07-25-2017, 11:57 AM
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#1
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Backup Goalie
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Depths of the C of Red
Exp:
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Petronas - Pacific Northwest LNG project officially scrapped
Not sure if this fit better in one of the political threads, but Petronas' $12B project has officially been scrapped:
Quote:
"We are disappointed that the extremely challenging environment brought about by the prolonged depressed prices and shifts in the energy industry have led us to this decision," Anuar Taib, Chairman of the Pacific Northwest LNG Board, said in a statement.
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http://www.bnn.ca/pacific-northwest-...ronas-1.813258
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07-25-2017, 12:03 PM
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#2
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Franchise Player
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We were far too many years behind our competition in this game, so not surprising - Federal and provincial politics really didn't help the situation.
Silly too because now you're seeing less LNG in Asia and that was going to be replacing dirty coal. Environmentalists think this is a win, but its a pretty big loss.
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07-25-2017, 12:15 PM
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#3
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Crash and Bang Winger
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducay
We were far too many years behind our competition in this game, so not surprising - Federal and provincial politics really didn't help the situation.
Silly too because now you're seeing less LNG in Asia and that was going to be replacing dirty coal. Environmentalists think this is a win, but its a pretty big loss.
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Completely agree. I don't know why Canada panders to the environmentalist movement so significantly. We've missed the trend completely. If it's not us, it's someone else who might not be extracting it as responsibly...
American LNG exports
It only shows up to 2016 - but the trend is significant.
American Natural Gas Production
That last run-up wasn't under trump, it was under Obama. It's clear that the United States was taking a balanced approach to the renewable shift - now its a free for all...
We should have been able to be balanced too
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07-25-2017, 12:38 PM
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#4
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badabing
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Might end up spilling over into the layoffs thread....
Wonder what this means for Progress Energy? Without the project Petronas arguably no longer needs (may want?) to own them.
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07-25-2017, 12:43 PM
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#5
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Crash and Bang Winger
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lubicon
Might end up spilling over into the layoffs thread....
Wonder what this means for Progress Energy? Without the project Petronas arguably no longer needs (may want?) to own them.
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It does say that they are planning to continue to developing their Montney... I mean they have a 1000+ wells in it already I believe... I guess that's why they were also looking for easterly off take solution recently.
They're at the end of the pipe, so they're at the mercy of the differential, but still it's probably bad news for some of the more pure gas players like Peyto. I think we'll start seeing some more downward pressure on natural gas prices.
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07-25-2017, 12:52 PM
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#6
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: 555 Saddledome Rise SE
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Ok, I can somewhat see BC's case against Alberta transporting its crude through their province and off their coastline for mostly our profit, even if I think they got played by US oil interests funding the whole campaign.
However the fact that BC couldn't get an LNG plant built to monetize their own trillions of cubic feet of gas, a product which simply evaporates in the case of a tanker "spill", goes to show just how hard they and we all got played by the US.
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07-25-2017, 03:01 PM
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#7
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tromboner
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: where the lattes are
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Thanks NDP!
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07-25-2017, 09:39 PM
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#8
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On Hiatus
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Calgary Alberta Canada
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They are building pipelines in the states like there so no tomorrow for everything they are building would be nice if that same mentality would have worked here
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07-25-2017, 09:43 PM
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#9
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Kelowna
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Well that just really sucks....
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07-26-2017, 10:23 AM
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#10
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Victoria
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Not sure we can really lay this at the feet of the government. Clark was a pretty huge proponent of the plan. Sounds like the company shut it down because of the deflated price of oil.
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07-26-2017, 10:25 AM
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#11
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Franchise Player
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Given that it was an LNG plant that seems unlikely.
Realistically there were a number of factors, you're right though that the BC government was not the biggest issue. Still, LNG development in this country has to be considered among the biggest missed opportunities of the past two decades.
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07-26-2017, 10:27 AM
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#12
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Victoria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague
Given that it was an LNG plant that seems unlikely.
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That was the statement they gave to the media according to the radio station I was listening to on the drive to work.
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07-26-2017, 10:30 AM
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#13
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Franchise Player
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I was just being snarky. Obviously LNG prices are linked to oil prices.
It's been pretty annoying to read ignorant comments from people who think this sort of development is good for the environment. Yeah thanks guys, something like 80% of global LNG demand is in Asia. Definitely a huge win for the environmental lobby for China to stick with coal. Good call there.
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"The great promise of the Internet was that more information would automatically yield better decisions. The great disappointment is that more information actually yields more possibilities to confirm what you already believed anyway." - Brian Eno
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07-26-2017, 10:31 AM
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#14
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Victoria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague
I was just being snarky. Obviously LNG prices are linked to oil prices.
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Fair. I decided to watch baseball until 12:30 AM last night so my mind isn't super sharp today.
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07-26-2017, 11:07 AM
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#15
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: 555 Saddledome Rise SE
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This decision today is entirely about depressed LNG prices in Asia compared to the ~$10+ differential with NA gas prices which existed years ago. Basically, the arb is gone. The reason that diff has closed is because the US has built a bunch of LNG infrastructure to increase supply and bring the price down. Probably doesn't help that Japan, the world's largest consumer of LNG, is starting to turn nuclear plants back on.
Basically, BC screwed themselves by doddling along trying to appease everyone while the US ate their lunch. And the people they were trying to appease could only afford their loud platform because they were funded by those exact US interests.
You got played, BC. And it'll cost you billions. Stop fighting over which provincial party to blame and look in the mirror. *slow clap*
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07-26-2017, 11:27 AM
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#16
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Normally, my desk
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It's really too bad. Timing could have been really good for Petronas. Right now, a bunch of of new projects are just coming on stream so we'll have an LNG surplus for a while. However, by 2025 the pendulum could swing.
You can find other forecasts which say the same as this (page 13);
Presentation
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07-26-2017, 11:32 AM
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#17
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: BELTLINE
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Violator
They are building pipelines in the states like there so no tomorrow for everything they are building would be nice if that same mentality would have worked here
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It won't though. The US and Australia snapped all the LNG market share that could've been ours because culturally, they're a lot more cut throat and will push through projects that are good for the country.
Meanwhile, in Boy Scout Nation, there were half a dozen years of consultations and redundant red tape that almost single handedly killed a project that should've been a slam dunk. And now we as citizens are all poorer for it.
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07-26-2017, 11:43 AM
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#18
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First Line Centre
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As someone who did a little work on the PNW proposal this is very disappointing. While it's true the gas prices played a big part in this, the other important factors in this decision were the environmental issues around the fish habitat and the very loud, confrontational and sometimes violent local First Nations protests.
Hopefully some collective heads get pulled out of some collective asses and LNG Canada will go forward.
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07-26-2017, 12:19 PM
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#19
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Had an idea!
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One would think that there is expected demand for LNG down the road with so many coal plants coming offline.
Even in Manitoba/Ontario there will be a bigger push for more natural gas expansion as hydro rates are slowly rising. In Ontario they would love to have natural gas put in.
I know in Manitoba natural gas is seriously being considered by a lot of big players. The only thing holding them back is the fact that propane prices are decent right now.
Coal is out of the question & hydro is too expensive. Natural gas is the next best option.
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07-26-2017, 12:23 PM
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#20
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Victoria
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Brad Wall is such a disingenuous piece of garbage.
https://www.facebook.com/PremierBradWall/
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