04-23-2017, 01:55 PM
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#141
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PepsiFree
Really? In 14-15 he was 19th in SV% of all goalies who played 40+ games. He followed it up by being the 9th best goalie in the playoffs.
That's not great. That's underwhelming, especially for a guy who will command 5m+ when you can get a better performance for cheaper.
2 great seasons, 2 underwhelming to bad seasons. The numbers don't lie. I know you're passionate about Bishop, but the evidence of him being a sure thing just isn't there no matter how you look at it. This season wasn't an anomaly. It was part of a trend that should at least give you pause before opening up the pocket book for the guy.
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Yeap, really. He had 40 wins in 14/15
His numbers dropped a bit, but he was still above league average in all categories and again, 40 wins.
Not to mention he carried the Bolts all the way to the Cup finals that year and was a shoe in for the Conn Smythe had they won that series against the Hawks.
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04-23-2017, 02:45 PM
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#142
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#1 Goaltender
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After the last three season, I hope the Flames have learned the lesson that the starting goaltender position is the wrong spot to be thrifty.
Darling, Pickard, and Grubauer are interesting options and could pan out great, but it is going to be really frustrating if the Flames miss the playoffs or have an early exit again next year because they were trying to be overly clever.
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04-23-2017, 03:16 PM
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#143
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Participant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy
Yeap, really. He had 40 wins in 14/15
His numbers dropped a bit, but he was still above league average in all categories and again, 40 wins.
Not to mention he carried the Bolts all the way to the Cup finals that year and was a shoe in for the Conn Smythe had they won that series against the Hawks.
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He was below league average for starters and wins are not an individual feat, he played on a very good Tampa team and, again, was not even amongst the top 5 starters in the playoffs according to individual statistics.
14-15 and 16-17 were not seasons you want from a guy you're paying big money. Being that they represent 2/4 seasons he's played, that certainly calls into question whether he should be considered a "sure thing" at all.
A sure thing for .910 and over, maybe. Not very hard to find.
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04-23-2017, 04:30 PM
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#144
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Franchise Player
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Taking a team to the Finals is exactly what I want from a goalie im paying big money.
3/4 really good seasons and that cant really be sanely disputed.
A 0.916 save % in the reg season and a 0.921 in the playoffs combined with 53 wins is not a sub par season no matter what way you want to spin it.
It wasnt a stellar vezina quality season but he more than got the job done.
If we woild have hsd goaltending like that this season we likely would havd hsd home ice in round 1 and certainly wouldn't have been swept in round 1
Last edited by Roof-Daddy; 04-23-2017 at 04:33 PM.
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04-23-2017, 05:03 PM
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#145
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savvy27
After the last three season, I hope the Flames have learned the lesson that the starting goaltender position is the wrong spot to be thrifty.
Darling, Pickard, and Grubauer are interesting options and could pan out great, but it is going to be really frustrating if the Flames miss the playoffs or have an early exit again next year because they were trying to be overly clever.
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Yeah, and I think we have our own "could pan out solution" in Gillies next year. Darling and Grubauer both played behind elite teams, which has been known to inflate the odd goalie's stats - so I wouldn't want to back either of them as "the guy" in the NHL because it's just another question mark-filled solution. I've no interest in the Colorado goalie.
I want to see a Bishop+Gillies tandem in the NHL next year. Do a 60/22 split, or if Gillies is showing he can handle it - take Bishop down to 55 or so starts to ensure he's ready for the playoffs.
No more question marks. Get an exclamation point.
Last edited by ComixZone; 04-23-2017 at 05:10 PM.
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04-23-2017, 05:07 PM
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#146
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Participant
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy
Taking a team to the Finals is exactly what I want from a goalie im paying big money.
3/4 really good seasons and that cant really be sanely disputed.
A 0.916 save % in the reg season and a 0.921 in the playoffs combined with 53 wins is not a sub par season no matter what way you want to spin it.
It wasnt a stellar vezina quality season but he more than got the job done.
If we woild have hsd goaltending like that this season we likely would havd hsd home ice in round 1 and certainly wouldn't have been swept in round 1
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We'll agree to disagree on Bishop, but good new:. We can get it for 3 million cheaper with Scott Darling.
He just put up two (great?) seasons playing 30 games each. Poised to take a starter role, and similar numbers to Bishop at half the price.
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04-23-2017, 05:10 PM
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#147
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Bennett - Jankowski - Versteeg
Bouma - Stajan - Hathaway
Gio - Hamilton
Brodie - Stone
Kulikov - Andersson
Darling
Johnson
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04-23-2017, 05:11 PM
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#148
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Resident Videologist
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PepsiFree
We'll agree to disagree on Bishop, but good new:. We can get it for 3 million cheaper with Scott Darling.
He just put up two (great?) seasons playing 30 games each. Poised to take a starter role, and similar numbers to Bishop at half the price.
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I don't think the Flames management can afford to start next season without a proven #1.
Really don't see us going with a tandem or a "hopeful" #1. It'll be Bishop or Fleury IMO, sink or swim.
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04-23-2017, 05:20 PM
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#149
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Chicago
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiggy
Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Bennett - Jankowski - Versteeg
Bouma - Stajan - Hathaway
Gio - Hamilton
Brodie - Stone
Kulikov - Andersson
Darling
Johnson
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This illustrates how necessary it is to get a top RW. Ferland is a very long ways from the first line of any good team.
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04-23-2017, 05:22 PM
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#150
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#1 Goaltender
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Since when is 40ish games a starter ? A proven starter is a guy who can play 60+ a year and put up consistent numbers. Guys like Darling and Grubauer get the weaker teams like most back ups. So their stats will be inflated especially playing on elite teams. Bishops 60 games against the top completion is different then 30 of weak teams.
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04-23-2017, 06:05 PM
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#151
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Crash and Bang Winger
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Moose Jaw, SK
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Gaudreau - Monahan - Oshie
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Jankowski - Bennett - Ferland
Bouma - Stajan - Hathaway
Gio - Hamilton
Brodie - Stone
Engelland - Andersson
Pickard
Johnson
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04-23-2017, 07:05 PM
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#152
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Money Baer
Gaudreau - Monahan - Oshie
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Jankowski - Bennett - Ferland
Bouma - Stajan - Hathaway
Gio - Hamilton
Brodie - Stone
Engelland - Andersson
Pickard
Johnson
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We won't make the playoffs with a Pickard/Johnson tandem. That's very weak. There is a weird amount of love for Pickard going on. He is not another Talbot. Nothing about his numbers are impressive, and I'm not even sure where the love started. I watched a lot of Avs games down the stretch (...was watching Iggy to see how he was doing), and Pickard isn't good. It also sounds like the Avs aren't even protecting him in the expansion draft.
Are people blind to what even mediocre goaltending does to teams? Look at Dallas.
Last edited by ComixZone; 04-23-2017 at 07:10 PM.
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04-23-2017, 07:20 PM
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#153
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Franchise Player
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Pickard I'm willing to give a break, that was a historically bad Avs team he had to back stop for this year. Hopefully they haven't ruined him.
His first two years in the league he had great numbers as a back up. His quality start % was around .650 with a save percentage in mid .920's on 26 starts.
Seeing as he's still under contract for $1,000,000 and going to be exposed in the expansion draft, I would love it if Tre could snap him up for cheap if Vegas takes him and have him be our back up next season behind Bishop (if signed). Give Gillies more time to develop playing tons of games in Stockton. Then if Pickard has a solid bounce back season he can maybe be flipped for more than Tre paid for him.
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04-23-2017, 07:24 PM
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#154
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Lifetime Suspension
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Can't wait to see what Treliving does this year (barring he comes back), he seems to have a knack for making those unexpected exciting moves around the draft every year.
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04-24-2017, 11:18 AM
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#155
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Franchise Player
Join Date: May 2016
Location: ATCO Field, Section 201
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I do not want the Flames the sign an forward in free agency. The price to delivery ratio is not good enough for them to take the risk.
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04-24-2017, 11:33 AM
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#156
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden
I do not want the Flames the sign an forward in free agency. The price to delivery ratio is not good enough for them to take the risk.
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Usually I agree but Oshie on a 4 year contract I would make an exception for.
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04-24-2017, 11:36 AM
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#157
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Franchise Player
Join Date: May 2016
Location: ATCO Field, Section 201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJones
Usually I agree but Oshie on a 4 year contract I would make an exception for.
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Sure, but that wont happen.
UFA contracts for proven producers are always over priced. Besides the Flames will have to pay two goalies and two defencemen. A forward is out of the question.
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04-24-2017, 11:37 AM
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#158
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden
Sure, but that wont happen.
UFA contracts for proven producers are always over priced. Besides the Flames will have to pay two goalies and two defencemen. A forward is out of the question.
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Jankowski or Tkachuk being able to play RW would solve a lot of problems.
Otherwise can we risk another slow start if we have a huge hole on the right side?
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04-24-2017, 12:05 PM
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#159
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#1 Goaltender
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I'd actually be a fan of signing a mediocre goalie for one year and holding out for hope of getting Price as a UFA. It turns the flames into Stanley Cup favorites and the Habs window is closing (not good enough!)
And it could fit under the cap
Out ($18m; 7 players): Engelland, Stajan, Bouma, Elliott, Wideman, Johnson, Jokipakka
In ($18m; 7 players): Stone (4m), Price (9m), Andersson (1m), Kylington (1m), Jankowski (1.5), Hathaway (1m), Generic backup goalie (1m)
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04-24-2017, 12:09 PM
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#160
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GullFoss
I'd actually be a fan of signing a mediocre goalie for one year and holding out for hope of getting Price as a UFA. It turns the flames into Stanley Cup favorites and the Habs window is closing (not good enough!)
And it could fit under the cap
Out ($18m; 7 players): Engelland, Stajan, Bouma, Elliott, Wideman, Johnson, Jokipakka
In ($18m; 7 players): Stone (4m), Price (9m), Andersson (1m), Kylington (1m), Jankowski (1.5), Hathaway (1m), Generic backup goalie (1m)
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Absolutely cannot gamble away another season in the long shot hope that Price will go UFA in 14 months.
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