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Old 03-16-2017, 11:45 AM   #1321
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I'm not much for following spring training baseball, but how have the Jays pitchers been doing? Especially the rotation, are they looking solid so far?
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:50 AM   #1322
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I'm not much for following spring training baseball, but how have the Jays pitchers been doing? Especially the rotation, are they looking solid so far?
Starters are looking quite good, but Happ hasn't looked great. Haven't been following the bullpen much.
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Old 03-16-2017, 01:04 PM   #1323
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I think the worst thing Rogers does is auto play video when you click on one of their Sportsnet articles.
For that alone they should be condemned.
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Old 03-16-2017, 01:12 PM   #1324
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I think the worst thing Rogers does is auto play video when you click on one of their Sportsnet articles.
For that alone they should be condemned.
I don't usually defend Rogers, but i'll take that over the constant commercials before each and every video you watch on TSN even if you just let the next video play manually. Absolutely brutal. A man can only take the same Dodge Ram commercial so many times.
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Old 03-16-2017, 02:09 PM   #1325
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Just read up on the Sanchez situation. How does Atkins and Rogers not know that building some goodwill with a player, a star player in fact, is essential if they want to resign him long term down the road?!?!? Stop nickeling and diming our best starter last year so you can save what? $300k? At least try and pretend we can potentially sign Sanchez long term in a few years’ time.
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Old 03-16-2017, 02:39 PM   #1326
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Just read up on the Sanchez situation. How does Atkins and Rogers not know that building some goodwill with a player, a star player in fact, is essential if they want to resign him long term down the road?!?!? Stop nickeling and diming our best starter last year so you can save what? $300k? At least try and pretend we can potentially sign Sanchez long term in a few years’ time.


Oh Noez!1!1!! Agent is pissy about team renewing a players contract and not giving him a raise that they didn't have to...

http://articles.latimes.com/2013/mar...tract-20130302

... nowz no one willz sign with us everz!!!11!!!

http://www.si.com/mlb/strike-zone/20...year-extension

__________________________________________________ _____________

This is how baseball teams operate. The don't have ELC's or RFA's like hockey does so instead you get cheap pre-arb deals subject to renewal and arb rights in lieu of restricted free agency. If Boras and Sanchez want more money upfront they can sit down with the Jays and discuss signing an extension that goes into some of his UFA years. Until then his contract get's renewed and then they negotiate (or go to arb on a yearly basis).

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Old 03-16-2017, 03:56 PM   #1327
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Oh Noez!1!1!! Agent is pissy about team renewing a players contract and not giving him a raise that they didn't have to...

http://articles.latimes.com/2013/mar...tract-20130302

... nowz no one willz sign with us everz!!!11!!!

http://www.si.com/mlb/strike-zone/20...year-extension

__________________________________________________ _____________

This is how baseball teams operate. The don't have ELC's or RFA's like hockey does so instead you get cheap pre-arb deals subject to renewal and arb rights in lieu of restricted free agency. If Boras and Sanchez want more money upfront they can sit down with the Jays and discuss signing an extension that goes into some of his UFA years. Until then his contract get's renewed and then they negotiate (or go to arb on a yearly basis).
No, that's not how baseball operates, that's how the Blue Jays operate. This is a completely different animal than arbitration. If this is how baseball operates, why did the Cubs not take that approach with Bryant? How come the Mets didn't take the approach with Syndergaard? How come the Marlins didn't take that approach with Jose Fernandez? If it's common practice, why are we only hearing about it with Sanchez

The Jays have pissed off their star pitcher, and damaged their reputation once again over what? Chump change like a $100,000? This isn't signing Edwin to an 80M dollar contact or Price to a 225M dollar contract. This is essentially telling a guy who you are going to rely on for the next 3 years and will be plastering his face all over the country as the part of the core of the Jays to piss off. This is the one player who can make or break the Jays season and he willingly allowed himself to be sent to the minors last year at his own cost to benefit the team.

In 2020 we'll be getting the same sob story on Sanchez on how he just wanted too much and they tried, but honestly how can you expect anyone to be even willing to take one cent less to stay in Toronto when the ball is in their court when this how they get treated when it isn't?

I really don't see how anyone can defend this move. It's ridiculously shortsighted and looks bad on the organization, regardless of all of our thoughts on Boras and what a parasite he is.
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Old 03-16-2017, 04:20 PM   #1328
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If it's common practice, why are we only hearing about it with Sanchez
... so you're just going to completely ignore that I link to an article about the Angels doing that exact thing with Mike "The Best Player in Baseball and Maybe of All Time" Trout? Okey, then.

Last year the New York "more money then god" Yankee's renewed Betances at league min. Jacob deGrom had his contract renewed by the Mets. Year in, year out lot's of ballplayers have their contracts renewed at a price they did not negotiate. The reason why your hearing about it now... because Scott Boras wants to complain about it.

Seriously if you think this is solely a Blue Jay thing then you're drinking more Boras Kool-Aid then is healthy.
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Old 03-16-2017, 04:28 PM   #1329
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... so you're just going to completely ignore that I link to an article about the Angels doing that exact thing with Mike "The Best Player in Baseball and Maybe of All Time" Trout? Okey, then.

Last year the New York "more money then god" Yankee's renewed Betances at league min. Jacob deGrom had his contract renewed by the Mets. Year in, year out lot's of ballplayers have their contracts renewed at a price they did not negotiate. The reason why your hearing about it now... because Scott Boras wants to complain about it.

Seriously if you think this is solely a Blue Jay thing then you're drinking more Boras Kool-Aid then is healthy.
The Mets gave Degrom a raise when they renewed his contract despite him rejecting their original offer on principle.

And guess what, the Yankees pay top dollar, so they need not worry about getting a player to take a bit less to resign with them. The Jays aren't in that boat. They need players to take a little cut sometimes to stay, and they sure as hell aren't going to do that when games are played with them like this.
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Old 03-16-2017, 05:02 PM   #1330
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By the way, what has Boras upset isn't what the Jays offered (most teams do that and the players rejects it on principle), it's that the Jays went and reduced their renewal all the way down to league minimum. Very few teams outside of the Tampa Bay Devil Rays of the world do that, and that's mostly because of necessity. Most teams just renew them at the original offer.

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Old 03-16-2017, 05:10 PM   #1331
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The Mets gave Degrom a raise when they renewed his contract despite him rejecting their original offer on principle.
Sounds like a good reason to never accept the offer the Mets make. Look, the players have zero leverage, it's an ELC in all but name. Let me ask you this... what did Sanchez get by saying no to the raise that the Jays didn't even need to make? The Jays have a formula they use to determine pre-arb salaries... I assume this is known amoung agents and players so why turn down more money knowing you get less? Because Bores wanted to complain about it to the media to get his other clients more money since other teams might rather pay the money then deal with Bores running his mouth.

Sorry, 100% agree with the Jays here. Bores was going to whine about you to the media regardless of whether you stuck to your business practices or not, why reward Sanchez for giving him the excuse to do so?

If Sanchez wants a raise more so then the Jays are prepared to offer then work out an extension in lieu of getting renewed. Don't reject the raise and send out your pit bull of an agent to whine about it. Really, if you're all that interested in getting a raise publically complaining about your employer ain't the usual way to go about it so there's some bad faith going on there as far as I'm concerned

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Old 03-16-2017, 05:13 PM   #1332
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Sounds like a good reason to never accept the offer the Mets make. Look, the players have zero leverage, it's an ELC in all but name. Let me ask you this... what did Sanchez get by saying no to the raise that the Jays didn't even need to make? The Jays have a formula they use to determine pre-arb salaries... I assume this is known amoung agents and players so why turn down more money knowing you get less? Because Bores wanted to complain about it to the media to get his other clients more money since other teams might rather pay the money then deal with Bores running his mouth.

Sorry, 100% agree with the Jays here. Boruscki was going to whine about you to the media regardless of whether you stuck to your business practices or not, why reward Sanchez for giving him the excuse to do so?

If Sanchez wants a raise more so then the Jays are prepared to offer then work out an extension in lieu of getting renewed. Don't reject the raise and send out your pit bull of an agent to whine about it. Really, if you're all that interested in getting a raise publically complaining about your employer ain't the usual way to go about it so there's some bad faith going on there as far as I'm concerned
You are not getting it. The Jays were well within their rights to do what they did. This usually plays out by the player rejecting to show he's no happy, and than the team renews them at a little less than the offer. The Jays actually renewed Sanchez at LEAGUE MINIMUM. That's the insult.

Steve Phillips seems to agree with that.

http://www.tsn.ca/talent/jays-strate...ition-1.698521
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Old 03-17-2017, 08:30 AM   #1333
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http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/1...-renew-minimum

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Aaron Sanchez says there are "no hard feelings" after the Toronto Blue Jays renewed his contract for the minimum salary of $535,000 in the major leagues and $304,444 in the unlikely event he is sent to the minors.
I guess he's okay with it and Boras is just being a typical hard ass agent trying to put the team on blast.

I can see some argue the quotation marks around "no hard feelings" to the same effect as Spicer defending "wiretapp" (sic) tweet by Trump.
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Old 03-17-2017, 09:38 AM   #1334
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You are not getting it. The Jays were well within their rights to do what they did. This usually plays out by the player rejecting to show he's no happy, and than the team renews them at a little less than the offer. The Jays actually renewed Sanchez at LEAGUE MINIMUM. That's the insult.

Steve Phillips seems to agree with that.

http://www.tsn.ca/talent/jays-strate...ition-1.698521
Your reaction is exactly what Boras was after. It's a PR strategy where Boras is trying to make the Jays uncomfortable by bringing media pressure.

It's a non-issue that has become an issue by Boras' strategic move
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Old 03-17-2017, 10:00 AM   #1335
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Your reaction is exactly what Boras was after. It's a PR strategy where Boras is trying to make the Jays uncomfortable by bringing media pressure.

It's a non-issue that has become an issue by Boras' strategic move
I don't care about Boras or Sanchez, the minute Sanchez took on Boras there was no way he was a long term Blue Jay and as far as i'm concerned they should milk him for everything he has for the rest of his tenure in Toronto. They should have at least given him the original offer though.

What I do care about is the message it sends to future draft picks. If i'm on the fence about signing with the Jays or re-entering the MLB draft, seeing them take a commodity like Sanchez down to minimum after he rejected their offer wouldn't sit well with me. There's only a couple instances out there in recent times where this has been done to high end players. One with Pittsburgh (Gerrit Cole) and the Yankees (Betances). The rest either get a bump or at a minimum, the qualifying offer that was originally extended. Syndergaard, Betts, Correa, Bryant, Fernandez, are all recent examples of this.
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Old 03-17-2017, 10:12 AM   #1336
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http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/1...-renew-minimum



I guess he's okay with it and Boras is just being a typical hard ass agent trying to put the team on blast.

I can see some argue the quotation marks around "no hard feelings" to the same effect as Spicer defending "wiretapp" (sic) tweet by Trump.
I'm sure lots of people are "OK" with the nickle and diming that is going on right now in the workplace now to, because they aren't in a position to do anything about it. When things turn around though, and control shifts to the workforce, you can rest assured they won't forget it and a price will be paid for it.
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Old 03-17-2017, 10:49 AM   #1337
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I'm sure lots of people are "OK" with the nickle and diming that is going on right now in the workplace now to, because they aren't in a position to do anything about it. When things turn around though, and control shifts to the workforce, you can rest assured they won't forget it and a price will be paid for it.
Yes, it's all about revenge.

There are a lot of factors that go into people staying with a company for less because they feel compfortable. Not everyone is looking to "screw" over their employers every chance they get when the ball is in their court.

Also, Sanchez seems more than "ok" I guess. He knows his value to the organization and he will get paid when it's his time.

Quote:
Asked if he felt valued by the organization, Sanchez was adamant that he does.

“Absolutely. I don’t think last year we would have had the conversations we had, we wouldn’t have sat down and did everything we did, if I wasn’t valued and I didn’t feel valued,” he said. “If they didn’t care, we wouldn’t have had the conversations that we had. So, there’s no hard feelings in any of the situation.

“That’s the business side of the game that a lot of people forget about. Because this is a sport. And there is a lot of fun that comes with this game. The business part, that’s stuff that I’ll leave handled with them. I’m out here to work on what I need to work on with the other 24 guys that are behind me. And that’s where I’m headed.”
http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb...g-mlb-minimum/
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Old 03-17-2017, 11:02 AM   #1338
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What I do care about is the message it sends to future draft picks. If i'm on the fence about signing with the Jays or re-entering the MLB draft, seeing them take a commodity like Sanchez down to minimum after he rejected their offer wouldn't sit well with me.
They're not actually taking his salery down (The minimum was lower last year).

Really? Aaron Sanchez turning down a raise is going to cause someone to refuse the big bonus, risk getting drafted at a lower slot at the next eligibility, delay his entry into professional ranks (and in all probability the speed at which he starts earning an MLB salary)? All so that he can maybe sign with some other team who may or may not do the exact same thing? All that because Aaron Sanchez didn't take a raise that is a tiny percentage of his career earnings just to date?

Frankly, I hope the Jays don't draft that person because that person is so dumb that the dumbness is so pronounced that it'll eventually be reflected in on field performance... that or maybe you should stop chicken littling the situation because Scott Bores got all huffy about it.
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Old 03-17-2017, 11:04 AM   #1339
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They're not actually taking his salery down

Really? Aaron Sanchez turning down a raise is going to cause someone to refuse the big bonus, risk getting drafted at a lower slot at the next eligibility, delay his entry into professional ranks (and in all probability the speed at which he starts earning an MLB salary)? All so that he can maybe sign with some other team who may or may not do the exact same thing? All that because Aaron Sanchez didn't take a raise that is a tiny percentage of his career earnings just to date?

Frankly, I hope the Jays don't draft that person because that person is so dumb that the dumbness is so pronounced that it'll eventually be reflected in on field performance... that or maybe you should stop chicken littling the situation because Scott Bores got all huffy about it.
HA! Nail on the head.
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Old 03-17-2017, 11:30 AM   #1340
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Teams do it all the time.

Also a Boras client:

http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/p...ontract-022916
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