06-25-2017, 10:45 AM
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#21
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Fish Creek
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At what time do you bring your goalie prospects up?
Do they need to be dominant in the AHL before a call up? Do you "over ripen" them or do you show some faith and confidence in them and allow them to become NHL goalies by experiencing the NHL on a more regular basis?
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06-25-2017, 10:49 AM
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#22
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary
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The goalie depth is stable enough to toss a goalie into the NHL and let him sink or swim. By the time Treliving is do e constructing this roster there may only be enough cap space to have one of the AHL do back up Smith. If Treliving is building a corps of 6 d men unrivaled in the league I really think you can get a kid in there and allow him to be sheltered behind said d corps.
Just an angle to consider.
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06-25-2017, 10:51 AM
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#23
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Celebrated Square Root Day
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timbo
At what time do you bring your goalie prospects up?
Do they need to be dominant in the AHL before a call up? Do you "over ripen" them or do you show some faith and confidence in them and allow them to become NHL goalies by experiencing the NHL on a more regular basis?
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Over ripen in the AHL for sure. People are talking about Gillies backing up Smith with like 40 some odd AHL starts, that won't happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Table 5
Be careful about dealing in absolutes...
Gillies and Rittich aren't 19 year olds...I think at some point you need to take a bit of a sink or swim approach with these guys to see what we have. Personally I wouldn't mind seeing the two rotate between the AHL starter spot and the NHL backup spot. Sure it would be nice if the #1 goalie was a bit more of a sure thing, but at some point you gotta test out your young goalies. We're not completely in win-now mode, so i think there's still a bit of flexibility there.
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Sorry for the absolutes, I know it's annoying when posters do that, but Treliving acquiring an NHL back up is about as absolute as you can get this off season.
Not necessarily because none of them could handle it and not because we're definitely in a win-now mode but because Brad himself (Not the organization as a whole) is in "goalie win now" mode. He's struck out a couple times and simply won't put himself one Mike Smith injury away from tossing away another season to goaltending.
The NHL is a different beast from the AHL, and while you can say that Rittich or others should be able to perform in the NHL, I would be beyond surprised if this organization was willing to lay a critical goaltending season on probably.
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06-25-2017, 10:51 AM
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#24
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I believe in the Jays.
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We need someone good that the coach will trust to start 25-30 games. I don't want old man Smith overworked and out of gas by the end of the season. That's not Gillies or Rittich... at least not to start the season. I'd be fine with bringing back Johnson but any goalie that's shown to be average in the past will do.
We do need to start transitioning a young guy so we need we need to keep a spot open for next year. So yeah 1 year deal only.
Last edited by Parallex; 06-25-2017 at 10:57 AM.
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06-25-2017, 10:53 AM
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#25
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Acerbic Cyberbully
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: back in Chilliwack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunk
I think make it a race between Gillies and Rittich. If one struggles or gets injured, give the other a chance. At a certain point you have to take a bit of a risk in the development process. Both are at an age they should be able to step up...
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Gillies has played a total of ONE NHL game, and Rittich has played a single period. I get the sentiment, but unless one of them absolutely dominates at camp, tossing them into a backup role with virtually no experience is a bad idea. I suspect that one of them at least will get a few more NHL games this year, but I believe we are still a year away from seeing one make the team out of camp.
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06-25-2017, 11:01 AM
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#26
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Celebrated Square Root Day
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I think a lot of posters are jumping the team's plan by a year or two because they see a lot of potential and want to see that realized at the NHL level. That's a good thing as it means we have goalies knocking at the door.
But to me, Brad's plan has been laid out pretty clearly if you follow his moves and interviews.
-Always over ripen prospects as opposed to throwing them into the fire
-Gillies/Rittich have looked great but need to more seasoning
-We brought Mike Smith in partly due to his contract length to transition to internal options
-Always talking about acquiring an NHL back up as part of his off season plans this off season
To me, an NHL back up this season is almost an absolute, while getting a prospect some starts this season in the NHL will be done if one dominates at the AHL level.
Then next season if one has dominated at a lower level and pushed for enough starts in the NHL to warrant confidence then they put him in back up full time and start to put some serious stock/thought into replacing Mike Smith as a starter either late that season or next season when his contract is done.
Goalies are too flakey and the AHL to the NHL is too big of a jump for what you guys want the GM to commit to this season when he's sitting on two goaltending strikes.
Last edited by jayswin; 06-25-2017 at 11:04 AM.
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06-25-2017, 11:01 AM
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#27
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Acerbic Cyberbully
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: back in Chilliwack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Timbo
At what time do you bring your goalie prospects up?
Do they need to be dominant in the AHL before a call up? Do you "over ripen" them or do you show some faith and confidence in them and allow them to become NHL goalies by experiencing the NHL on a more regular basis?
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Pretty much, and this is something that neither Gillies nor Rittich has done. Of course, both basically have only one season of AHL experience to their credit. Most NHL goalies don't make it until they are in their mid-twenties anyways.
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06-25-2017, 11:09 AM
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#28
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Calgary
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I would be shocked if Chad Johnson does not get resigned.
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06-25-2017, 11:11 AM
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#29
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: NYYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayswin
Not necessarily because none of them could handle it and not because we're definitely in a win-now mode but because Brad himself (Not the organization as a whole) is in "goalie win now" mode. He's struck out a couple times and simply won't put himself one Mike Smith injury away from tossing away another season to goaltending.
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I do think that having someone older and perhaps fragile, like Smith, as your number 1 forces you to look for a bit more of an experience backup as insurance, which is why I think chances are good that Johnson will be back. But I just don't think it's completely unreasonable to think that one of the two young goalies will be given the opportunity. The Flames brought in a guy like Smith, instead of a younger goalie, presumably because they assume that one of these young will be ready to take over in a couple of years. At some point you do have to get them used to the NHL game. Do you do it this year, when your team is still learning, or next, when expectations for success will be even higher?
The Flames goalie situation is definitely still a pretty big question mark. Good thing they have one of the league's best defence groups at least.
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06-25-2017, 11:14 AM
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#30
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: TEXAS!!
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Gillies is coming off a "meh" season in the AHL, where he posted a .910 sv%.
If I was the GM of a team in the NHL looking to go deep in the playoffs, I wouldn't be knocking down his door to pencil him in for 20-30 games.
__________________
I am a lunatic whose world revolves around hockey and Oilers hate.
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06-25-2017, 11:18 AM
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#31
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Celebrated Square Root Day
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Table 5
I do think that having someone older and perhaps fragile, like Smith, as your number 1 forces you to look for a bit more of an experience backup as insurance, which is why I think chances are good that Johnson will be back. But I just don't think it's completely unreasonable to think that one of the two young goalies will be given the opportunity. The Flames brought in a guy like Smith, instead of a younger goalie, presumably because they assume that one of these young will be ready to take over in a couple of years. At some point you do have to get them used to the NHL game. Do you do it this year, when your team is still learning, or next, when expectations for success will be even higher?
The Flames goalie situation is definitely still a pretty big question mark. Good thing they have one of the league's best defence groups at least.
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Likely they'll insert a prospect next year after hopefully getting one solid year of goaltending under their belts to give fans/management/ownership a big of relief and some renewed confidence.
The most I could see happening this year is a) a forced call up due to injury (blessing in disguise?) or b) a prospect literally playing his way onto the team due to dominant AHL play.
As to it not being unreasonable that a prospect is given back up duties out of camp and no NHL back up signed? I'm going to respectfully stand firm on that actually being unreasonable based on a combination of what Brad Treliving has stated in interviews when speaking to timelines and plans and a gut feeling that he's not risking **** all this season for his own good.
I'll happily stare down a bumped link to this thread from you if Brad doesn't get an NHL back up. I'll stick my neck out on this for sure.
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06-25-2017, 11:23 AM
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#32
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: NYYC
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Ha, that's fine, I'm definitely not here to make any pube bets or anything. And I actually do think that the Flames getting a more experienced backup is much more likely...I just wouldn't be completely shocked if you see Rittich in the role come Game 1.
I wish this franchise had a better handle on their goalie situation. We're like the Flyers of the west.
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06-25-2017, 11:24 AM
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#33
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Powerplay Quarterback
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Upstate NY
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Cam Ward?
He has one year remaining on his deal with Carolina and would be a solid backup/insurance policy if a reasonable deal could be worked out between the Flames and the Hurricanes.
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06-25-2017, 11:25 AM
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#34
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Lifetime Suspension
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If I were Brad, my budget for a backup would be a touch over 2 mil. Just no reason to spend more than that. If Chad wants more money than that, he can try his luck elsewhere, but I don't know if he'd have a lot of luck fishing for much more.
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06-25-2017, 11:29 AM
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#35
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First Line Centre
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Calgary
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Regardless of what fans want the backup situation to be, Treliving does not strike me as the guy to give it to Rittich or Gillies this season. I fully expect Johnson to be back in the fold.
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06-25-2017, 11:31 AM
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#36
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Celebrated Square Root Day
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Table 5
Ha, that's fine, I'm definitely not here to make any pube bets or anything. And I actually do think that the Flames getting a more experienced backup is much more likely...I just wouldn't be completely shocked if you see Rittich in the role come Game 1.
I wish this franchise had a better handle on their goalie situation. We're like the Flyers of the west.
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One thing I'd actually be really okay with is signing a slightly lower tier back up (600k - $950) and truly not give him the position, which you are essentially doing when you pay $1.7-$2.5 for a back up.
Let them come into camp and be fully prepared to burry them in the AHL if Rittich or another prospect appears to have won the job. That way you get what we all want - A prospect getting serious NHL experience - AND you still have an NHL caliber back up in Stockton if the prospect falters or Mike Smith gets hurt.
Actually even just in typing that, this is what I now want, haha. That would be perfect and should mostly satisfy fears/hopes on both side of the back up goalie debate.
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06-25-2017, 11:32 AM
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#37
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Celebrated Square Root Day
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flame19,289
Cam Ward?
He has one year remaining on his deal with Carolina and would be a solid backup/insurance policy if a reasonable deal could be worked out between the Flames and the Hurricanes.
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Hasn't his numbers been atrocious in recent years?
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06-25-2017, 11:32 AM
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#38
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Fish Creek
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Pube bets! Ya gotta love how that's become such a legacy on CP.
Back on topic, I would love to see one or both prospects have a meteoric rise to the NHL but that's just my old man sentimentality taking over my sensibilities.
We need to sign a back up and give our prospects a few NHL starts and let them marinate for another year.
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06-25-2017, 11:34 AM
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#39
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Fernando Valley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flambers
I would be shocked if Chad Johnson does not get resigned.
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It sure feels like that's the he case. I can live with that but for only one season as the backup spot needs to be open for Gillies, Rittich, etc in Smith's final season.
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06-25-2017, 11:43 AM
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#40
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Calgary
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Rittich or a proven backup. Gillies needs another year of development.
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