Arizona execution lasts nearly two hours

[Arya Stark]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Slavery would be a "scary" word to apply to it, but their criminals, whatever their punishment is, it shouldn't be fun.

But I agree those would be concerns. You'd have to have the parole board be a completely separate entity (not sure how that works right now) and any company participating would have to be of the understanding that any labor needs which arent met by the prisons will have to made up by company employees at market wages. They would still save huge dollars regardless.

But yeah, I wouldn't put a lot of trust in those people either. But at least this way they wouldn't be actually enslaving Malaysian people. And I know those people would otherwise not have work, but there may be alternatives to that too.

It's not an easy problem thats for sure.

In my opinion, you don't put them to work for Nike, you let the government run it and all their work would be for the government and paid by the government and their earnings go to a victim fund.

Let them clean streets, shovel snow, pick up garbage. You need these jobs anyways, might as well make prisoners work.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Arya Stark

In my opinion, you don't put them to work for Nike, you let the government run it and all their work would be for the government and paid by the government and their earnings go to a victim fund.

Let them clean streets, shovel snow, pick up garbage. You need these jobs anyways, might as well make prisoners work.

Haha! Okay, and you can negotiate with the Unions that represent the workers that currently do those jobs.

Good luck.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Arya Stark

In my opinion, you don't put them to work for Nike, you let the government run it and all their work would be for the government and paid by the government and their earnings go to a victim fund.

Let them clean streets, shovel snow, pick up garbage. You need these jobs anyways, might as well make prisoners work.

Law abiding people need those jobs to support themselves. The last thing we need is more unemployed people without skills (many of whom might end up in prison without a job).

I think the minute we make it advantageous to have criminals, we would be going down a dark path.

[CaptainCrunch]

I have no trouble with the death penalty for particularly heinous crimes. multiple murders, sexual crimes against Children where death is involved are examples where its time to escort the criminal off of this mortal coil, and only in crimes where you have multiple points of corroboration, DNA, witnesses to the crime, forensic evidence.

In this guys case, for some reason it doesn't disturb me much. The guy was scum plain and simple, and he did his best to twist the knife a little deeper with his final words.

I don't know if he suffered in this death or not, we can talk about how long it took, but he got a massive dose of sedatives and his body fought on.

But if they're going to continue to practice the death penalty they have to find a sure fire way of causing death. using a high speed car crusher would probably do it.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Arya Stark

In my opinion, you don't put them to work for Nike, you let the government run it and all their work would be for the government and paid by the government and their earnings go to a victim fund.

Let them clean streets, shovel snow, pick up garbage. You need these jobs anyways, might as well make prisoners work.

that's work that normal people can do and get paid to do it. With these offenders if your going to leave them alive then do what they did in the old days with the worst offenders. On the first day of the sentence you give them a shovel, they have that day to dig their new hole. At sunset, you put them in that hole and put the bars over top of the hole. They get a bucket, they can use it to bail out their hole during a rain storm, get rid of their waste, use it as a soup bowl, or a sittin stool.

[MolsonInBothHands]

Originally Posted by Locke

Haha! Okay, and you can negotiate with the Unions that represent the workers that currently do those jobs.

Good luck.

The key would be to find work for them that nobody in society would ever want to do, and no union would compete for - executioners? Many of them already have previous experience.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by Arya Stark

And people look at public hangings on the other side of the world as barbaric while this goes on next door.

At least when you are hanged (hung?) you die almost instantly.

You obviously haven't checked out hangings in Iran, there's nothing instant about them. when you see the 100's people cheering as the poor victim struggles to breath for 20 minutes before he dies you'll probably want to drop a nuke on them to end everyone's human suffering.

[JeanLucPicard]

This shouldn't even call for a debate over the issue of death penalty. Why not just make...better lethal injections that won't let this type of incidents happen. Debating is too easy, making more efficient product isn't.

[Dion]

Death Penalty – a Barbaric Society

Defenders of the death penalty claim this punishment is a deterrent for future criminals. However, the General Assembly of the United Nations recently stated, “There is no conclusive evidence of the deterrent value of the death penalty.” When a human is in the throes of rage, uncontrollable deviance, or passion, it is unlikely the threat of a future execution enters into his or her mind. Mental illness plays a role many times, as do drugs and alcohol. A 2009 study conducted by The Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology showed that 88 percent of criminologists asked felt that executions do not lower homicide rates. This would leave some wondering if it is not just a matter of an outdated barbaric revenge.

Since 1973, 133 people have been set free from death rows across the nation for wrongful conviction. These convictions, for one reason or another, were the result of poor judgment and a slanted judicial system. In this country, it is said we are all innocent until proven guilty. However, with media so readily available to broadcast each notion an investigator has and with every gory detail of a crime painted in newspapers and magazines, a fair trial seems almost futile. A jury of peers having the ability to form an untainted, unbiased opinion seems inconceivable.

Sending someone to death row in the United States costs roughly $5 million, because the government takes the burden of paying for both sides. With appeals, and execution costs, death row is around $4 million more than an adult serving life in prison.

For some reason in this country, killing an individual deemed unfit for society has a band aid effect. The logic behind playing God is to teach society a lesson, but the reality is truly retaliatory. The same logic is seen in parents who hit their kids for hitting someone else. It just does not work. Sure, the child may not hit; but instead hold in a rage that leads to later aggression and violence. In our judicial system, we do not rape rapists, make drunk drivers stand in front of a speeding car, or chop off the thieving hands of someone who robs a bank. For some reasons unknown, we resort to a barbaric society when man kills man. We step into the shoes of a God and pass an irreversible judgment to mask our pain or disdain. We take away the life of another who may or may not be guilty of a crime and we do it with smiles on our faces. Who knows how many executed men and women lay beneath the ground for a crime they did not commit, all for the sake of satisfaction.

http://guardianlv.com/2013/10/death-...baric-society/

[metallicat]

Originally Posted by JeanLucPicard

This shouldn't even call for a debate over the issue of death penalty. Why not just make...better lethal injections that won't let this type of incidents happen. Debating is too easy, making more efficient product isn't.

Totally disagree. This thread has outlined numerous reasons as to why we shouldn't have the death penalty at all. This is just a new reason.

[Dion]

[Arya Stark]

Originally Posted by T@T

You obviously haven't checked out hangings in Iran, there's nothing instant about them. when you see the 100's people cheering as the poor victim struggles to breath for 20 minutes before he dies you'll probably want to drop a nuke on them to end everyone's human suffering.

I love how your solutions for the Middle East is always "drop a nuke on them".

Seems like you have a lot of hatred in your heart.

[JeanLucPicard]

Originally Posted by oilers_fan

Totally disagree. This thread has outlined numerous reasons as to why we shouldn't have the death penalty at all. This is just a new reason.

Don't you think though that the actual issue gets buried when a story like this causes an uproar about death penalty? Its as if people need anything even remotely related to the topic to start debating. By all means there should continue to be a debate - ranging from a forum level all the way to supreme courts - on death penalty. BUT, this story in particular, to me is more about lack of proper procedure and equipment in place.

Maybe botched executions are a rare event, so there is not much to discuss about it unless one is really knowledgable about it?

[Zulu29]

Should be saved for extreme cases like Clifford Olson types where there is zero doubt (ie video/DNA/witness evidence/confession- all circumstances combined) It's not so much about retribution but of ridding society of a dangerous predator who can never be reformed.

[DoubleJ96]

I have a hard time feeling sorry for a murder.

[Dion]

[vanisleflamesfan]

Regarding prison labour, it already exists in a MAJOR way in America's (and soon to be Canada's) For-Profit prisons.

Linky

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Teh_Bandwagoner

The article seems to differ from what the radio said. On the radio this morning, they said that the drug they injected the guy with was not used before in Arizona, but used in two other states (looks like Oklahoma and Ohio according to the article). In both those cases, the drug was botched (article says one was due to improper administration?). So if this drug screwed up twice, why did Arizona go ahead with it? Messed up stuff right there.

The article also quotes two anesthetists who suggest the drug(s) acted exactly the way they would have expected them to. Which begs the question then, who picks the drug and dosage?

From the OP link.

Anesthesiology experts say they’re not surprised that the combination of drugs took so long to kill Wood.
“This doesn’t actually sound like a botched execution. This actually sounds like a typical scenario if you used that drug combination,” said Karen Sibert, an anesthesiologist and associate professor at Cedars-Sinai Medical Center. Sibert was speaking on behalf of the California Society of Anesthesiologists.
Sibert said the sedative midazolam would not completely render Wood incapacitated. If he’d felt pain or been conscious, he would have been able to open his eyes and move, she said. The other drug was the painkiller hydromorphone.
“It’s fair to say that those are drugs that would not expeditiously achieve (death),” said Daniel Nyhan, a professor and interim director at the anesthesiology department at Johns Hopkins medical school.

That's a huge statement given that is what they were setting out to do.

[Teh_Bandwagoner]

Originally Posted by DoubleJ96

I have a hard time feeling sorry for a murder.

Man... I really hope you're missing two letters in this statement

[Fozzie_DeBear]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I think the minute we make it advantageous to have criminals, we would be going down a dark path.

The Prison Lobby in the USA says 'Hello'