Tipping is now at about 20% for good service

[getbak]

Originally Posted by V

Well, the entire system is silly. I'd love to see employers pay their staff so that I don't have to.

They'd just raise their prices to compensate, and you'd pay the same price for horrible service that you now only pay for excellent service.

If you think service in Calgary sucks now, imagine what it would be like if they weren't "hustling" for tips.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by Major Major

As a bartender, the whole thing breaks down pretty easily for me. If people are coming up multiple times to get drinks and they don't leave me a tip, they all of a sudden don't get anymore drinks. Sometimes people get lost in the crowd, and I can't be held responsible if I somehow skip over you repeatedly.
Also, in extreme circumstances, I like to go for the public shaming angle. There is a stigma towards non-tippers as being cheap, so I can have some fun with that. That girl who may have gone home with you. She probably won't now that I loudly ask you to put a total under the tip line that you dashed out on your cc receipt. I understand 100$ + dash equals 100 $, but you never know, I could have some credit card fraud system worked out. It is best that you put down a total so I can't mess with it.
Also, say you come to the bar with your friends after making a fifty dollar drink order that consists of various combinations of citrus garnish, requests detailing the number of splashes of 7up, and perhaps just a cube or 2 less ice. I hope for your sake that you tipped me. For my sake, I hope you didn't, because the 10 dollars is not worth the same as being able to ask a group of people, 'Oh, so you are with picky b*tch-no-tip?' and then move onto the next customer. The looks on people's faces are priceless.

With a fantastic attitude like that I imagine that your career path has peaked at d-bag bartender. Congrats.

[Deegee]

Originally Posted by getbak

They'd just raise their prices to compensate, and you'd pay the same price for horrible service that you now only pay for excellent service.

If you think service in Calgary sucks now, imagine what it would be like if they weren't "hustling" for tips.

I bet service would actually improve if it was combined with good managers as a lot of servers would like knowing how much they are taking home every paycheck and you would have good competition for an acceptable paying job, versus people who concentrate their efforts to find "funny" ways to be an ####### while at work like Major Major who should be looking for a different career line.

EDIT: Boblobla is a much faster typer then I am.

[Machiavelli]

I think I tend to tip female servers less, but that's because a greater proportion of them are terrible at their job.

[dammage79]

Let's not forget those tips also get divided amongst the support staff and bartenders and cooks as well in some places. Add to that the tip out to doorstaff as well. So fifteen percent ends up being in the five to ten percent range at the end of the day. It is circumstantial to the establishment as some places will tip out supports staff a percentage of the sales but I know in most places those tips servers and bartenders get don't 100 percent go to that sole person. So 20 percent would be appropriate if you take all of that into account.

Also most serving staff work limited hours and get paid near minimum wage so yes, in Canadas food and beverage industry it is an expectation to receive tips. Australia and New Zealand pay their staff well and do not allow tips to my knowledge so it is different globally.

[TSXCman]

Originally Posted by Major Major

As a bartender, the whole thing breaks down pretty easily for me. If people are coming up multiple times to get drinks and they don't leave me a tip, they all of a sudden don't get anymore drinks. Sometimes people get lost in the crowd, and I can't be held responsible if I somehow skip over you repeatedly.
Also, in extreme circumstances, I like to go for the public shaming angle. There is a stigma towards non-tippers as being cheap, so I can have some fun with that. That girl who may have gone home with you. She probably won't now that I loudly ask you to put a total under the tip line that you dashed out on your cc receipt. I understand 100$ + dash equals 100 $, but you never know, I could have some credit card fraud system worked out. It is best that you put down a total so I can't mess with it.
Also, say you come to the bar with your friends after making a fifty dollar drink order that consists of various combinations of citrus garnish, requests detailing the number of splashes of 7up, and perhaps just a cube or 2 less ice. I hope for your sake that you tipped me. For my sake, I hope you didn't, because the 10 dollars is not worth the same as being able to ask a group of people, 'Oh, so you are with picky b*tch-no-tip?' and then move onto the next customer. The looks on people's faces are priceless.

Perfect reminder of how pitiful the bar and restaurant service industry is... hope this isn't a long term profession for you.

It's unfortunate of how the tipping system evolved over time in different locations. This I do not fault of the workers, but the act of adding a variable cash amount that is supposed to be a reward for good service, then making it a "standard" regardless of service, then have the gov't tax the worker to an assumed tip amount, then having your employer pay you minimum wage and expect you to make up your wage in tips, and finally produce a bunch of greasy d-bags (male and female) that need to shame you or do illegal things so they can make their nut.

That being said 18-20% seems to be my new standard and all it take is some competence and politeness to earn it.

[GirlySports]

man if I'm tipping 20% even I want the waitress to be hot.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Major Major

As a bartender, the whole thing breaks down pretty easily for me. If people are coming up multiple times to get drinks and they don't leave me a tip, they all of a sudden don't get anymore drinks. Sometimes people get lost in the crowd, and I can't be held responsible if I somehow skip over you repeatedly.
Also, in extreme circumstances, I like to go for the public shaming angle. There is a stigma towards non-tippers as being cheap, so I can have some fun with that. That girl who may have gone home with you. She probably won't now that I loudly ask you to put a total under the tip line that you dashed out on your cc receipt. I understand 100$ + dash equals 100 $, but you never know, I could have some credit card fraud system worked out. It is best that you put down a total so I can't mess with it.
Also, say you come to the bar with your friends after making a fifty dollar drink order that consists of various combinations of citrus garnish, requests detailing the number of splashes of 7up, and perhaps just a cube or 2 less ice. I hope for your sake that you tipped me. For my sake, I hope you didn't, because the 10 dollars is not worth the same as being able to ask a group of people, 'Oh, so you are with picky b*tch-no-tip?' and then move onto the next customer. The looks on people's faces are priceless.

Being a dickwad to your customers is not going to gain you any support. An attitude like yours can spread quicky and hurt the owner of the bar and his bottom line when customers go elsewhere for a few drinks.

[MarchHare]

How timely that this thread would pop up at the same time I've been enjoying this series of blog posts from restaurateur Jay Porter. In it, he describes the results of his multi-year experiment in which he owned two establishments in San Diego; one where he used the traditional tipping model, and one where he paid his staff a living wage and had a strictly enforced "no tips" policy, instead opting for an 18% service charge. In these blog posts, he clearly outlines why the tipping system doesn't work and how -- contrary to popular belief -- it actually provides an economic incentive for servers to provide worse customer service (a given waiter/waitress will take home more money at the end of the night if he/she handles a greater number of tables, thus reducing the amount of attention devoted to any one table).

The series is really fascinating and should be read by anyone before commenting in this thread.

Link to part 1: http://jayporter.com/dispatches/obse...rt-1-overview/

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

With a fantastic attitude like that I imagine that your career path has peaked at d-bag bartender. Congrats.

Woah, easy there. I'm just trying to provide an alternate perspective. When these tipping discussions come up, the service industry crowd seems to be under represented. It's not easy dealing with drunks A holes, so sometimes you need to be a bit of an A hole back. If you can't relate to that in your line of work, than maybe I have the wrong two degrees as I am at times required to be a pric in my grownup job as well.

Frankly, your post implies that there is something wrong with making a career in the service industry, or that you are somehow above that. This is an underlying attitude that is prevalent, and perhaps a reason why there can be ideological battles between a server, bartender, etc. and the customer when it comes to tipping. What is inherent in the attitude that those in the hospitality industry are working inferior jobs is the subsequent shock upon learning they make a very decent living. Trying to resolve this inner-conflict yourself through reaching justifications at not tipping should result in you being embarrassed.

I'm sorry, it is a guilty pleasure of mine. I didn't overcharge or underpour, which is a far easier and less satisfying revenge, but also deceitful and dishonest to both my employer and the customer.

Anyhow, your post had some unwarranted assumptions in it, so I'm guessing I struck a nerve or something. Just so you know, I've known people who spent their entire careers in hospitality, pursued exciting ventures within that realm, and lived very fulfilling and well-travelled lives. I know people who are in this industry while they bust their ass through law school or med school and many other high academic pursuits. And I have known flat out loser D bags, so maybe you have met too many of those.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by TSXCman

Perfect reminder of how pitiful the bar and restaurant service industry is... hope this isn't a long term profession for you.

It's unfortunate of how the tipping system evolved over time in different locations. This I do not fault of the workers, but the act of adding a variable cash amount that is supposed to be a reward for good service, then making it a "standard" regardless of service, then have the gov't tax the worker to an assumed tip amount, then having your employer pay you minimum wage and expect you to make up your wage in tips, and finally produce a bunch of greasy d-bags (male and female) that need to shame you or do illegal things so they can make their nut.

That being said 18-20% seems to be my new standard and all it take is some competence and politeness to earn it.

Wow? Pitiful? Doing illegal things to make your nut? Fairly naive sentiment based on my tame anecdotes depicting me following proper credit payment procedure, with the side effect of pointing out to that person and people in that area realizing that they just didn't tip on 100$, and also calling a bitch a bitch. Sorry, the bar industry may just be a little too dark and seedy for you.

[Slava]

Just out of curiosity, how much should I tip if I wait at the bar and grab say 2 beers? I want to tip zero...I mean really, what great service am I getting? I'm not trying to be difficult here either, and not trying to be rude but really this bugs me. Same for the halfway house at the golf course, or wherever else.

I totally get that some guy might sit at the bar and have you solve all his problems for him...he should tip. Me walking up and buying a beer though?

I accidentally tipped a guy $0.12 yesterday. I say accidentally because I meant to tip zero, but the ridiculous debit machine wouldn't let me past the screen. I hate the tip option being everywhere now.

[gottabekd]

Not related to restaurant tipping, but I think a good enough place to jump in with another tipping question.

Do you/how much/how are you expected to tip hotel maids? I'm absolutely clueless if this is a thing that 95% of people do, or 5%. Or maybe this is a regional thing. I don't stay in hotels very often, so I never know what the expected protocol is.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by Dion

Being a dickwad to your customers is not going to gain you any support. An attitude like yours can spread quicky and hurt the owner of the bar and his bottom line when customers go elsewhere for a few drinks.

While I do understand your point Dion, and you are 100% correct at a glance of my post, there are times, in any industry, where the party providing service can draws a line in the sand and tells the customer to go eff themselves. Call it entitlement if you want, but if you are forced into business deals by your employer that you lose money in personally, even though you have zero stake in the business, you have the right to call a spade a spade. Also, my employer has the right to fire me if he gets too many complaints. I have worked in the service industry for 7 years at three different places and received 2 customer complaints that were unrelated to me being a 'dikwad'. Have been fired zero times and been lauded for customer service at every step, but I am selectively a dickwad and will not apologize for it.

[sun]

I pretty much tip 15% good service or bad. 20% seems excessive.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by Slava

Just out of curiosity, how much should I tip if I wait at the bar and grab say 2 beers? I want to tip zero...I mean really, what great service am I getting? I'm not trying to be difficult here either, and not trying to be rude but really this bugs me. Same for the halfway house at the golf course, or wherever else.

I totally get that some guy might sit at the bar and have you solve all his problems for him...he should tip. Me walking up and buying a beer though?

I accidentally tipped a guy $0.12 yesterday. I say accidentally because I meant to tip zero, but the ridiculous debit machine wouldn't let me past the screen. I hate the tip option being everywhere now.

I understand why you wouldn't feel the need to tip on two beers. I mean, all I really do is turn around and grab two beers, open them, tell you how much it is, smile, and make your change.

If this is how you feel, I'm likely not going to convince you that you should give me a dollar per drink, but that would be about standard.

If you don't tip in that situation though, no one is going to jump down your throat. Just don't do it ten times in a night. I mean, I know it doesn't sound like much, but I pay a quarter to serve you those two beers. It is a culture thing too... the bartender, rightly or wrongly, is the last person you want to be annoying in a bar. Not that getting two tipless beers would elicit any real annoyance... tipping 12 cents might though...

[polak]

18% for good service and my standards are usually pretty broad. To get more than that it'd have to be pretty great service (... ... ...a.k.a. cute waitress that flirts back) and to get less it'd have to be pretty bad. I don't think I've ever tipped less than 15% at a sit down restaurant.

[CaramonLS]

Servers in the US make 2-4x less per hour than ones in Alberta do before their tip, yet we still are expected to tip the same as our US counterparts?

[You Need a Thneed]

At Chili's this eve, the preset tipping options were 15%, 20%, and 25%. I picked other. I should have lowered my tip simply because of the 25% preset.

[Northendzone]

Has not tipping really c@ckblocked somebody.

Anyways, when I start getting a 15% bonus, then I'll tip more.