University of Ottawa "naked pub crawl"

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Yasmine Mehdi is the editor of La Rotonde newspaper at the University of Ottawa. She went undercover October 7th to an event organized by the Science Students Association called “The Vet's Tour”, after a tip that strange things were happening. The tip came on the heels of a similar event at the Université de Québec in Outaouais last month.


“It's an invite only event,” Mehdi said, “people told me it's very underground.”
What she witnessed shocked her.


“Naked people everywhere, lots of drinking, lots of making out. One girl lying on the ground with no clothes or little clothes and people doing shots off her,” she recalls, “two naked people wrapped in plastic wrap.”


Medhi says the event has been going on for years; Facebook photos from 2007 show students in various stages of undress, taking part in various activities.


She says this time about 100 students took part in teams of 10, trying to garner as many points off a secret list of dares.


“One of the things I heard in the bathroom was a girl saying “I'm not sure I like this” and one of her team mates encouraging her to have sex with one of the judges because it gives you more points and then the girl said, “I don’t know, this is too slutty for me,” and her friend suggesting she just have anal sex then. It was kind of shocking.”

http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/shocking-revelations-about-pub-crawl-involving-students-at-uottawa-1.3120796


And in a shocking revelation this woman is not being perceived as the hero she thinks she is for embarassing a bunch of university aged people doing university aged things...namely having consensual sex. Unfortunately that's including death threats and rape threats. Others have more measured responses:

The English university newspaper, the Fulcrum, has been publishing anonymous letters from people who attended the pub crawl. The editor-in-chief, Savannah Awde, says the majority of those writing in are defending it.


"I had the right to a private sexual experience with multiple people,” one student wrote, “The journalists and editorial staff at La Rotonde took away that right.”


“In all of the letters that were in defence of the event,” Awde said, “it had to do a lot to do with the fact that people felt that the event was to help them explore their sexuality freely. I guess they felt the reaction was kind of shaming for the sexual acts they engaged in consensually.”

http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/u-of-o-newspaper-editor-receives-backlash-after-expos%C3%A9-on-pub-crawl-1.3122435


Is this just a bunch of PUBEs causing an uproar? There were exactly zero complaints of sexual harassment or sexual assault, so why exactly is everyone acting like this was so terrible? The university has condemned it, but I'm not surprised.

Is consensual sex and funny/embarrassing sex games that evil? Seems to me that the prudish "undercover journalist" actually is the one in the wrong here for slut shaming.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/shocking-revelations-about-pub-crawl-involving-students-at-uottawa-1.3120796


And in a shocking revelation this woman is not being perceived as the hero she thinks she is for embarassing a bunch of university aged people doing university aged things...namely having consensual sex. Unfortunately that's including death threats and rape threats. Others have more measured responses:




http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/u-of-o-newspaper-editor-receives-backlash-after-expos%C3%A9-on-pub-crawl-1.3122435


Is this just a bunch of PUBEs causing an uproar? There were exactly zero complaints of sexual harassment or sexual assault, so why exactly is everyone acting like this was so terrible? The university has condemned it, but I'm not surprised.

Is consensual sex and funny/embarrassing sex games that evil? Seems to me that the prudish "undercover journalist" actually is the one in the wrong here for slut shaming.

Seems harmless to me. A bunch of drunk university students behaving like drunk university students and trying to get laid. Not sure why there has to be outrage over everything these days. It's not like these kids were forced to do this. They signed up knowing full well what it was.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

I don't know why my quotes always get screwed up when I post news stories.

Anyway, here are proper links to the articles.

http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/shocking-re...tawa-1.3120796

http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/u-of-o-news...rawl-1.3122435

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...rawl-1.3809768

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...tour-1.3813408

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

I don't know why my quotes always get screwed up when I post news stories.

Anyway, here are proper links to the articles.

http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/shocking-re...tawa-1.3120796

http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/u-of-o-news...rawl-1.3122435

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...rawl-1.3809768

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa...tour-1.3813408

I'm more interested in the facebook page

[Cecil Terwilliger]

There are pictures circulating of the event in question in case anyone is interested. I'm just not gonna post them.

[troutman]

Can consent be provided while under the impairment of alcohol/drugs, or extreme peer pressure and undue influence?

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Is this just a bunch of PUBEs causing an uproar? There were exactly zero complaints of sexual harassment or sexual assault, so why exactly is everyone acting like this was so terrible? The university has condemned it, but I'm not surprised.

Is consensual sex and funny/embarrassing sex games that evil? Seems to me that the prudish "undercover journalist" actually is the one in the wrong here for slut shaming.

If we've learned anything from all the college sport scandals over the years, it's that there is an immense amount of peer pressure to take part and not say anything if something you don't like happens. Combine that with the reaction many women receive when reporting anything like this, and are you surprised there was no reports until now?

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Mazrim

If we've learned anything from all the college sport scandals over the years, it's that there is an immense amount of peer pressure to take part and not say anything if something you don't like happens. Combine that with the reaction many women receive when reporting anything like this, and are you surprised there was no reports until now?

What do you mean until now?

This isn't a scandal because of sexual assault.

This is a scandal because of morality. That's why it is so interesting. I actually find it offensive that we have such a paternalistic and condescending view of young women that we assume that they must have been raped (with or without being drunk and or peer pressured), because none of them would engage in this lewd behaviour of their own accord.

[rubecube]

Man, I never get invited to the fun parties. Actually that's not true. I get invited to fun parties, just not the fun sex parties.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

This is a scandal because of morality. That's why it is so interesting. I actually find it offensive that we have such a paternalistic and condescending view of young women that we assume that they must have been raped (with or without being drunk and or peer pressured), because none of them would engage in this lewd behaviour of their own accord.

These students don't need a student association to get their funtimes in. Why do you feel any institution would feel this is okay?

You don't believe there's even been a case here of someone not speaking out about a past event? Sounds like something where this could happen.

[Kybosh]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Man, I never get invited to the fun parties. Actually that's not true. I get invited to fun parties, just not the fun sex parties.

Ya, my experiences in sciences at a few different institutions were nothing like this. Kinda depressing actually.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Mazrim

These students don't need a student association to get their funtimes in. Why do you feel any institution would feel this is okay?

You don't believe there's even been a case here of someone not speaking out about a past event? Sounds like something where this could happen.

Now you're bringing the institution into it? What does that have to do with your original post?

I'm not sure where you're going with this.

EDIT: I see your ninja edit. See you're doing exactly what I'm talking about. You're assuming that anyone with questionable morality, which is anyone who would have sex with multiple partners according to some, must inherently be a rapist. It makes no damn sense. This expose is based on nothing but slut shaming and titillating stories of sex. This is gossipy BS.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Now you're bringing the institution into it? What does that have to do with your original post?

I'm not sure where you're going with this.

EDIT: I see your ninja edit. See you're doing exactly what I'm talking about. You're assuming that anyone with questionable morality, which is anyone who would have sex with multiple partners according to some, must inherently be a rapist. It makes no damn sense. This expose is based on nothing but slut shaming and titillating stories of sex. This is gossipy BS.

Science Students Association

If the Science Students Association is an association recognized by uOttawa, then they should be involved,

If you get a bunch of students doing this under a "non-sanctioned" association then no, it isn't on uOttawa.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Now you're bringing the institution into it? What does that have to do with your original post?

I'm not sure where you're going with this.

Because of this:

Medhi says this pub crawl wound through three bars in the Byward market. We went into one of the bars, the Red Lion, which confirmed that the students association had requested a private space, with a curtain, and even a way to block out the windows.

Are you okay with student organizations supporting this kind of activity? Again, do you believe there hasn't ever been a case with these events where someone has been under pressure to not speak up about things they wanted to report?

You seem to think it's prudish to report about this, but I can't imagine there is any institution that wants this happening under their banner. When it happens as part of the school, that's where it becomes a big issue.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

You're assuming that anyone with questionable morality, which is anyone who would have sex with multiple partners according to some, must inherently be a rapist. It makes no damn sense.

That's quite the conclusion you have made on me, sir. Clearly you understand me better than I do. I'll excuse myself from this thread, then.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

If the Science Students Association is an association recognized by uOttawa, then they should be involved,

If you get a bunch of students doing this under a "non-sanctioned" association then no, it isn't on uOttawa.

Originally Posted by Mazrim

Because of this:


Are you okay with student organizations supporting this kind of activity? Again, do you believe there hasn't ever been a case with these events where someone has been under pressure to not speak up about things they wanted to report?

You seem to think it's prudish to report about this, but I can't imagine there is any institution that wants this happening under their banner. When it happens as part of the school, that's where it becomes a big issue.

I'm not sure what either of you are getting at...

You're both arguing against a point that exactly no one made...

Originally Posted by Mazrim

That's quite the conclusion you have made on me, sir. Clearly you understand me better than I do. I'll excuse myself from this thread, then.

Well, you did make that exact correlation...

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

This is a scandal because of morality. That's why it is so interesting. I actually find it offensive that we have such a paternalistic and condescending view of young women that we assume that they must have been raped (with or without being drunk and or peer pressured), because none of them would engage in this lewd behaviour of their own accord.

More evidence that the far left and far right converge on a lot of issues. The anxious, judging, moralistic mindset seems just as evident among progressive advocates as it is among old-fashioned conservative Christians.

Liberality is the trade-off of increased freedom for decreased security. We seem to be going through a stage in our social cycle where we're pulling back from freedoms (and criticizing those who choose freedom) out of an anxious need for safety and security.

[polak]

Originally Posted by Mazrim

Because of this:


Are you okay with student organizations supporting this kind of activity? Again, do you believe there hasn't ever been a case with these events where someone has been under pressure to not speak up about things they wanted to report?

You seem to think it's prudish to report about this, but I can't imagine there is any institution that wants this happening under their banner. When it happens as part of the school, that's where it becomes a big issue.

Sounds like everyone there new exactly what they were getting into when they were sober and decided to go the event. It's a naked pub crawl, not much to read between the lines there. I think claiming people were pressured into anything is a bit of a stretch considering there haven't actually been any reports of it....

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

More evidence that the far left and far right converge on a lot of issues. The anxious, judging, moralistic mindset seems just as evident among progressive advocates as it is among old-fashioned conservative Christians.

I think you're off the mark here. Most on the far-left would have no problem with this kind of behaviour if they could conclude that it was consensual, and would likely be more inclined to call criticisms of it slut-shaming as Cecil has done, were it to be consensual. Now if you have women being pressured, coerced, drugged, etc., into these activities, it'd be a different story.

This is also one of the big sources of conflict between second-wave and third-wave feminists and sort of extends over into other issues such as prostitution where the third-wave tends to be in favour of legalized prostitution and second-wave supports continued criminalization with an emphasis on stricter penalties for Johns.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by troutman

Can consent be provided while under the impairment of alcohol/drugs, or extreme peer pressure and undue influence?

We live in a culture that has long linked social activities among young adults with inebriation. I met my wife at the Ship & Anchor. Most people I know met their significant other in an environment where alcohol was a factor. As I noted in my previous post, increased freedom always means decreased safety.

Is it time to turn our back on that kind of liberality? Return to the ways of our great-grandparents, a time of chaperones, religious prescriptions against pre-marital sex, and the shaming of women who drink?