina chose Lindholm
Edmonton chose Draisaitl
Vancouver chose Juolevi

The Flames could very easily have made different choices as well.
yeah. All I'm saying is that the Flames were in positions where a "logical" or "easy" pick was available. Lindholm and Monahan were seen as clear 5 and 6 in their draft year, so the Flames at 6 could just take the guy who was still there. In 2014 it was clear that one of the Sams or Draisaitl would fall to 4, so the Flames at 4 could just take the guy who was still there. And in 2016, Tkachuk fell right into their lap as well.

I'm not taking anything away from them, I think the drafting in general has been great for a few years now. Just saying those particular picks weren't that hard to make ... pretty sure almost every fan would have chosen the same guys.
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Old 11-04-2016, 09:07 AM   #29
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He's a bigger Brendan Gallagher. This is a very good thing. I love how he's not intimidated at all, always in the middle of things.
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Old 11-04-2016, 10:00 AM   #30
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Sam Bennett, Matthew Tkatchuk, Sean Monahan, Johnny Gaudreau

The future is so bright, i gotta wear shades.
Gonna save that optimism until those two stop playing like absolute trash.
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Old 11-04-2016, 10:15 AM   #31
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I'll never forget his dad in an intermission interview saying the Flames were playing 'typical Brian Sutter cheap shot hockey'. So hatable, Matthew is a chip of the old block but now that he's on our side he is so lovable.
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Old 11-04-2016, 10:25 AM   #32
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The drafting in the last 5 years has been exceptionally good. Maybe a bit lucky too, considering Monahan, Bennett and Tkachuk could have easily been picked earlier.
Yeah that's why it's so tough to critique a teams draft record either way, good or bad. They need to know who to take if the player is available, but a ton also depends on the teams ahead of them and who they take (Columbus for example) or don't take (Vancouver).
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Old 11-04-2016, 10:44 AM   #33
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I'll never forget his dad in an intermission interview saying the Flames were playing 'typical Brian Sutter cheap shot hockey'. So hatable, Matthew is a chip of the old block but now that he's on our side he is so lovable.
I believe what Keith said was "Brian Sutter Chicken #### hockey"
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Old 11-04-2016, 10:46 AM   #34
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I believe what Keith said was "Brian Sutter Chicken #### hockey"

Quite possibly. Could be mixing up with Olli Jokinen complaining about the Flames's cheap shot hockey while a Panther.
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Old 11-04-2016, 10:58 AM   #35
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Gonna save that optimism until those two stop playing like absolute trash.
Always the glass half empty guy it seems... Do we base our opinion on the previous 2-3 seasons or on the last 11 games played? While their play has been disappointing over the past 11 games, I don't think there is any reason to be concerned that all of a sudden Gaudreau and Monahan aren't good players.
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Old 11-04-2016, 10:58 AM   #36
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Gonna save that optimism until those two stop playing like absolute trash.
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Old 11-04-2016, 11:02 AM   #37
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Always the glass half empty guy it seems... Do we base our opinion on the previous 2-3 seasons or on the last 11 games played? While their play has been disappointing over the past 11 games, I don't think there is any reason to be concerned that all of a sudden Gaudreau and Monahan aren't good players.
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Old 11-04-2016, 11:18 AM   #38
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Always the glass half empty guy it seems... Do we base our opinion on the previous 2-3 seasons or on the last 11 games played? While their play has been disappointing over the past 11 games, I don't think there is any reason to be concerned that all of a sudden Gaudreau and Monahan aren't good players.
The complete lack of improvement or progress is concerning. I'm not panicking but I'm also going to leave them off the list of "excitement" until we see the same players again. Watching them this year has been painful.
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Old 11-04-2016, 11:19 AM   #39
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Disagree. The Flames received easy choices in all 3 years. 2013 the debate was Lindholm or Monahan there was not a 3rd player in that tier. Carolina had the tough choice to make. Based on their first 3 years in the league the Canes made the wrong call. In 2014 it was considered 4 players at the top and then a steep drop off. Calgary was getting whoever of Bennett, Draisaitl, Reinhart were left (no way Ekblad would have slipped to us). Again Bennett was the easy
Choice. 2016 also was an easy choice unless the Flames believed that Keller or Nylander was the better player. I felt the top 5 was pretty set until the Canucks decided they wanted a Dman over a winger. Made the choice simple for the Flames.

I am no scout but I easily make the same 3 picks Calgary did in those drafts as each player was the no brainer pick
I think there's a bit more to it then that...

It sounds like Treliving has a player in mind coming into the draft and does his due diligence to see what other teams ahead of him are doing. He has considered trading up multiple times now, but both times felt it wasn't worth the extra assets as he was either comfortable with the player we're getting at that position or confident that he can get his player at that position.

I'd say that's damn good discipline and it's worked out great for us so far. It's not as simple as taking the obvious best pick available.
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Old 11-04-2016, 11:58 AM   #40
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The complete lack of improvement or progress is concerning. I'm not panicking but I'm also going to leave them off the list of "excitement" until we see the same players again. Watching them this year has been painful.
Lack of progress? What are you talking about? They are having a bad start - that is the logical conclusion. All Monahan and Gaudreau have done since they entered the league is improved.
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