[News] NHL announces $2000 fine to James Neal for diving

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by Philly06Cup

Why is diving cheating. Why is it classless. Someone explain.

Why should a team be punished for doing absolutely nothing wrong?

Diving is BS and I don't get why anyone would defend it.

[flylock shox]

This is great - the type of thing I've advocated for soccer for years (though I prefer multi-game suspensions to fines because those are stronger punishments with stronger impacts on team and league culture).

Good for the NHL taking steps like these before it gets to soccer levels.

[AcGold]

Originally Posted by heep223

You have the weirdest posts

I think the dives that get fined are going to be the ones that there is absolutely 0 question. Like the really, really obvious ones such as Neal's and Ovie's above (though did Ovie get fined?). If there's even a question, they won't call it a dive. So we'll still see diving but it will never be to the same extent as soccer thank god.

Atleast I can handle others having contrary opinions like an adult unlike many on this forum.

[CMPunk]

Originally Posted by flamesrule_kipper34

Classless in hockey can be defined as cheating to win a game.

Cheating in hockey can be defined as breaking the rules.

In the NHL rulebook diving is a penalty, hence breaking the rules.

Therefore, in your example diving is both classless and cheating.

Hopefully that spells it out for you.

By your definitions, doesn't that make any penalty classless and cheating?

[flamesrule_kipper34]

Originally Posted by CMPunk

By your definitions, doesn't that make any penalty classless and cheating?

I was specifically referring to his scenario,

But yes...that's exactly what I'm saying!

[FlamesAllTheWay]

Originally Posted by Philly06Cup

Why is diving cheating. Why is it classless. Someone explain.

It's not cheating but it's against the rules of he game, same as slashing, tripping, cross-checking, etc. As per the NHL rule book.

It's classless because it undermines a referees ability to call legitimate penalties.

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by Philly06Cup

Why is diving cheating. Why is it classless. Someone explain.

I think one universal attraction of hockey is that at its root it pits one tribe against another. Before there were rules and independent authorities a 'contest' or 'battle' would be decided by the guys on the field and I think most NHL players would prefer this scenario at heart.

Divers are the cunning scumbags that use the independent authority to their tribes advantage. Most of the time teammates hate divers on their own team and can't justify the moral quagmire of winning because of it, but they are also very competitive and hate losing.

Diving cheapens & erodes the respect of combatants and thus the term, "unsportsmanlike".

[Cube Inmate]

Every other penalty in the NHL rulebook relates to something a player (or coach) does to try to gain an advantage in the course of game play. That is, every other infraction exists because the act itself can contribute either to scoring or preventing a goal (or sometimes to intimidate the opposition), irrespective of the presence of the referees. These acts are made illegal because, despite being "useful" tactics, they are either dangerous or otherwise detract from the quality of the play. And, if we didn't have referees in a game, players would be slashing, kneeing, boarding, high-sticking, hooking, and tripping all over the place to gain the advantage.

In my books, trying to gain an advantage in the actual playing of hockey is not cheating -- it's just pushing the envelope. Fortunately, we have referees there to keep it from being pushed too far.

Diving, on the other hand, is the only case where a player can be rewarded for actively disadvantaging himself. The player is no longer trying to actually play the game, but is trying to "game the system" that's put in place to ensure the integrity of the game. That's where it crosses the line into cheating.

[thefoss1957]

I was a college soccer player (in the 70's)...Played Left Full...Any SOB that dove on me, got his calf stepped on, HARD (with Hard studded cleats), or trip myself on him for his effort...it cut down on further diving attempts...BTW...I never gave up a Penalty Shot despite some valiant diving efforts, although there were some legitimate challenges that I would have had no argument if the call was given.

I felt then, as I still feel now, that embellishment and diving have no place in Hockey, Soccer, OR Basketball...and divers deserve to have something bad happen to them...My playing philosophy was, if you are going to try to get a call off of me, I will do something to earn it! Happily, back when I played, only the field referee could call fouls, and if he didn't make a call, and just followed the ball...it wasn't going to be pretty for the diver!

[OzSome]

Originally Posted by FBI

Wow that is a brutal dive.. Canucks-esque

I know. I am not a good skater but even I won't fall like that if I trip myself or something. That guy must have been watching the Canucks a lot.

[calumniate]

Paging Sean Avery

[Redrum]

Damn. When he grabbed his knee I thought he was tucking in for the front flip.

[rubecube]

I'd like to see them start fining organizations for diving, too. It seems institutionalized in some places Vancouver.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

Pride & Class. Sooner lose with class, than cheat to win.

Nobody pays $$$ to see the best hockey players in the world act as we have movie theatres for that. It's important that the integrity of the sport be maintained and if you turn a blind eye to acting/diving you are essentially reducing the sport to WWE where it's entertainment and not sport. When I see a Flame do it I cringe just as much as when it's done by their opponent as it's embarrassing and it's not what people paid to see. It's poor sportsmanship and cheating end of story.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Philly06Cup

Why is diving cheating. Why is it classless. Someone explain.

Call me old fashion, but there needs to be a pureness of effort. In short taking a dive is taking the easy way out.


Diving is one of the main reasons I hate soccer so much. The sport lacks effort. Instead of trying hard to win the ball, or get past the player they dive.

For Size:

Spoiler!

This happened in a game:


The player was called out by public opinion, which resulted in his statement:


http://www.rugbydump.com/2014/05/373...final?page=all

I don't want hockey to turn into a sport where effort is bypassed to gain an advantage.

Has Neal come out to say sorry?

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by AcGold

Atleast I can handle others having contrary opinions like an adult unlike many on this forum.

Sometimes you come across as a petulant child in your posts.

[OzSome]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Call me old fashion, but there needs to be a pureness of effort. In short taking a dive is taking the easy way out.


Diving is one of the main reasons I hate soccer so much. The sport lacks effort. Instead of trying hard to win the ball, or get past the player they dive.

I don't want hockey to turn into a sport where effort is bypassed to gain an advantage.

Has Neal come out to say sorry?

I am the same way. I cannot watch soccer because of the diving and acting crap. So one guy felt someone behind him then goes down like he's been shot then started putting his hand in his face like someone smacked him in a face.

Problem is the ref buys it and give a penalty to an opponent. What I hate the most is because of that penalty it resulted in a goal. No need for that crap in hockey. Neal is such a big guy and falling like someone whacked him in a knee is just f-ing annoying.

[stone hands]

I'm sure this is going to dissuade players from trying to embellish to give their teams powerplays, great job nhl

that will show james neal, who's 5,000,000 salary means that this fine is a whole 3% of the 61,000 he earned for that one game

what a joke, why bother fining these guys at all. does anyone think these guys really care about being shamed/what people think of them?

[codynw]

Originally Posted by stone hands

I'm sure this is going to dissuade players from trying to embellish to give their teams powerplays, great job nhl

that will show james neal, who's 5,000,000 salary means that this fine is a whole 3% of the 61,000 he earned for that one game

what a joke, why bother fining these guys at all. does anyone think these guys really care about being shamed/what people think of them?

I think there are two things here that will improve the diving problem.

1. They get a reputation, so refs are less willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.

2. Coach fines. Think the coach will be happy losing money because of a player's garbage?

[flylock shox]

Originally Posted by codynw

I think there are two things here that will improve the diving problem.

1. They get a reputation, so refs are less willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.

2. Coach fines. Think the coach will be happy losing money because of a player's garbage?

I still think suspension is the best way to go, but maybe that's a step the league takes if player (and then coach) fines prove ineffective.