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Old 03-23-2017, 08:48 AM   #41
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Joe Nieuwendyk had Loob, previously a playmaking centre, on his wing. Why not try Janko in a similar role?
That's how I hope it plays out. 13 with 23, 3M line stays together, Bennett and Jankowksi are a pair.
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Old 03-23-2017, 08:53 AM   #42
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I'm not sure I agree with this. If the game is going too fast for him, why is he getting a lot of PK time, he has been doing great there btw. If he can handle speed on the PK, he can certainly handle it on the PP.
PK time though is just a lot of stick swinging and firing loose pucks towards the other end. There isn't any expectation of puck possession while killing a penalty.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree with the poster you quoted. I just don't think PK time is a good judge of a players hockey sense, when more often than not it's just a guy who is tenacious and has a quick first few steps. Lance Bouma kills penalties too.
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Old 03-23-2017, 09:21 AM   #43
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While the optimism about Bennett around here is admirable, he clearly is disappointing at this stage in his career. Right now there is very little to suggest that he will live up to his draft status. He currently looks more like a Stajan than a Gilmour.

I still have hope that he can bust out but theres not a lot of evidence to make one optimistic, despite what is said on this board. His stats are brutal from every angle, both traditional and fancy. I get the linemate argument but as previously mentioned, other centers have had bad linemates and still found a way to produce, whether it be through points or corsi.

Still much too early to call him a bust obviously, but if he was an Oiler thats exactly what everyone here would be calling him.
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Old 03-23-2017, 09:33 AM   #44
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While I understand that people are worried about Bennett's production, I am surprised that some (not all) are ignoring the obvious comparison in our own backyard. Mikael Backlund has turned into an indispensable forward getting mention for the Selke when years prior it wasn't clear whether he would continue as a Flame. If we stuck Bennett on the 1st or 2nd line as a winger, he would probably be quite comparable so Bingo's point remains valid. Another element is that Bennett is learning to drive the play of his own line, which it took Backlund several years to learn. I think over the next few years, we will start to see Bennett's line take over dominance similar to how Backlund's line has become the #1.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:16 AM   #45
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PK time though is just a lot of stick swinging and firing loose pucks towards the other end. There isn't any expectation of puck possession while killing a penalty.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree with the poster you quoted. I just don't think PK time is a good judge of a players hockey sense, when more often than not it's just a guy who is tenacious and has a quick first few steps. Lance Bouma kills penalties too.
Ha I'm not sure I agree with me either, just an observation I can't shake.
Very few 20 or under players have had significant impact at center in the NHL. It's is such a difficult position.
Scheifele is an excellent example of the virtue of patience with young centers.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:17 AM   #46
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Ha I'm not sure I agree with me either, just an observation I can't shake.

Very few 20 or under players have had significant impact at center in the NHL. It's is such a difficult position.

Scheifele is an excellent example of the virtue of patience with young centers.


Oh man if Bennett could follow the Scheifele development path that would make me so happy. Especially if we had him locked in on a reasonable deal. We would be unstoppable

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Old 03-23-2017, 10:24 AM   #47
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Bennett's just making sure we have a new Elite player coming every year for us on the road to the cup.
2013 - Monahan
2014 - Gaudreau
2015 - Hamilton
2016 - Tkachuk
2017 - Bennett
2018 - Jankowski
2019 - Kylington

etc
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:28 AM   #48
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Here's what we need to do... get rid of Troy Brouwer.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/show...016-17&sit=5v5

It's stunning how much worse everyone get's when they're on the ice with Troy Brouwer.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:41 AM   #49
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Here's what we need to do... get rid of Troy Brouwer.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/show...016-17&sit=5v5

It's stunning how much worse everyone get's when they're on the ice with Troy Brouwer.
McCurdy rules with his visualizations. Charts like that hurt my head.


Bottom left equal bad, top right equal good.
Blue with Brouwer, red without Brouwer.

But this is a Bennett, not Brouwer thread, so no more derailing from me.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:50 AM   #50
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Tkachuk and Bennett are interesting comparables because they play such different styles. Tkachuk has a knack for soft spots, slowing the game down, and finding seams. He's not a quick skater by any means but sees the ice so effectively he doesn't have to be.

Bennett, on the other hand, seems to want to take his play TO the game and the result is forcing a lot of things that aren't there. Linemates with little offensive ability probably compound this result, as they are not doing things like getting into open areas, making smart pick plays, and so on.

I think the analogy is how much Chaisson brought down Gaudreau and Monahan early in the year. They weren't helping themselves a whole lot either, but having a crash-and-bang winger with stone hands and a cement head (seriously, does anyone go inexplicably offside as much as Chaisson?) definitely hurt matters.

I get why they're effectively asking Bennett to learn how to play with average, mediocre or worse offensive players. Once he gets some time with good players it will be like a revelation, and his play on Tuesday didn't fall far short of revelatory.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:57 AM   #51
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But this is a Bennett, not Brouwer thread, so no more derailing from me.
But they're related. Not to suggest that Bennett's troubles this year are solely due to Brouwer (They're not) but near everyone who plays with Brouwer has been the dogs breakfast and Bennett hasn't played with any skater more then Troy Brouwer.

Replace Brouwer with someone that can skate of 3rd line or higher quality and Bennett looks way better. I mean at this point I'm basically praying that McPhee liked him (Brouwer) when he was with the Capitals and Treliving is smart enough to not protect him.
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Old 03-23-2017, 11:05 AM   #52
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^ gotcha.
As was speculated here, it makes sense that Bennet was shifted to the '4th' line a couple games bsck simply to get him away from Brouwer.
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Old 03-23-2017, 11:07 AM   #53
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Interesting chart. The only thing I have a bit of an issue with is that many of the blue guys were playing with Brouwer at a time the team collectively sucked. So yeah, their numbers were down then, but it's not 100% certain it was on Brouwer as opposed to that they themselves were bad at that time.
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Old 03-23-2017, 11:20 AM   #54
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But they're related. Not to suggest that Bennett's troubles this year are solely due to Brouwer (They're not) but near everyone who plays with Brouwer has been the dogs breakfast and Bennett hasn't played with any skater more then Troy Brouwer.

Replace Brouwer with someone that can skate of 3rd line or higher quality and Bennett looks way better. I mean at this point I'm basically praying that McPhee liked him (Brouwer) when he was with the Capitals and Treliving is smart enough to not protect him.
I don't want to derail this thread, but I think it is important to keep in mind that Brouwer looked a hell of a lot better in the early part of the season before his hand injury. Some of this has to do with playing with Tkachuk and Bennett, but I don't think we should overlook the real possibility that he has been affected all year by lingering effects of his injury.

In short, I am not ready to offload Brouwer at all costs. It has been an awful year for him (which happens to a lot of players), and I am eager to see how he will respond with a clean slate next season.
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Old 03-23-2017, 11:21 AM   #55
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Interesting chart. The only thing I have a bit of an issue with is that many of the blue guys were playing with Brouwer at a time the team collectively sucked. So yeah, their numbers were down then, but it's not 100% certain it was on Brouwer as opposed to that they themselves were bad at that time.
But the chart shows all the Flames' forwards who have been on the ice with Brouwer. He has been playing with somebody the whole season, and that somebody has always done worse with him than without him. (Except Hathaway and Shinkaruk, who kind of went sideways; but those are small sample sizes.)

Versteeg and Bennett, you'll note, are both vastly improved when not playing with Brouwer.
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Old 03-23-2017, 11:36 AM   #56
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Chiasson has looked good lately. Versteeg - Bennett - Chiasson could work.
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Old 03-23-2017, 01:09 PM   #57
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Joe Nieuwendyk had Loob, previously a playmaking centre, on his wing. Why not try Janko in a similar role?
Jankowski is more of a natural, playmaking centre. One of his strengths in college was faceoffs. IMO his game is better suited down the middle. He brings that size at centre that you love especially if he continues to fill out and add man strength.

Bennett has a lot of attributes that would make sense as a winger. Good speed down the wing. Good tenacity and fight along the boards. A willingness to try and take defencemen on.

If we're moving any of our young centres to the wing I think Bennett makes the most sense. If they don't move Bennett to the wing then Jankowski is looking like a trade chip I guess.

If they do put Bennett back at centre I'd like to see Tkachuk moved to his line to help kickstart it

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Old 03-23-2017, 01:20 PM   #58
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I'm really not worried about Sam Bennett's production this season as he has shown flashes of offensive brilliance in the past. We can probably just chalk this one up as a sophomore jinx season which in terms of timing, sort of works out financially as his next contract should be a very reasonable cap hit.

To me, Sam Bennett has struggled mightily transitioning the puck from the defensive zone to the offensive zone. He's had a hard time distributing the puck to his wingers or carrying the puck into the offensive zone and creating from there. As we saw in the last game, when Sam Bennett isn't responsible to be the main puck distributor, he can be extremely effective as he can just read and react rather than think the game so much.

At this point I'm all for playing Sam Bennett as a winger because the game seems to come to him more naturally there. I don't know why the organization is so adamant on keeping him at center when we have a perfectly developing 3rd line center in Mark Jankowski performaning admirably down in Stockton. He's a bigger body who skates well and is actually older than Sam Bennett. I ultimately see Jankowski being the team's #3 centerman which pushes Bennett to wing.
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Old 03-23-2017, 01:22 PM   #59
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If they do put Bennett back at centre I'd like to see Tkachuk moved to his line to help kickstart it
I've wrestled with this.

If Backlund/Frolik didn't miss a beat without Tkachuk then what does that say?

Can you get away with say Versteeg with the pair, move Tkachuk down and create three good lines? Or does Tkachuk without the pair drop quite a bit making the third line a nightmare?
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Old 03-23-2017, 01:24 PM   #60
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I'm really not worried about Sam Bennett's production this season as he has shown flashes of offensive brilliance in the past. We can probably just chalk this one up as a sophomore jinx season which in terms of timing, sort of works out financially as his next contract should be a very reasonable cap hit.
Yeah I'm not worried either.

I'd rather have that raw skill guy that looks amazing at 18 and then takes a step back from confidence then the big junior scorer that has yet to put it together at the NHL level.

I'll take glimpses and spurts over out and out waiting any time.
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