The UAV/Personal Drone thread

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

that's part of the problem, those who don't fly respectfully. a friend of mine can't spend any time in her yard because some pervert keeps spying on her with his drone. (especially in the summer, of course)

gives the hobby a bad rep and ruins it for everyone.

Drones can't "spy", they're loud and anyone who claims this is looking for attention.

Even at 100 meters, you can clearly hear the drone. If someone wanted to use a camera to "spy" on people there are a lot better ways to do it than something as loud and noticeable as a drone.

Should we ban cameras too because someone might spy on someone? These laws are absurd because they make no sense. If safety is the number one issue we might as well ban cars because a lot more idiots get behind the wheel of a piece of metal that weighs a tonne than get behind a controller of a drone.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by Frequitude

Do these things even have altimeters or ground elevation monitors on them? How would you know how to follow those rules?

You can literally track your exact flight paths and know your exact place in the sky, distance and height in real time. They're not just toys, they're really advanced technology wise. Each one basically has a black box like any plane and is connected to satellites.

[GoinAllTheWay]

Originally Posted by GoinAllTheWay

I found this tool on a GOC website marking the location of all airports/landing strips.

Am I reading this right? In the TurnerValley/Black Diamond area there are 4 runways? Are they actually all active? One appears to be in a clump of trees?

https://www.nrc-cnrc.gc.ca/eng/solut...tion_tool.html

Just wanted to get this onto the new page so some of our pilot members can possibly shed some light on my question.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Drones can't "spy", they're loud and anyone who claims this is looking for attention.

Even at 100 meters, you can clearly hear the drone. If someone wanted to use a camera to "spy" on people there are a lot better ways to do it than something as loud and noticeable as a drone.

Should we ban cameras too because someone might spy on someone? These laws are absurd because they make no sense. If safety is the number one issue we might as well ban cars because a lot more idiots get behind the wheel of a piece of metal that weighs a tonne than get behind a controller of a drone.

so you're saying it's ok for some perv to fly his drone low over someone's backyard and stare at their breasts? someone should have a reasonable expectation of privacy in their own fenced yard.

I used my friend as an example of how some people ruin a hobby for the vast majority. I don't know why you take offense to the idea that some people use their drone is socially unacceptable ways.

not just improper peeping, but interfering with fire teams, emergency rescues and plane flight. I'm sure it's the vast minority, but it happens on a regular enough basis that people take issue with drones because of it.

that's probably why the new rules have overreacted, too.

I like your car example. did you know there are laws and regulations about how and where you can use your car? it's not the wild west out there on the road. but you also use the camera example, too. No matter if it's a drone or a camera, if you invade a persons privacy it's going to tick them off.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally Posted by GoinAllTheWay

Just wanted to get this onto the new page so some of our pilot members can possibly shed some light on my question.

Probably some database issues, the one in the trees should overlap the existing runway to the south.

What's hilarious is they have the old RCAF Shepard Auxiliary Training Field as a no fly zone ,which hasn't existed since what...1960?

[para transit fellow]

Originally Posted by GoinAllTheWay

Just wanted to get this onto the new page so some of our pilot members can possibly shed some light on my question.

"Clump of trees" is probably the CU NIM gliding club. Grass Strip with very little infrastructure

But lots of activity on the weekends

[GoinAllTheWay]

/\/\

They appear to be well northeast of Black Diamond:

https://www.google.ca/maps/place/Cu+...4d-114.1857346

The one in the clump of trees shows Turnervalley Bar N Ranch. I wonder if some of these locations need updating. I was hoping to find some area out near Turner Valley to fly but it appears to be a no go too.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

so you're saying it's ok for some perv to fly his drone low over someone's backyard and stare at their breasts? someone should have a reasonable expectation of privacy in their own fenced yard.

I used my friend as an example of how some people ruin a hobby for the vast majority. I don't know why you take offense to the idea that some people use their drone is socially unacceptable ways.

not just improper peeping, but interfering with fire teams, emergency rescues and plane flight. I'm sure it's the vast minority, but it happens on a regular enough basis that people take issue with drones because of it.

that's probably why the new rules have overreacted, too.

I like your car example. did you know there are laws and regulations about how and where you can use your car? it's not the wild west out there on the road. but you also use the camera example, too. No matter if it's a drone or a camera, if you invade a persons privacy it's going to tick them off.

How would you or your friend possibly know they were looking at her breasts? Seems like fear mongering to me. It's ok to want privacy in your backyard but stop the BS about peeping toms and creeps trying to stare at breasts. Drones are the worst spying tool possible. Loud and easily noticeable. Might as well get onto a ladder over the fence with bells attached and make yourself even more visible.

Obviously interfering with fire teams and all that is not fine and shouldn't be allowed. It also doesn't mean they need a blanket rule basically banning drone use in Calgary and surrounding areas.

[automaton 3]

Bar N Ranch is X'd out on the chart. Not sure why it would be included. King Ranch is not far away and also X'd out, and is not included.

CBD8 is a grass runway, CEH2 has two grass runways, and Oilfields is for helicopters at the Black Diamond hospital.

[para transit fellow]

ONe would have to check the Canada Flight supplement ( updated every 56 days) to see what the current status is

only thing I found for free was
http://archive.copanational.org/Plac...id=2&ap_id=666

from 2012

[Frequitude]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

Should we ban cameras too because someone might spy on someone?

Surely you can see the difference between someone anonymously using a camera from a remote location and having the ability to literally fly away without being apprehended, and a physical person using a camera which makes them both identifiable and chaseable.

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

These laws are absurd because they make no sense. If safety is the number one issue we might as well ban cars because a lot more idiots get behind the wheel of a piece of metal that weighs a tonne than get behind a controller of a drone.

Sorta like how US gun laws make sense because knives kill people too, right. If you're reaching that far with this false equivalency then you're grasping at straws.

[SebC]

Pretty indefensible overreach by the government here.

[automaton 3]

Originally Posted by para transit fellow

ONe would have to check the Canada Flight supplement ( updated every 56 days) to see what the current status is

only thing I found for free was
http://archive.copanational.org/Plac...id=2&ap_id=666

from 2012

It's listed as abandoned in the CFS.

[para transit fellow]

Originally Posted by SebC

Pretty indefensible overreach by the government here.

Welcome to the world of aviation where there are many many many rules.

For example: you are not allowed to take Sudafed while piloting an aircraft. (I received a registered letter on that topic after an aviation medical. I had listed "Sudafed for current cold symptoms" under
The "medications" question.)

[GoinAllTheWay]

Ok, am I just reading this wrong or is Transport Canada contradicting itself? This is the link to the newly posted regulations:
https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/mediaroom/i...-aircraft.html

Where under application it says:
(2) It does not apply to

1. unmanned air vehicles; and

And defines unmanned air vehicles as:
a power-driven aircraft, other than a model aircraft, that is designed to fly without a human operator on board.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally Posted by GoinAllTheWay

Ok, am I just reading this wrong or is Transport Canada contradicting itself? This is the link to the newly posted regulations:
https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/mediaroom/i...-aircraft.html

Where under application it says:
(2) It does not apply to

1. unmanned air vehicles; and

And defines unmanned air vehicles as:
a power-driven aircraft, other than a model aircraft, that is designed to fly without a human operator on board.

No contradiction, common day drones fall under the definition of model aircraft and this interim order applies to them per Application(3)1.

If your drone isn't being used for recreational use or exceeds the 77.2lb weight, then it becomes a UAV by the definition in the interim order. I'm sure there's then other CAR's that apply in that scenario.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by Frequitude

Surely you can see the difference between someone anonymously using a camera from a remote location and having the ability to literally fly away without being apprehended, and a physical person using a camera which makes them both identifiable and chaseable.

Sorta like how US gun laws make sense because knives kill people too, right. If you're reaching that far with this false equivalency then you're grasping at straws.

What's stopping someone from setting up a wireless camera in someone's yard if they wanted to be a "perv" or a "creep"? They could even do it without the use of a very loud drone.

The false equivalency is the fact some want drones banned so they can't creep on women. If you want to ban them for privacy issues then that's fair but to say people are using it to be peeping toms is absurd to anyone who has flown a drone. They're the worst possible tool for a peeping Tom to use.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally Posted by GoinAllTheWay

No it's not really an over reaction. Do you feel model rockets or planes gained anywhere near the popularity that drones did? While this may not outright kill the industry, it is going to have a significant impact. How could it not? This will discourage a number of existing hobbyists and certainly ones that were considering trying it out. Looking at that map, there is no where in the city to go and fly. You have to travel a ways out of the city now. And where does one go to respect this new regs and not intrude on private property?

It's bringing the rules in line with other hobbies that also share the airspace, that have existed long before drones did. While I feel empathetic, I don't see this as an overbearing set of rules.

Not saying it won't have an impact, it most certainly will, but that's the unfortunate side of things. Those who have invested heavily into this hobby though should have seen this coming, it's been in the works and discussed in the news for a long time. If you expected more leeway than rocketry or RC aircraft, I'm not sure what basis you would be expecting that. All of them fly in in the air and give risk to aircraft and public.

Believe it or not, rocketry and RC aircraft are still huge hobbies, just not in Calgary as much as you have to travel about 40min to enjoy them. You should come out to a MAAC affiliated club field day, you'd be surprised. Granted, when the regulations came in for rocketry/RC, it was a much larger hobby over time. But I don't believe the reduction in memberships was due to the restrictive regulations, it's more so that the newer generations didn't see it as something they wanted to do. Still, both bring in new people and both are striving after learning to work with the regulations.

For high powered rocketry, we actually have even more restrictions that what drones have, and as a result, we have our own Class F airspace to use. Only have to travel 3 hours to get to it from Calgary. On the airspace map, you can see ours listed SE of Lethbridge as CYR252.

[GoinAllTheWay]

Originally Posted by BlackArcher101

It's bringing the rules in line with other hobbies that also share the airspace, that have existed long before drones did.

Yes I realize that but those rules were written for a different type of aircraft in a time that had none of the technology available today.

Rocketry I don't really think belongs in this conversation. You are lighting a fuse on a propellant and have no control over it once it goes off.

Model airplanes of the past traditionally have been gas powered, no? You crash with one of those and a chance of fire or explosion is quite high. And until recently, they could only be flown line of sight. Functional FPV flight wasn't possible until what, maybe 5 or 6 yrs ago at best?

Quadcopters are entirely different. They can have numerous fail safes built into them. You can contain them within geofences. You don't need the same speed to maintain flight like you do with planes and they are battery powered. Get in a bit of trouble? Take your hands off the sticks and quadcopters can stay put. Hit a button and it can return to the controller None of this is possible with rockets or traditional RC planes.

I just don't see thh harm in flying a small quadcopter around an empty soccer or baseball field. Not all quadcopters are equipped with stabilized HD cameras that can look independently of where the quadcopter is flying. Most of the small ones you see at school or soccer fields are only equipped with an FPV camera that is anything but HD.

I get that guidelines needed to be written to introduce fines for idiots that can follow some common sense and I'm fine with that. Hell, I'd even be fine with mandatory insurance or registration. But I think the rules introduced here are far too heavy handed, especially the weight limitation and distance from all places an aircraft can take off and land. I get that you disagree and that's fine.

[8 Ball]

Interesting topic. My home backs on to a park that regularly has folks flying rc planes and remote controlled helicopters. We never had a problem with them, actually enjoyed watching them. When drones came out we thought they were cool as well. But every once in a while someone will fly them over our house and our nieghbors and hover around. It's rather invasive to be honest.