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Old 03-19-2017, 11:25 PM   #4661
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I was going to make an argument based from narrative and imagination, but I see that you know the technical side 2000x better than I do, so I concede the argument.
I could see it from an imagination perspective, as there is a bit of a "everything that's done has been done before" element to a lot of games.

Narrative though is a lot more in-depth, and a lot more common. That's not to say all games now tell a better story, but it's more likely that the story is deeper and that more games have one.

It would've been a fair argument to make either way, had you made it. But the technical side is just a given (and in the end, is a big part of it).
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Old 03-20-2017, 12:31 AM   #4662
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I just cancelled every game I had pre-ordered except for South Park (digital, so I can't) and Red Dead Redemption (because Rockstar has earned it). But pretty much every other developer doesn't get that benefit of the doubt anymore (a couple exception, because Naughty Dog). Unless it's from one of those handful of studios that I trust, I'm waiting for reviews on everything from now on. Should have done this a long time ago, but better late than never I guess?
Just out of curiosity, what is the benefit in pre-ordering other than guaranteeing a copy on release? Do you get a discount or free DLC?

I've never had a problem finding a game I've wanted to buy in stock and now that you can download games that doesn't matter anyways. With all the games that don't live up to the hype it seems pretty risky to pre-order.
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Old 03-20-2017, 01:02 AM   #4663
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If everyone was cheap like you and only bought games when they drop to $20-$30 you would see no AAA games being made anymore.
Except I don't wait for them to drop. I wait for them to be bug free. Why would I waste money on a game before it gets fixed. While most games will get patched eventually, some won't.

Like wise, if there is launch day DLC I will either A: never buy your game because that is horse #### or B: wait for that to be reduced. Too many people have let companies like EA get away with this bull #### practice and it just doesn't fly with me.


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I'm not sure what you mean, do you even know? It doesn't seem like it. I'm telling you the actual fact of the matter from a software development perspective. That's the unfortunate reality about the game development process now. Developing games is more expensive but it's known, optically, people are more willing to pay separately for parts of the game, so we include the minimum acceptable product as the base model (without DLC).
I understand that things will cost more and that as things become more technical they aren't going to get cheaper, but we're being burned at both ends. We're paying more for the base game while also still getting tagged with launch day DLC that clearly should have been part of the main game. Some are more blatant and horse #### than others (the party member from ME 3 or getting a proper ####ing ending).


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Sometimes that product alone is great, sometimes it's lacking. That comes down to the capability and cost of the development team. A lot of times certain DLC is to be included in the original roadmap, but when you're plenty of sprints in and problems are mounting or you're falling behind, you look for elements that can be removed and added later as DLC. Sometimes free, other times not (since either way you have to spend extra time developing that still).
I have NO issues with something being cut from the main game because it wasn't working. I would rather a product come out and run smoothly than being forced through. I would take some issue with being charged for that DLC if it was a promised feature, but if not then how would I ever even know.

The practice I despise is the launch day DLC that contains key parts of the story or key characters.

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Some DLC is, obviously, designed to continue user engagement and developed after the fact (and planned as such from the start) but that's not true of all DLC. Patches are worse, nobody should complain about a patch. The time between the final deliverable and your release date is long enough that you can develop a day 1 patch to fix some lingering issues. I'm sure almost every gamer would rather download a day 1 patch than have a game they're excited about be delayed by weeks.
If a day one patch is needed, I will never complain. There are some things that don't get caught until after things have gone to press, as it were. What I dislike is games that are blatantly incomplete. But in that case, I just won't buy it until it's fixed. But if I am then charged again to get that fix, and get that complete game, sorry I won't buy it. It is a horse#### business practice.
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Old 03-20-2017, 01:40 AM   #4664
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Just out of curiosity, what is the benefit in pre-ordering other than guaranteeing a copy on release? Do you get a discount or free DLC?
Yes, you can get 20-30% off if you pre-order during E3 and most games offer some form of free DLC. I used to pre-order alot but I've since cut back with games now being $80 retail. It's just ends up adding up to way too much even after the discount for me to afford.

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Old 03-20-2017, 03:05 AM   #4665
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Mass Effect Andromeda reviews are out and it's not good. Bugs seem to be the biggest issue.
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:47 AM   #4666
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Originally Posted by FireGilbert View Post
Just out of curiosity, what is the benefit in pre-ordering other than guaranteeing a copy on release? Do you get a discount or free DLC?

I've never had a problem finding a game I've wanted to buy in stock and now that you can download games that doesn't matter anyways. With all the games that don't live up to the hype it seems pretty risky to pre-order.
Pre-order versions usually come with DLC, bonus codes (items, benefits), and sometimes different packaging/items. Also, pre-orders are cheaper through some services like Amazon Prime which saves about 15-20% off the eventual retail price.

The only game I have ever pre-ordered in my life was Yakuza 0 Business Edition because it was already a 4 year old game (released in Japan). I don't see myself pre-ordering anything else because you know that eventually a GOTY edition or complete edition or something will come out bundling all the DLC and expansions together for like half the price.
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:48 AM   #4667
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Yes, you can get 20-30% off if you pre-order during E3 and most games offer some form of free DLC. I used to pre-order alot but I've since cut back with games now being $80 retail. It's just ends up adding up to way too much even after the discount for me to afford.
Those 20% discounts are available without preordering for up to two weeks after release if you have Amazon Prime. That was my biggest reason for doing it.

Now the only benefit for me is really collector's editions, and I rarely get those anymore.
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:04 AM   #4668
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Those 20% discounts are available without preordering for up to two weeks after release if you have Amazon Prime. That was my biggest reason for doing it.
Yeah, I mean for anyone who doesn't want to subscribe to Amazon Prime. I don't order from them enough to make it worth it.
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:31 AM   #4669
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Mass Effect Andromeda reviews are out and it's not good. Bugs seem to be the biggest issue.
Oh yeah, I forgot that in the Year of our Lord 2017, 75 average is not good...
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Old 03-20-2017, 12:03 PM   #4670
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Oh yeah, I forgot that in the Year of our Lord 2017, 75 average is not good...
Maybe not "not good", but considering the series' pedigree, it's definitely a disappointment.
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Old 03-20-2017, 12:15 PM   #4671
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Maybe not "not good", but considering the series' pedigree, it's definitely a disappointment.
I don't disagree at all on that. It's more a general comment about review scores, haha. I'm totally ready to play this game as a huge Mass Effect fan, but I'm also keeping expectations low going in.
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Old 03-20-2017, 12:19 PM   #4672
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I don't disagree at all on that. It's more a general comment about review scores, haha. I'm totally ready to play this game as a huge Mass Effect fan, but I'm also keeping expectations low going in.
Oh yeah it is quite silly, really. The ten point video game review scale is basically:

0-5.9: Bad, don't even bother

6-6.9: Below average

7-7.9: Average

8-8.9: Good

9-9.5: Great

9.6-10: Excellent
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Old 03-20-2017, 01:12 PM   #4673
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It's just like a grade scale you'd get at school. 65% or something like a C is average, etc. It's the way it is for video games, and it's pretty easy to understand at this point.
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Old 03-20-2017, 02:17 PM   #4674
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Doom was 50% off on Steam, pulled the trigger on that. Can't wait to try it out tonight.

68Gig file! My God game files are getting enormous.
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Old 03-20-2017, 08:08 PM   #4675
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:46 AM   #4676
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Probably going to be limited as hell (as always).



Up right now at Gamestop.COM - nothing in Canada that I've seen.
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:57 AM   #4677
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Old 03-21-2017, 08:59 AM   #4678
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One of many who is too boring; thinks that there should be rules regarding grammar in custom user titles, and also makes moderators wonder if there is a charachter limit here. I mean come on- you would think that would be a limitation in the software
 
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Though, that chaser text implies a remake rather than a sequel. Don't care, still buying as soon as it's released in English.
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Old 03-21-2017, 09:09 AM   #4679
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Civ V still holds up. Last night there were actually more players online playing Civ V than VI.

I think I have about 90/280 achievements for Civ V, so once I get em all I'll buy Civ VI haha. NOT.

Maybe we should start a CP steam group.
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Old 03-21-2017, 12:12 PM   #4680
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This is just not true.
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It's 100% true.

But I'm vaguely interested in your argument, so go on.
Games today are certainly more graphically intensive. And much more effort is put into making them present narratives like movies do, which takes a lot of money. However, I wouldn't say they're bigger and more intricate in scope or gameplay.

On the RPG front, games like Ultima: Underworld and Elder Scrolls: Morrowind were massive, with hundreds of hours of exploration and gameplay. Just as big as Skyrim or Dragon Age Inquisition.

No doubt Prey will look fantastic. Will it offer more exploration and content than System Shock 2? Doubtful.

RTS is almost dead as a genre, but recent outings aren't any grander or more intricate than Rise of Nations.

When it comes to strategy games, Paradox have streamlined the Europa Universalis games and dramatically improved the UI, but EU IV is no bigger in scope or complexity than EU I. Same with the Total War games.

Even shooters aren't necessarily bigger and more complex. How big and complex are the levels in the re-booted Doom compared to the original or Doom 2?
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