2016-17 Toronto Raptors and General NBA Thread

[OzSome]

I like this trade. I am not big fan of Terrence Ross so losing him in this trade doesn't really affect me. I think Ross can be a good player if he thinks the game. Ibaka is a tall guy and good defender.

[Jason14h]

This game could get Casey fired ... This team has quit

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

This game could get Casey fired ... This team has quit

Amazing how narratives can change in just a few minutes (not that you were necessarily wrong)

[TheAlpineOracle]

Lowry just killed that run with a 3 point shot from almost half court after an offensive rebound and 22 seconds left on the shot clock. What an idiot.

Only been watching for the past 10 minutes in the Alumni Lounge before the Flames game, but damn does Deleon Wright look good in that small time
Period.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Ever since then though Lowry has been making smart plays.

[Jason14h]

I walk to thr flames game from the pub and Charlotte doesn't get a basket !

[octothorp]

Raptors have coaching problems but I credit Casey with letting this lineup play out this quarter.

[Senator Clay Davis]

That's one of the things I really like about Casey is he won't just break up a good lineup. A lot of other coaches would have forced DeMar back into that game because he's the "star" and thus has to play crunch time. That lineup was rolling on defense and doing surprisingly well on offense. If there's one big upgrade using Poeltl in the pick and roll instead of JV or Bebe, it's that he is a much better passer.

[St. Pats]

Wonder if MU has the cajones to trade DD? Saw a deal that works salary wise where he goes for Gallo and Jamal Murray as an example. Sell high. JV and Joseph can go as well.

[kmart]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

That's one of the things I really like about Casey is he won't just break up a good lineup. A lot of other coaches would have forced DeMar back into that game because he's the "star" and thus has to play crunch time. That lineup was rolling on defense and doing surprisingly well on offense. If there's one big upgrade using Poeltl in the pick and roll instead of JV or Bebe, it's that he is a much better passer.

Bebe isn't a bad passer if anything he is too pass happy. I thought the difference was Poeltl being able to cover the Frank Kaminsky - Kemba Walker pick and roll. I thought he was the difference defensively. Dude played awesome with Delon Wright.

The thing that sucks for Casey is that you can tell Valancuinas isn't his type of guy, yet he has to play him a lot to cover for the lack of bigs on this team. This team is much better defensively without Valancuinas. The 17 point Charlotte lead began with Kemba Walker abusing Valancuinas on 3 pointers off picks, JV simply doesn't move fast enough to cover the ball handler on shots off the pick. It's scary when a quick point guard comes downhill on Valancuinas.

I don't really care about the offence, I feel like it'll come. The defence with JV on the floor is what concerns me more than anything.

[St. Pats]

Originally Posted by kmart

Bebe isn't a bad passer if anything he is too pass happy. I thought the difference was Poeltl being able to cover the Frank Kaminsky - Kemba Walker pick and roll. I thought he was the difference defensively. Dude played awesome with Delon Wright.

The thing that sucks for Casey is that you can tell Valancuinas isn't his type of guy, yet he has to play him a lot to cover for the lack of bigs on this team. This team is much better defensively without Valancuinas. The 17 point Charlotte lead began with Kemba Walker abusing Valancuinas on 3 pointers off picks, JV simply doesn't move fast enough to cover the ball handler on shots off the pick. It's scary when a quick point guard comes downhill on Valancuinas.

I don't really care about the offence, I feel like it'll come. The defence with JV on the floor is what concerns me more than anything.

The best offensive big is Val and the team is better defensively without him. The best scoring player is DD and the team is better defensively without him. Lowry ain't no defensive superstar either.

They bring in DC to help on the defensive end and up until recently he looks like half the player he was in Atlanta. Then their is PF where with Patterson either injured or not shooting well they were basically playing four on five.

Can they put out a unit that can play really well defensively? Wright, Powell, DC, and Patterson at the four and Ibaka at the five could give you that. I'd be throwing that lineup on the floor a lot in the playoffs.

Plus I'd be looking at anything else that could strengthen the lineup. Tucker, Barnes, Gallo, Chandler(either one). Either vet toughness and defense or another shooter.

[kmart]

Originally Posted by St. Pats

The best offensive big is Val and the team is better defensively without him. The best scoring player is DD and the team is better defensively without him. Lowry ain't no defensive superstar either.

They bring in DC to help on the defensive end and up until recently he looks like half the player he was in Atlanta. Then their is PF where with Patterson either injured or not shooting well they were basically playing four on five.

Can they put out a unit that can play really well defensively? Wright, Powell, DC, and Patterson at the four and Ibaka at the five could give you that. I'd be throwing that lineup on the floor a lot in the playoffs.

Plus I'd be looking at anything else that could strengthen the lineup. Tucker, Barnes, Gallo, Chandler(either one). Either vet toughness and defense or another shooter.

I think Lowry can be a good defender. He can stay in front of his man. The problem is that the offensive burden with the defensive responsibilities can be taxing on a player.

As for DeMar, you put him on the worst offensive player on the other team and you can live with that. This team struggles enough scoring without Derozan. Have you not seen the offence lately without him?

With Valancuinas, you can't hide him. The amount of pick and rolls that offences have these days requires a mobile big man, its just something he isn't and will never be. I'd argue that he's not great offensively either, very roboctic with his movements and when he gets a double team he struggles with making the right basketball play.

[octothorp]

Originally Posted by St. Pats

Can they put out a unit that can play really well defensively? Wright, Powell, DC, and Patterson at the four and Ibaka at the five could give you that. I'd be throwing that lineup on the floor a lot in the playoffs.

Casey's become pretty experimental in his lineups, but he seems to prioritize ball-handling (part of the minimal-turnover philosophy behind this team's offense). Right now I'm not sure he'll use Wright a lot as the only real ball-handler in a lineup... just like VanVleet: other than pure garbage-time minutes, he's almost always been on the floor with Lowry or Joseph. I think Ibaka, Carroll/Patterson, Powell, Wright, Lowry/Joseph are more likely versions of this lineup.

[St. Pats]

Originally Posted by kmart

I think Lowry can be a good defender. He can stay in front of his man. The problem is that the offensive burden with the defensive responsibilities can be taxing on a player.

As for DeMar, you put him on the worst offensive player on the other team and you can live with that. This team struggles enough scoring without Derozan. Have you not seen the offence lately without him?

With Valancuinas, you can't hide him. The amount of pick and rolls that offences have these days requires a mobile big man, its just something he isn't and will never be. I'd argue that he's not great offensively either, very roboctic with his movements and when he gets a double team he struggles with making the right basketball play.

You can't hide DD - he is beyond useless on D / a net negative player despite all the points.

http://www.raptorsrepublic.com/2016/...g-gap-offense/

The link is to an article from when he was scoring at his best this year and still a net negative. They are better when he isn't on the floor.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by St. Pats

Can they put out a unit that can play really well defensively? Wright, Powell, DC, and Patterson at the four and Ibaka at the five could give you that. I'd be throwing that lineup on the floor a lot in the playoffs.

Define "a lot". If this lineup plays more than 20% of the minutes, the Raps are likely getting swept. This is the NBA after all, and this is the NBA in it's highest scoring season ever. This lineup is a trainwreck offensively, even if it's really good defensively. Holding teams to 20 a quarter is nice, but meaningless when you can only muster 16 points yourself. Like it or not, they need DeMar's offense out there. Harden and Isaiah Thomas are even worse defensive sieves than DeMar, but they aren't going anywhere. If you want to mitigate the defensive issues, probably best to manage timeouts well so you can make lots of offense/defense subs late in games.

[St. Pats]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Define "a lot". If this lineup plays more than 20% of the minutes, the Raps are likely getting swept. This is the NBA after all, and this is the NBA in it's highest scoring season ever. This lineup is a trainwreck offensively, even if it's really good defensively. Holding teams to 20 a quarter is nice, but meaningless when you can only muster 16 points yourself. Like it or not, they need DeMar's offense out there. Harden and Isaiah Thomas are even worse defensive sieves than DeMar, but they aren't going anywhere. If you want to mitigate the defensive issues, probably best to manage timeouts well so you can make lots of offense/defense subs late in games.

I think if Casey is smart he puts Lowry in with that unit for offense. DD as a sixth man makes the most sense. He provides absolutely nothing but offense. He shouldn't be on the floor in the clutch. Ditto JV / bring him in for offense but if either of them aren't scoring let them sit.

[killer_carlson]

Disagree.

You know what you're getting with DD and KL. No passes in the 4th quarter unless they are driving, in the air, off balance and about to get blocked.

With JV he's a classic case of a player whose intensity picks up when he sees the ball occasionally on offence. Run some plays for the guy and watch him be more engaged defensively.

i'm much more interested in the Raptors for having gotten rid of Ross. That they added a guy like Ibaka puts this team with a complete different character.

The role players - PP, Sullinger, Joseph, Powell, Carrol - have to be more physical and better defensively.

This team could really use a veteran presence like Nesteravic brought a few years back. A veteran big, with a winning pedigree, professional. Knew he was going to see limited minutes so he used all his fouls and set a tone.

[kmart]

Anyone can be engaged on defence, even DeMar played good defence on Lebron at one point last year. The problem with Valancuinas is his quickness. He is way too slow to cover Kyrie, Kemba, John Wall, or Isaiah Thomas on a pick and roll. All teams do is run a simple pick and roll against JV and they end up with easier points more times than not.

As for Derozan, he has his faults highlighted in those videos. However, its not like the Sacremento Kings run offence through Matt Barnes and thats what I mean when I say that you can hide him as long as he is in the right position. With Lowry and JV they have to be above average and simply put JV is too slow to be below average.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by St. Pats

I think if Casey is smart he puts Lowry in with that unit for offense. DD as a sixth man makes the most sense. He provides absolutely nothing but offense. He shouldn't be on the floor in the clutch. Ditto JV / bring him in for offense but if either of them aren't scoring let them sit.

This is why as I said if you manage timeouts, you can do all the offense/defense end of game subs you'd like. But straight up not having the guy who's sixth in the league in free throw attempts per game on the floor at the end of the game is....yeah. The other night was nice, but it was Charlotte, they of a 24-32 record. Expecting that strategy to work against actual playoff teams and the top 4-5 other teams in the East is wishful thinking. Casey has shown if a lineup is rolling, he'll stick with it. So if we see situations like that, we know he's not gonna force DeMar back in. Actively looking to keep DeMar out is pretty much asking to lose. Lowry as the only offensive option means primarily terrible, step back, fadeaway threes as the "offense". That's not winning either.

[Calgary14]

Just watched the Russell Westbrook post all star game interview. Lots of awkward giggling, ignoring reporters and dodging questions. That guy is pure class.

What exactly happened between him and KD? I get they used to be teammates and then KD went to Golden State to try and win a championship. Why is Westbrook so upset about that? Happens quite often. The guy had an opportunity to sign with a winning team and he took it. What did he expect, a bouquet of flowers and a sorry note? Unless there's something I'm missing?