Edmonton is No Good Episode 4: New Rink, Same Stink

[John Doe]

Originally Posted by AlbertaOiler72

we finished 8th in the league in GF...how is that "overrated"?
the Flames finished 14 in GA with Gio, Brodie and Hamilton and haven't finished top 5 in GA since the Kipper years

no one is claiming the Oilers have a top 5 offense (although we did finish ahead of the Flames last year)...unlike some Flames fans are saying about their defense (although the Oilers finished ahead of them in that category too)

First of all, I don't know of anyone who says that Calgary has a top 5 defense. Defense includes goalies, defensemen, forwards, systems, etc. What many are saying is that the Flames have a good defense corps, possibly one of the top 5 in the NHL. But of course, you already knew that.

Nashville is often credited with one of the best defense corps in the nhl, but by the same reasoning that you are using they are overrated (and not as good as teams such as Columbus, Edmonton, Boston, St. Louis, New York, LA, Ottawa, and even (shudder) Calgary) as Nashville allowed more goals than 15 other teams.

And while no one is claiming that Edmonton has a top 5 offense, many are claiming that the Oiler's top forwards are elite. Using your argument, I "proved" that they aren't, and in fact are overrated and not even as good as Calgary's over the last two years.

I was trying to show that your argument was flawed in it's reasoning but I don't know if I can as I can't really simplify it any more than that.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Oilers93

The Flames D are a big reason why their tending has been average to poor the last few years. They give up way to many quality chances and have to tighten up in their own end.

Our D is a huge reason why Talbot had the year that he had. Yes, he did his part but at the same time the D made it easy for him a lot of nights. The addition of Larsson was huge.

Huh?

What fiction is this.

The Flames gave up less shots per game than the amazing Oilers defence last season that you claim shelters goalies well.

There's a reason no one from the past two seasons that played goal for the Flames was extended. The goaltending absolutely was a downfall.

[saXon]

Love the Oilers fans coming out of the wood works after 10 years of suckitude, off the back of a single outlier season.

Can't wait to see how many stick around when they realize the acquisition of loser points on a surprise season doesn't equal perennial playoff team. My guess is 0. (maybe Oil Stain)

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Oilers93

The Flames D are a big reason why their tending has been average to poor the last few years. They give up way to many quality chances and have to tighten up in their own end.

Our D is a huge reason why Talbot had the year that he had. Yes, he did his part but at the same time the D made it easy for him a lot of nights. The addition of Larsson was huge.

[Love]

Originally Posted by Beninho

Do flames fans join Oilers fan forums? All for intelligent conversations but do these Oiler posters actually come here for conversation or just to spark annoying arguments? Seems to be the latter usually.

inferiority complex

[sempuki]

Originally Posted by John Doe

First of all, I don't know of anyone who says that Calgary has a top 5 defense.

Some people are saying with the addition of Hamonic we are. From my point of view I prefer saying these sort of things *after* the fact -- it's why we play the games. Some people thought Regher, Phaneauf, and Bowmeester would be the second coming, and we know how that turned out.

[Realistic]

Originally Posted by Beninho

Do flames fans join Oilers fan forums? All for intelligent conversations but do these Oiler posters actually come here for conversation or just to spark annoying arguments? Seems to be the latter usually.

Oiler fans aren't the smartest bunch, they actually think that because McJesus signed a 8 year contract extension that he will actually play in Edmonton for those 8 years. I mean, how stupid could you be!

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Realistic

Oiler fans aren't the smartest bunch, they actually think that because McJesus signed a 8 year contract extension that he will actually play in Edmonton for those 8 years. I mean, how stupid could you be!

Who said McDavid wouldn't play in Edmonton for the length of his contract?

I do understand your frustration and willingness to mock this thread. It is supposed to be about pointing out the crazy positions Oilers fans take in regards to their team, but if you wade through a few of the threads on the front page, is this much different than HFOil, except with a Flames bias? That was something that I truly believed Flames fans had an advantage over their Oilers counterparts - being grounded in reality. I don't think that high ground is held by fans of either team at this point.

[dieHARDflameZ]

Originally Posted by Oilers93

The Flames D are a big reason why their tending has been average to poor the last few years. They give up way to many quality chances and have to tighten up in their own end.

Our D is a huge reason why Talbot had the year that he had. Yes, he did his part but at the same time the D made it easy for him a lot of nights. The addition of Larsson was huge.

What a great fiction story that was. The Flames goalies gave up an absurd amount of terrible goals last season while Talbot probably stole you guys 10-15 wins.

I watched a number of Oiler games where you guys were soundly outplayed and often outshot by a nearly 1.5-2 to 1 margin and ended up winning the game solely because of your goalie.

If the Flames got Oiler level goaltending last season we would have won the division soundly. Fact.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Oilers93

The Flames D are a big reason why their tending has been average to poor the last few years. They give up way to many quality chances and have to tighten up in their own end.

Our D is a huge reason why Talbot had the year that he had. Yes, he did his part but at the same time the D made it easy for him a lot of nights. The addition of Larsson was huge.

Only thing I am able to agree with here is that Talbot's overrated. Appreciate you pointing that out.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Strange Brew...

We have talked about this.

I am disappointed.

Working on it. See earlier post.

[MisterJoji]

Originally Posted by Beninho

Do flames fans join Oilers fan forums? All for intelligent conversations but do these Oiler posters actually come here for conversation or just to spark annoying arguments? Seems to be the latter usually.

Venturing over to HF Oilers is pointless. Anyone who tries to engage in a conversation that isn't 100% pure pro-Oilers results in an auto-ban. They come over here, spout some nonsense and then when they are countered with some actual facts they run back to their safe space. They are so fragile.

[Ashasx]

If you post in the ATL thread on HF Oilers to defend the Flames, you get thread banned.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Oilers93

The Flames D are a big reason why their tending has been average to poor the last few years. They give up way to many quality chances and have to tighten up in their own end.

Our D is a huge reason why Talbot had the year that he had. Yes, he did his part but at the same time the D made it easy for him a lot of nights. The addition of Larsson was huge.

As has been pointed out earlier in this thread. The Oilers not only allowed more shots per game then the Flames, but Talbot faced more rebounds and more shots from the danger area.

The Oilers defense was still susceptible to a lot of this guy scored pictures, except Talbot performed miracles.

I mean Larsson is a very good one dimensional defense, Klefbom is pretty good, but I think he's getting over rated. But outside of that, and especially with Sekera gone forever that defense isn't that good. Talbot is your best player behind the blueline and disguise how weak it is. Frankly its a lottery team blueline.

[AlbertaOiler72]

Originally Posted by saXon

Love the Oilers fans coming out of the wood works after 10 years of suckitude, off the back of a single outlier season.

Can't wait to see how many stick around when they realize the acquisition of loser points on a surprise season doesn't equal perennial playoff team. My guess is 0. (maybe Oil Stain)

we had more regulation wins and less regulation losses than the under .500 Flames

[AlbertaOiler72]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

As has been pointed out earlier in this thread. The Oilers not only allowed more shots per game then the Flames, but Talbot faced more rebounds and more shots from the danger area.

The Oilers defense was still susceptible to a lot of this guy scored pictures, except Talbot performed miracles.

I mean Larsson is a very good one dimensional defense, Klefbom is pretty good, but I think he's getting over rated. But outside of that, and especially with Sekera gone forever that defense isn't that good. Talbot is your best player behind the blueline and disguise how weak it is. Frankly its a lottery team blueline.

after years of watching Kiprusoff bail out the Flames, it's a welcome change to see the shoe on the other foot

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by AlbertaOiler72

after years of watching Kiprusoff bail out the Flames, it's a welcome change to see the shoe on the other foot

Well at least we all agree that the oilers ain't winning no cups any time soon, even after being gifted 1st overalls including mcdsvid himself.

Haha poor oilers and their fans.

[MisterJoji]

Originally Posted by Oil Stain

The difference between .907 and .911 (Average) is very small.

I don't think I'm wrong in stating that the Flames netminding was pretty close to average.

I mean they are tied with the St.Louis Blues at .907 and the Blues are in the middle third on that list.

The Oilers were 0.24 goals per game from being in the bottom half of the league. A very small difference. See I can play that too.

Originally Posted by AlbertaOiler72

we finished 8th in the league in GF...how is that "overrated"?
the Flames finished 14 in GA with Gio, Brodie and Hamilton and haven't finished top 5 in GA since the Kipper years

no one is claiming the Oilers have a top 5 offense (although we did finish ahead of the Flames last year)...unlike some Flames fans are saying about their defense (although the Oilers finished ahead of them in that category too)

Talbot's stellar play masked a lot of the Oilers D shortcomings. How many games were thenOilers outshot but still managed to win? The Oilers allowed 62 more shots against than the Oilers did and the Oilers were well below the Flames in CF%. Make no mistake, Talbot is the main reason the Oilers did as well as they did. He's going to remain superb to keep the Oilers afloat.

Originally Posted by Oilers93

The Flames D are a big reason why their tending has been average to poor the last few years. They give up way to many quality chances and have to tighten up in their own end.



Our D is a huge reason why Talbot had the year that he had. Yes, he did his part but at the same time the D made it easy for him a lot of nights. The addition of Larsson was huge.

Lol. Talbot bailed out the D, not the other way around.

Originally Posted by AlbertaOiler72

Sekera replaces Hamonic IMO



and the game isn't played on paper....the Oilers have finished ahead of the Flames in GA the past two seasons despite the Flames having Gio, Brodie and Hamilton on the roster and even adding Hamonic (-21) won't move the needle much...and why will it change?



Oilers have the better goalie, and their young defensemen (Larsson, Klefbom, Benning and Nurse) are under 25 and still getting better and better



The Flames have a nice set of offensive defensemen but are vastly overrated in their defensive abilities and the proof is there.

Benning is a dime a dozen D-man right now and Nurse is projecting to bottom 2 guy.

Gio >> Larsson
Hamilton >> Klefbom
Brodie >>> Sekera
Hamonic > Russell
Stone = Benning
Kulak < Nurse

[saXon]

Originally Posted by AlbertaOiler72

we had more regulation wins and less regulation losses than the under .500 Flames

What does that have anything to do with the Oilers being a perennial playoff team?

[sempuki]

Originally Posted by AlbertaOiler72

we had more regulation wins and less regulation losses than the under .500 Flames

The problem isn't that after 10 years and 4,1st overall picks Edmonton is finally icing an NHL team, the problem is the odious hubris of the fans who pretend the 80's are right around the corner every year and are unashamed about proclaiming it.

Congratulations on being mediocre on the back of a generational talent and an overachieving goaltender. The game is played on ice, not opposing teams message board in the summer.